100:1 Mix

[mapbike]

We could always change the subject to something like........

( I cant see any power increase after going with an expansion chamber over my own home grown free flowing exhaust pipe)

Only thing I see the expansion chamber doing better is being better than the stock restricted exhaust these HT's come with.

Naaaaaaaaaaaaa! better just stick with defending one of the best 2 smoker oils on the market....Opti 2

And try to figure out what the real issue is with the seized engines that Opti is getting blamed for.

Peace

 

[mapbike]

While I cannot positively say for sure as I do not have the cylinder in my hands, from what I can see in the photos, I say failed chrome. See red arrow in attached pic.

Yeah I can see what you mean, it does look bad there doesn't it.

Also noticed what looks to be a pretty good groove in that piston skirt right below that intake port, that could be a sign of something like maybe a bearing gone bad in the lower end.....shrug!

Peace

 

[GEJoe]

I sent to cylinder to Dax today. He can answer your question as to failed chrome. I could not see it when I handled it to take the photo, and I sure cannot see it where the red arrow supposedly points to it. The only oil the engine ever had in it was Opti-2 mixed at 100:1 per instructions from Brad at Interlube. The engine was run on 3 short 1 to 2 mile trips. It locked up the first time on the last trip after about 1/4 mile. I could barely crank it, but as it cooled off it started again. Then I rode another 1/2 mile and it locked up again, but this time would not start and I had to ride home under pedal power. CAG engines don't like Opti-2 at 100:1, even though other engines may have looser tolerances and less horsepower and can use it. The 4.2 hp rating may actually be the missing piece to the puzzle, as more horsepower means more heat for the engine to shed and more expansion of engine parts. This is not a contest, I just want to ride my bike again!

 

[mapbike]

CAG engines don't like Opti-2 at 100:1, even though other engines may have looser tolerances and less horsepower and can use it. The 4.2 hp rating may actually be the missing piece to the puzzle, as more horsepower means more heat for the engine to shed and more expansion of engine parts. This is not a contest, I just want to ride my bike again!

Nope........ the CAG engine nor the ?'able "4.2HP" nor Opti 2 had anything to do with your failure, I'll garantee that there are engines out there producing way more than 4.2 HP with much better tolerances than a CAG running Opti with great success, I say the fact of the matter is you got a bad engine from the get go, which can happen to any of us and has to some......or the fuel was mixed wrong one of the two..........

 

[Greg58]

With all this going on about mix ratio I had to jump in, in the mid. 70ies when we were running bel-ray racing oil at 52-1 (12.3 oz to 5 gals.) in m/cross a-lot of people thought we were crazy. Just goes to show the more things change the more they stay the same.

 

[MotorBicycleRacing]

The only oil the engine ever had in it was Opti-2 mixed at 100:1 per instructions from Brad at Interlube.

Did you add the 1.8oz pouch to 1 gallon gas? = 72:1
or
Did you add the 1.8oz pouch to 1.3 gallon gas? = 100:1

I sent to cylinder to Dax today. He can answer your question as to failed chrome. I could not see it when I handled it to take the photo, I just want to ride my bike again!

What seized?
The piston to the barrel?
Or the crank bearings?
What was the damage?

I hope you get riding again soon too!

 

[mapbike]

Yes best wishes Greg58, I hope you get up and running ASAP and have better luck with your engines from this point on.........

Peace

 

[GEJoe]

Brad actually told me that since I put one packet into 1 gallon of gas I had the 72:1 ratio. Kind of hard to screw it up. I'm glad my AAS in automotive technology and several years as a diesel mechanic taught me to pay attention to detail. If it was a bad engine, which can happen to any of you guys that sell engines, I am sure that Duane will get a warranty on it from his supplier, and then pass that along to me. I am glad I bought an engine from him as he has been very supportive throughout this, unlike some I have read about on this forum.

 

[Greg58]

I have not had any problems mapbike I just liked the thread!

 

[mapbike]

Brad actually told me that since I put one packet into 1 gallon of gas I had the 72:1 ratio. Kind of hard to screw it up. I'm glad my AAS in automotive technology and several years as a diesel mechanic taught me to pay attention to detail. If it was a bad engine, which can happen to any of you guys that sell engines, I am sure that Duane will get a warranty on it from his supplier, and then pass that along to me. I am glad I bought an engine from him as he has been very supportive throughout this, unlike some I have read about on this forum.

You are very right....Duane is very dedicated to customer support from what I have read on this forum.........

Only issue I have is his refusal to grant warrantee on an engine running the Opti at it's manufacturers recommended ratio of 100:1, I have never purchased an engine from Duane/Dax but if I did I would likely not use the 100:1 mix knowing he would not honor a faulty engine if I was honest and told him the mix I had been using in it, which if that was the case I would be completely honest because I dont lie, I know someone much bigger is always listening and taking notes on all that I say and do........Yep I have a healthy respect for that fella because he will have the last word in all things....

Peace

 

[GEJoe]

There is a reason why engineers specify a certain ratio of oil to fuel for the particular engine they design. Ever wonder why some engines have a specification for 16:1 and others have a specification for 25:1? The Two Stroke Tuner's Handbook (which I got from a poster on this forum) hints at it when it says on page 134 "Because of the benefits in cooling that are obtained with very rich mixture, you will get very near the maximum power to be had from a high output two-stroke engine with a mixture that verges on being so rich that misfiring occurs." Also read these two links on fuel ratios to understand that there is a balancing act on lubrication, amount of fuel (fatness), lean or rich adjustment, and heat management for two stroke engines:
Rick Sieman: SuperHunky.com
All About 2 stroke Oil Ratios. Interesting find [Archive] - 3WHeeLeR WoRLD.
Mixing a different ratio than the engineers call for, even with synthetic or castor oil, can push the envelope for the balancing act the engineers designed into the engine, and cause the results I obtained with my engine. If Interlube was to tell the truth, they do pay out claims on engines that are not compatible with the 100:1 ratio. So, has anyone used a CAG engine with Opti-2 at 100:1 successfully? I wish I could have.

 

[MotorBicycleRacing]

If Interlube was to tell the truth, they do pay out claims on engines that are not compatible with the 100:1 ratio. So, has anyone used a CAG engine with Opti-2 at 100:1 successfully? I wish I could have.

You weren't running your motor at 100 to 1
You were running it at 72 to 1
That is quite a difference when you are speaking about truth and
that is plenty of oil.
Interlube ain't lying about anything. You are totally making stuff up. LOL
What evidence do you have to prove this statement?

Interlube does NOT pay out claims on engines!

Interlube does NOT have problems with Opti 2 oil damaging motors.

Interlube does NOT have problems with Opti 2 in much higher hp motors
than yours!
And I will prove that!

So many variables, typically when a piston is scored from top to bottom it is either no oil in gas or and air leak of some kind but again it is very hard to even see the damage from his pictures. It is quite possible he had the carb way out of adjustment and it wouldn't matter who's oil he was using.

You probably got some major air leaks or running so lean that you fried
your motor.
how does the plug look?

Again very difficult to tell but do you see all that glare in the picture, sure looks like an OIL coating to me. Also I am wondering why his piston is so discolored, it almost has a burnt look to it. Like the oil was baked on, which again indicates there was oil but the engine got too hot. It that discoloration normal on a bike motor?
It also looks like the base of his cylinder has a gasket material on in like a permatex,

No that discoloration on the piston in NOT normal especially on a new 3 mile motor.

You should have sent the whole motor back to DAX because the evidence of
why you fried your motor is not the barrel or piston. That was just the result.

When you bolt the new parts on you are going to fry it again no
matter what oil you run or at what ratio.

 

[GEJoe]

Brad at Interlube said it was no problem to run at 72:1 or 100:1. My plug is light tan. Yes, Paul's observation is correct, the engine got hot, as I said it did, and as the technical writeups I posted also said. I hear the ring of cognitive dissonance. I am glad that I was not alive when they believed the earth was flat. lol I guess my experience will hurt someone's profits/reputation. I also smell an agenda in here somewhere.
Why should I have sent the whole engine back when nothing was wrong with it. I chose to void the warranty by not following manufacturer's directions with my choice of oil. Why should the dealer be at fault?

 

[sketchman]

"Because of the benefits in cooling that are obtained with very rich mixture, you will get very near the maximum power to be had from a high output two-stroke engine with a mixture that verges on being so rich that misfiring occurs."

And you mean "inside the combustion chamber cooling", yes? As opposed to what everyone else is focusing their attention on. More pure gasoline in CC could very well have caused more heat INSIDE the the cylinder, which the piston and rings transfer to the cylinder, and thus the damage shown, yes? Even without a technically "lean" condition, gas burns hotter than oil.

I'm speculating here, but I think I've got it.

Also not agreeing or disagreeing with anyone. Just trying to understand what you're saying.

 

[MotorBicycleRacing]

Brad at Interlube said it was no problem to run at 72:1 or 100:1. I hear the ring of cognitive dissonance. I am glad that I was not alive when they believed the earth was flat. lol I also smell an agenda in here somewhere.

My point about the oil at 72 to 1 is that you had more oil than if you
were running at 100 to 1.
There is no problem running at 72 to 1.

You are the one with the agenda that PMed me and called Interlube
trying to get a free replacement motor for something they did not
cause. LOL
Get DAX to honor his warranty unless you leaned the carb out so much
that you fried the motor then DAX owes you nothing.

If Interlube was to tell the truth, they do pay out claims on engines that are not compatible with the 100:1 ratio.

You made a very strong claim there. We are waiting for your proof.
What evidence do you have?
Either back it up or retract it.

 

[GEJoe]

I PM'd you because you asked for it and I got the answer I expected - none. I retract the part about warranty claims for Interlube products - there is no warranty - http://www.opti2-4.com/html/legal.html - so you are on your own if you have problems.

It is time to end my participation in this thread, which by the way, I have read in its entirety and got all excited about using Opti-2 because it received a good report. I have accomplished my goal. Which is letting people know there are two sides to a story, and if a warranty is that important to you, abide by its terms. The responses posted by you guys who have something to sell remind me of the recent arrest of Domique Strauss-Kahn for rape. His attorneys will attempt to blame the victim because they and their client have something at stake. I am sort of the "victim" here and have received abuse at the hands of those who have something at stake. This is why most rape victims don't bother to report it. Normally in law he who leaves the field of battle first concedes. I have nothing to gain by responding to any of you who would crucify me, so if that is conceding so be it.

 

[MotorBicycleRacing]

I PM'd you because you asked for it and I got the answer I expected - none. It is time to end my participation in this thread, which by the way, I have read in its entirety and got all excited about using Opti-2 because it received a good report. I have accomplished my goal. Which is letting people know there are two sides to a story, and if a warranty is that important to you, abide by its terms. The responses posted by you guys who have something to sell remind me of the recent arrest of Domique Strauss-Kahn for rape. His attorneys will attempt to blame the victim because they and their client have something at stake. I am sort of the "victim" here and have received abuse at the hands of those who have something at stake. This is why most rape victims don't bother to report it. Normally in law he who leaves the field of battle first concedes. I have nothing to gain by responding to any of you who would crucify me, so if that is conceding so be it.

I never asked to be PMed and I quoted and answered your PM in this post.
You are the 3rd quote.http://motorbicycling.com/f3/100-1-mix-9850-57.html#post287983
Opti's warranty is for 4 strokes only for obvious reasons.

Now you are the "rape" victim and some kind of Christ like martyr? LOL

I am just after the truth. A better camera and lighting would have helped.

If Interlube was to tell the truth, they do pay out claims on engines that are not compatible with the 100:1 ratio.

Still waiting for your answer and proof of your libelous statement above?
Why make such a statement if you can't prove it?
Will we be waiting a long time?
Will there be a retraction?

 

[2door]

Up to now this has been an interesting and informative thread. Because of a couple of individules it is on the verge of being locked. Too bad that this discussion can't continue without input from a few that have an agenda of name calling and put downs.
Either get back on topic or this thread is done. I will not tolerate anymore diatribe or vendor attacks from those responsible, and you know who you are because you've been warned in the past about your abusive tactics.
If you have something to add to this discussion then do so. If you just want to sit here and argue and challenge people for their opinions, go some place else; prefereably to another forum other than Motorbicycling.com. and take your attitudes with you.
Tom

 

[NunyaBidness]

Lock it on up 2Door, everything that could be said for both sides has already been said multiple times.

Heck it aint even funny no more.

 

[LS614]

so boring, please put this dead horse out of its misery...