Velocars and other interesting vehicles.

[moto-klasika]

... quite simple and elegant solution! Couldn't see any brakes? Could it be safe on terrible speeds of 25 km/hour?

But, if Bertha Benz could drive Benz Patent-Motorwagen Number 3 of 1888, on long distance road trip of 106 km (66 miles) over moody roads... then, everything is possible with much simpler "automobile"!
Zoran

 

[fasteddy]

Zoran,

There are brakes at least on the front wheel.

Steve.

 

[moto-klasika]

Thank you Steve,
I was so impressed with general style, that didn't pay attention on such important details. Rear wheels could be braked somewhere on transmission?
Could electric-motor be used as brake if switch to revers while driving forward?
Zoran

​

(working entire life for industrial companies with good workshops - but only as corporation lawyer; what I once could lear for a month - now I could forget for a week)

 

[fasteddy]

With the electric motor it's 2,710 Euros or $3,150 U.S. plus shipping. A pretty easy build for the home builder I would think. Golden Motors is one company that had the electric drive parts.

Steve.

 

[curtisfox]

Steve if your realy thinking about it i have some prebent 1" bus seat tubing you could use for the arm rest and the like...................Curt

 

[fasteddy]

Zoran,

I agree with you on the look and style. I would have a simple differential axle like the riding lawn mowers have for the rear end and you can put a brake disc on the other side of the gears with the drive sprocket on the other side.
That should stop the trike very quickly as fast as the trike could go safely.

It should be a fairly inexpensive build even if you were to have someone do the welding. I was looking at the way they set up the steering with the cable and was wondering where you could get one and then realized that it looked like the cables that are used to steer small boats by moving the engine from side to side.
Steering for the Sociable may well have been solved.

I have to stop thinking about it. I just went out to the garage and measured how much steel tubing I had and the tri car said "Don't even think about it" or maybe it was my brother.

Steve.

 

[fasteddy]

Hi Curt,

Thank you for the offers of parts but at the moment I can't do anything but think about it. I have to finish the tri car as yet and my brother wants a small electric and pedal powered car so he can make runs to the store and I'm planning on building a skiff styled body. Should those two miracles happen I would love to do a sociable sidecar.

After that the world is mine.

Steve.

 

[Intrepid Wheelwoman]

I think the steering is rod operated Steve.
That little Benz type trike is lovely and as you say it would make a great mobility scooter. I have a geared 350watt 24volt motor stashed away somewhere which would be perfect for the job. I wonder where I could get a nice big flywheel from........?

http://videos.howstuffworks.com/discovery/31670-massive-engines-benz-tricycle-video.htm

That wee Valor stove is now mine (mine mine mine!!).
After the recent discussion over Stirling engines I think I will dummy up a Stirling engine-like assembly rather than a steam engine as it will be likely to get me into less trouble. Steam engines need boiler certificates and I'd likely to be asked for my Boiler Attendant's ticket as well if stopped by the local constabulary. And if I had to confess that it was just a dummy setup I might get hauled away in chains for wasting Police time

BUT with a Stirling engine (which of course isn't known for going BANG if misused) I should be fine If I did eventually make a proper Stirling engine it could be used to charge batteries and being an external combustion engine and not an IC engine I should be able to run it when I pleased.

 

[fasteddy]

Hi Anne,

Your absolutely right it it rod operated steering. Silverbears houseboat steering is now safe from prying hack saws this summer.

Congratulations on getting your stove. A mocked up Stirling engine would be easier and a lot easier to explain to those in control of such things.
A 350W geared electric motor with 24 volts. Perfect choice at The Bee's Knees Manufacturing.

Steve.

 

[Ludwig II]

Stirling engine. Complete with author i.d. with an NZ in it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKhSPYRzb9M

 

[Intrepid Wheelwoman]

I have to stop thinking about it. I just went out to the garage and measured how much steel tubing I had and the tri car said "Don't even think about it" or maybe it was my brother.

That really made me laugh Steve
Don't worry I'm just as bad with coming up with bright ideas all the time

Seeing this photo made me realise that every intrepid wheelwoman should have devoted staff to assist at a moment's notice. I shall place a small advert in the newspaper, - a shilling a day and they must wear a 'flat hat', - I think that should do it.

 

[fasteddy]

That isn't asking to much I don't think Anne. As long as they are poised for action as these two lads are. I enjoyed the confident look on the Intrepid Wheelwoman at the steering.

As I've said a few times that I'd need a lottery win and to live to 110 in perfect health to get all the ideas accomplished.

Steve.

 

[fasteddy]

Ludwig,

Thank you once again. I wonder how big an engine a person would need to power a motorbike at 35km or about 33mph. You stand around a motorbike or motorcycle meet and talk knowledgeably about the mileage you get from a bag of wood pellets and few could argue the point with you.

Steve.

 

[Intrepid Wheelwoman]

Congratulations on getting your stove. A mocked up Stirling engine would be easier and a lot easier to explain to those in control of such things.
A 350W geared electric motor with 24 volts. Perfect choice at The Bee's Knees Manufacturing.

Yes I'm very pleased with my little stove Steve, - it should work just fine for heating up a Stirling engine. But that wood chip burning Stirling engine you linked to Ludwig makes for a very nice green solution indeed. I shall have to think about that.

I know my daughter would like it a lot if I was to make some kind of electric vehicle Steve as that's very much her thing and with her own not so good state of health I can predict that she would want to borrow it often. Having a Mum who is keen on ancient smokey two stroke engines does tend to make her roll her eyes a bit.

 

[Intrepid Wheelwoman]

That isn't asking to much I don't think Anne. As long as they are poised for action as these two lads are. I enjoyed the confident look on the Intrepid Wheelwoman at the steering.

As I've said a few times that I'd need a lottery win and to live to 110 in perfect health to get all the ideas accomplished.

Steve.

Yes that's a really great photo alright, - I think I might make it my new desktop wallpaper

Ah yes so many ideas (sigh)

 

[Intrepid Wheelwoman]

Iron Maiden has 3.7mm wall seamless inch dia steel tube for $NZ5.00 a meter. I'm going to get some to build a wee Benz tricycle.

Nice flywheels are hard to find, but I think this might do........



And for an ornate flywheel cover a local foundry makes these plant pot stands in 30mm and 35mm diameters



I know I've got some cast iron carriage steps about too. Finally I might have something to use them on.

 

[moto-klasika]

Free Stirling engine book........

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B_t...FmNS00NmI1LTk2MDYtMWEzMmUxNDljNWQw/edit?pli=1

--------------------------
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]Annie, thank you on information![/FONT]
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif](I managed to saved that PDF abouit Stirling engines)
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]As always it is interesting - but I couldn't be sure if it could be useful for me and my really humble possibilities to design and build something like that. In photos and video-links that I attached, it is obvious that Stirling engines could be used practically for light vehicles, on land and water... But (always that BUT), they must be gigantic compered to produced power and quite complicated to built (expensive!).[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]As Stu once said (you remember him from our Yahoo Group?) - the simplest one to build and quite power-effective is steam engine, but issues with boilers are too complicated (form legal and practical stand-point). He build too small boilers for models that do not need attest, but his auto couldn't be used legally on the roads... Stirling would avoid that complication but add another: too expensive to build for usable power, with high-tech approach (temperatures are really high), with complicated mechanical components... Therefore, simplest practical way is to build gasoline ICE![/FONT]
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]
Beside, I could imagine how Swiss officials would react seeing one Stirling or Robinson (something more practical) gigantic engine on ultralight quadricycle? In the best case, they should send me to some institute for examination and attesting, that would cost me some dozen thousand of Swiss Franks (that I do not have anyway)...[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]
Therefore: electric power which is socially and legally accepted, or ICE in category of "light motorised quadricycle" - attested and registered! [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]Ciao,[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]Zoran[/FONT]

 

[moto-klasika]

That really made me laugh Steve
Don't worry I'm just as bad with coming up with bright ideas all the time

Seeing this photo made me realise that every intrepid wheelwoman should have devoted staff to assist at a moment's notice. I shall place a small advert in the newspaper, - a shilling a day and they must wear a 'flat hat', - I think that should do it.

-------------------------------
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]Annie, [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]for sure that Berta Benz was quite extraordinary intrepid woman, beside being supporting and dedicated wife! To try (she didn't know is she would succeed) to cover such distance with her boys using untested “automobile” over country roads... Greta adventure, but useful too. Her husband Karl Benz (later change name to Carl, as more fashionable to use “C” than “K” between Germans – even today) as excellent engineer, machinist, designer and constructor – but quite shy type and not-so-good-businessman. So, she pull him out of his shell with that adventure![/FONT]


[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]I saw nice documentary about Benz's early years, with Berta's voyage as the crown-point! Only, both in that documentary and at attached photo (as in many other interpenetration of that adventure) – there is mistake! She didn't used Karl's 1st prototype from 1985-6, but his 3rd “motorwagen” from 1888. (at least seriuos historics says so)... That fact can't make her achievement anything less important!
[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]Zoran[/FONT]
​

 

[moto-klasika]

Ludwig,

Thank you once again. I wonder how big an engine a person would need to power a motorbike at 35km or about 33mph. You stand around a motorbike or motorcycle meet and talk knowledgeably about the mileage you get from a bag of wood pellets and few could argue the point with you.

Steve.

-------------------------------------
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]Steve,[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]I couldn't know from my humble experience (moped Velo-Solex, moped JAWA Babeta, micro-scooter Benelli), but from experience of successful builders - for propelling of light vehicle with one "normal" person, or two lighter persons: we should need at least one Kilowatt, or better said 1.5 - 2 HP. Power is power no mater of engine type, but ICE had good torque from around middle of revolutions and great power at high revolutions - so, it need some kind of gear-changing. Electric-motors and steam-engines (probably Stirling engines, too), do not need gear-boxes because have good torque from the start... [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]I would be satisfied with speeds up to 20 mph ~ 32 km/hour: bicycles here are something slower in traffic, and EU Directives limited “bicycles with assistance” up to 25 km/hour (only electric-motors). Variants with limits up to 45 km/hour must be registered as mopeds (gasoline engines up to 50 cc, and other kind of motors up to 4 Kilowatts)![/FONT]


[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]Something good & something bad in old Europe?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]Ciao, [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial Unicode MS, sans-serif]Zoran[/FONT]
​

 

[Ludwig II]

I wonder. I do. If anyone has made an external combustion gas turbine.

I think, and somebody tell me if I'm wrong, that the highest gas prssure in a jet is as the air leaves the compressor and goes into the combustion chamber.

Now, think this through, both the burning fuel and the heated air expand and spin the turbine to turn the compressor again. Surplus energy provides either direct thrust, or drives a second turbine to turn an input shaft on a gearbox.

I wonder.....