Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'Motorized Bicycle General Discussion' started by Retmachinist, Jul 24, 2009.
Morini Motors - Bicycle Motor at Motorized Bicycle Forum
ya but theese things are jetted so fat to begin with. all you 100:1 guys should just run straight gas! or buy a 4 stroke.
...or rejet/get a bttr carby?
I love oil wars. I guess no matter what bike forum you're on there's always oil wars.
Back in the 70s I started running Amsoil in my Guzzi. Everyone said it would ruin my engine. All my gaskets would leak. My bearings would go square. Well guess what they were wrong, it never happened.
Then in the early 90s I bought a Harley, and became a convert to Red Line synthetic. It was even worse then. The Harley shop said it would void my warranty. My gaskets would leak like a sieve. My bearings would go square. Harley's can't run synthetic because they have roller bearings. Synthetic is too slippery. Bla Bla Bla. Guess what? They were wrong and now even Harley has their own synthetic brand.
So what this tells you is I'm not afraid to buck the trend.
Now Opti II
After reading this whole thread I don't see one person talking about the environment they ride in. The environment in Washington state is a lot different than here in Texas. I'm not that confident that one single ratio is the best for all environments, not to mention riding styles.
Opti II is not synthetic, so I assume it's not going to have as much protection in very high temperatures. That might be a reason to change the ratio.
I checked Red Line oil's website to see what they have to say. They recommend 50:1, or up to 100:1 depending on conditions. That seems like a good clue. If one size doesn't fit all for Red Line synthetic, I doubt a non synthetic could make that claim.
Opti II does have my attention though. I'm going to call a few of my customers that sell it here in the Dallas area and see what they have to say. Then I'm going to talk to the tech support at Red Line. I'll report what I find out.
So what's my experience? I've run a qt and a half of gas through my China girl using generic synthetic I bought at O'Reilly @ 30:1 lol. But I did spend the night a a Holiday Inn Express last night.
biknut, thats so funny i've heard alot of people say syn will make your gaskets leak. Not true on another note opti isnt synthetic?
No, Opti 2 is not a synthetic. It is however a new generation of lubricant worth reading up on. I'm curious why you would ask the people at Red Line about a competing motor oil? It's like asking Ford about Chevies. What do think they're going to say? I also think it is wise to assume nothing about something new.
Do what you like and use what you like. if you use something of good quality it probably doesn't matter which is 'the best'. I used to use Amsoil Sabre professional and have been using Opti 2 at 100-1 since last summer. Yes, I live in a cold climate, but others on the forum who swear by it live in California and Arizona and places in the south. If it was wrecking motors we'd be hearing about it from people whose motors got wrecked. I've heard nothing of the sort. Everybody who uses it likes it, seems like. I will keep using it in my bikes and my chainsaws. But that's just me. I think you should use what you're comfortable with.
Biknut: check this out:
Interlube International, Manufacturers of premium Opti oils, Opti-2 and Opti-4
Opti 2 might not be a synthetic, but it actually STARTS working the best at high temperatures as it actually reforms the texture of the metal to reduce friction. It's pretty amazing stuff, and *ALL* of the local mower shops I've been to in my area use it in all their 2 stroke equipment and swear by it. I live in West Michigan. Meaning I have about 6 months of decent weather and about 7 months of tolerable riding conditions. I have used Opti-2 on all of my builds save my first, and have *never* had a problem with it in any weather condition.
I haven't heard of this opti, I'll give it a try after my engine rebuild. I've been running amsoil at about 70:1 for over a year, and just a while ago at over 4500 miles I had a ring retainer pin come loose. Not sure if it was because my ratio, to much abuse, or just these 2-strokes are crappy engines. It's impossible to say. But I'm all for trying out something new.
And this'll probably elongate the oil war, but there is some truth to the "synthetic will make gaskets leak" thing.
On older engines that are nearing the end of their life anyway, it's a horrible idea to switch. Old sludgy dirty oil very well may be blocking up some potential leaks in gaskets (remember, I said old near-dead engine). Synthetic has stronger detergents in it and will clean the blocks out causing sometimes really serious leaks.
Of course, in a healthy engine, switching to synthetic shouldn't cause any trouble. If switching to synthetic actually causes an engine to leak like a sieve, that engine probably didn't have very much life left anyway or, it was in very bad need of some new gaskets.
I remember old timers telling me the oil choice didnt matter. What screwed things up and made stuff leak was switching oils in the middle of engine life.
As I said, it's more at the end of the engine's life that upsets it. If it's a healthy engine switching in the middle of it's life shouldn't matter.
Today I called lawn equipment shops, rental equipment shops, motorcycle shops, a couple oil distributors, in Dallas and Phoenix, and did on-line research.
One shop said they never recommend Opti 2 because they've seen too many failures with it. They recommend Echo
One shop only recommends and uses Opti 2, but their recommendation was slightly questionable after they told me it was synthetic. They didn't know what ratio they used because they only use the small packet made for 1 gallon, and whatever that comes out to is what they use. They did say they've had no failures. Every other shop that's heard of Opti 2 it said it's a good quality high end oil, but they like something else better, often Echo.
The brand mentioned most often was Echo.
All the motorcycle shops only like the usual premium brand motorcycle oils like Klotz, Amsoil, Golden Spectro, PJ1, Motul, Red Line. No motorcycle shop I talked to sold Opti 2.
One of the distributors that sells Red Line, and Torco said Red Line is good, but recommended Torco. He's told me in the past he gets a better price margin on Torco.
What this tells me is now days the top quality oils are all so good that it's impossible to tell much difference between them.
I should also mention, when I talked to the tech support at Red Line I ask what conditions would they recommend using Red Line at 100:1 instead of the 50:1 they normally recommend. They said if used in something like a trials bike where super throttle response is desirable, but full throttle is seldom used for more then a few seconds that would be one example. I think that's food for thought.
I've been using Opti 2 in all my two strokes for over ten years. Love it - never had a failure (yet). I built two motored bikes this summer - they both have Opti 2 in the tanks.
My conclusion is you could probably say the same thing about 10 other premium brands. I'm not bashing the stuff, just pointing out that it's been around a long time, but there seems to be only an average amount of enthusiasm for it compared to other good brands. That's not bad really.
i think part of that is because opti2 is a pretty small company compared to redline or torco. there's no advertising that i've ever seen, and it seems like it's kinda hard to get.
not to mention, it goes against everything anyone's been taught about oil. someone who's been in the lawnmower, or even 2 stroke motorcycle business for awhile might be afraid to try new things.
and most places will always recommend what they sell, and criticize the competition.
i think the best way to judge the quality of opti2 for our bikes, is this forum. everyone who uses it swears by it, it hasn't destroyed anyone's bike, and everyone here has learned to love not having a stinky, smokey bike. and that's a pretty darn good review, if you ask me.
HAR! I was ANOTHER water buffalo owner. That was SO MUCH FUN ! As i got older, the Buff got harder and harder to pick up (i never laid it doen, but it had been kncked off it's center stand, so I got rid of mine and got a more svelte 650 V-twin shafty from Yamaha and regretted it the rest of my life !
I love the smell of castor Oil in the morning
On my stingray-motorized, I have been thru 2 tanks of AMSOIL at 100:1 and indeed smoothness and power response is noticeably better.
I have a unused QUART of AMSOIL automotive 30 weight i will prolly try too
I used to ride with a friend who had restored an old Water buffalo. Cool bike. He always used Bardhal in it.
The Local AMSOIL dealer is the most in-demand auto repair shop in the region. He sponsors a call in car show Saturdays and he has warned people over and over not to switch on older car from petroleum oil to Amsoil as Amsoil will cause all the SH*T in the engine to loosen up and throw down a lotta sludge...so much that it's total accumulation could clog intake passages to oil pump, or something, and damage the engine.
The theory given in this thread that switch back to petro-oil allowed the engine to run hotter and but some of that dreck up seems to FIT with the guy's statements and it seems to me to be a good explanation.
All I know is I have been using it from the third tank and the engine seems to run smoother
Boils down to this, A drop, ounce, whatever were going to ride anyway. The motor is engineered for 14,000 miles. Enjoy
14,000 miles!!! Forget about the oil then. I have three bikes and ride about five or six miles a day. I won't live long enough to wear them out.
The only problem with that theory is we're talking about small 2 stroke engines that do not have oil pans or pump screens to clog. I've also heard many times that switching to one of the new wonder oils on an old engine is asking for trouble but that theory is based on 4 cycle engines with oil passages, rocker arms, camshafts lifters and bearings that would be effected by loosened sludge. Just isn't the same with our little Chinese hummers.
By the way, that is an early post of mine and since that time the engine in question has been retired. It was never the powerhouse that my other engines have been and the bike was so uncomfortable compared with my cruisers that it now resides, hanging from the ceiling of my garage. I'm still running Opti-2 in all my other bikes with 2 strokes and also my snow blower and weed whacker seem to like it too.