Old Guys V twin & sidecar

[fasteddy]

Rick,
When I was foolish enough to try and tell people on the phone what they should do, after I finished I'd hear, My next door neighbour or my friend said all I have to do is----. I'd just tell them to give it a try doing it like that and wish them well. I knew where that disaster was headed. Much like Tony said. It would be a disaster.

I learned my lesson when I was helping a friend after hours in his body shop and he was telling me about the people who called him for free advise. He just told them to bring it down to his body shop and he'd give them a price.

Steve.

 

[Tony01]

Rick,
When I was foolish enough to try and tell people on the phone what they should do, after I finished I'd hear, My next door neighbour or my friend said all I have to do is----. I'd just tell them to give it a try doing it like that and wish them well. I knew where that disaster was headed. Much like Tony said. It would be a disaster.

I learned my lesson when I was helping a friend after hours in his body shop and he was telling me about the people who called him for free advise. He just told them to bring it down to his body shop and he'd give them a price.

Steve.

Well I don’t work on peoples stuff any more. I don’t even give advice. I know a lot but there is a lot more to knowing a lot. It’s knowing everything. It’s the years of experience. I know metal and I know bikes too. Hopefully I can quit both permanently this year. But I can’t just give advice. My parents have an old table in their dining room that could use a resto. I can’t bring it to you but if you could tell me what to do, how to do it, I’ll do it exactly as you say. No questions. Just following orders. I’ve learned that sometimes you must simply follow the pro advice. I’m not ready to do it yet but when I am I will hit you up. It would be a big job. But it’s a nice table easily 100 years old. Even if it’s 50 it’s still worth it.

 

[Greg58]

It’s crazy what people will ask you, my wife worked at a local veterinarian for almost 10 years, she knew a lot of the customers on a first name basis. We have been out shopping and a random person would walk up and start asking my wife questions about what they should do for their pet, my wife was a receptionist/office worker not a vet. Sure she learned a lot and didn’t mind sharing what she knew, what some people try to do is avoid paying for an office visit. Most of the time she would politely suggest they make an appointment, after the person walks off she has told me before that they haven’t seen that person’s pet in years.

 

[indian22]

Good insights guys and I love the stories. You wouldn't know it by my posts on my Android, but I've authored several books. Never shared that before with you guys, it goes back to lothing self promotion and is totally unrelated to matters of the bike or improving metal fabrication skills. I store these good stories up and it's amazing how a story pops into my mind at an appropriate time often to help me in a trying time or cheer up a period of sour disposition.

Rick C.

 

[indian22]

LED mounted right up to the reflector and the conversion was really simple, good light at only 16v so it's all good. The bracket also was simple to make and solid, and absolutely no shake. I think it would look better mounted 4 or 5 inches lower though, so I'll make a second bracket and see how that looks and works.

Hope you guys had a great Saturday!

Rick C.

 

[Tony01]

Yes Rick it would look best in line with the tank IMO. Gotta have lights. It looks good the way it is too though.

 

[Tony01]

You do what you gotta do. For every post or comment we make. There are 10 lurkers who watch us and post nothing. If not more. Bunch of guys watching and maybe building or wishing they were building like we do. Ever see how many views our build threads get. Who is that? A lot of it is the other builders on here. But most of it is randos. The nameless lurkers. You put that headlight wherever. We will like it! That build is freakin sweet man. I would love to ride it daily everywhere. To be honest I would rather ride that bike than one of mine. My bikes only look good to me. I see yours and I see years of studying of bikes of old. They take you back to a time when none of us lived or worked on them. Really amazing stuff. That’s why I love the vintage stuff or vintage looking stuff so much. It’s just a peek into a time gone by. One old guy I met recently. Completely blew my mind. He is building a steam powered bike with the water heated by a zero motorcycle battery. Yep an ebike powered steam motorcycle. Talking to him about steam. Realized it’s an entire generation of builders gone by with the advent of the ICE. Steam was King back in the day.

 

[Oldbiscuit]

I had thoughts a few years back of building a wood gasifier and installing it on a 4 cycle bike or trike. Impractical and highly polluting yes, but something totally different to what most people see. Maybe someday I might give it a go yet.

 

[indian22]

You do what you gotta do. For every post or comment we make. There are 10 lurkers who watch us and post nothing. If not more. Bunch of guys watching and maybe building or wishing they were building like we do. Ever see how many views our build threads get. Who is that? A lot of it is the other builders on here. But most of it is randos. The nameless lurkers. You put that headlight wherever. We will like it! That build is freakin sweet man. I would love to ride it daily everywhere. To be honest I would rather ride that bike than one of mine. My bikes only look good to me. I see yours and I see years of studying of bikes of old. They take you back to a time when none of us lived or worked on them. Really amazing stuff. That’s why I love the vintage stuff or vintage looking stuff so much. It’s just a peek into a time gone by. One old guy I met recently. Completely blew my mind. He is building a steam powered bike with the water heated by a zero motorcycle battery. Yep an ebike powered steam motorcycle. Talking to him about steam. Realized it’s an entire generation of builders gone by with the advent of the ICE. Steam was King back in the day.

Thanks Tony your comments are both insightful and humbling. I love looking back, history to me is fascinating, I admire it but don't long for it. With all it's problems life now is still great and what we actually have....our personal reality.

Recently I've invested quite a bit of time revisiting the amazing steam engines, both actual historic engines and current hobby recreations or restorations of famous designs. Steam powered cycles are a historical category, subset, of steam transport. Your Ol' guy is onto it!

I lurked this forum and built motobikes for several years too.

My Ol' Crow isn't a copy of a Harley. Though that's how I think of it; it's more a composite of manufacturer designs extant during the first two decades of the motobicycle. I lean towards the racing look of a weekend racer and a weekday work transport bike, but not a factory supported team bike. Regular people raced, but couldn't beg, borrow or steal a real team bike. They weren't for sale. So weekend track warriors pieced performance mods together to be competitive, they were the original motorcycle hotrods. Most of these were powered by intake over side pocket exhaust design motors which HD V-twin owners some time raced the same basic bike for decades on flat tracks and hill climbs. Bikes took a pounding with accidents on track and when old parts could no longer be repaired and used the parts of newer bikes were used as replacements/upgrades. Tins and forks were really common replacements as were handlebars. Also these bikes in some cases were used in both solo and sidecare events so forks and handlebars were switched between events. For my Ol' Crow I have wide bars, for sidecar and daily riding and downturn solo racing bars for board track and two different forks (simple girder and four spring). Four springs are more a late 1920's item on Harleys as is the style headlight I'm using (though Indian and others used this headlight bucket on earlier bikes) it was a definite lighting upgrade to carbide etc.

My frame and tank really look like the Reading Standard board track design to me. Check out the only known example housed at Wheel's Through Time's Maggie Valley exhibit and I think you'll see what I mean. Also I kept the motor drive side simple like the Reading Standard. Pat at Sportsman Flyer really built me a fine frame, to my design specs and fit his big battery "fuel tank" in it. The full scale size 61 V-twin engine case fit perfectly with no need for any frame mods. Great work as always from Pat!

As far as performance goes my electric using 48v and 40 amp controller can equal the Harleys 1912 advertised speed of mid 40's mph with full charge. Going to 72v and 70 amp continuous it easily runs high fifties. Daly riding for me, 48v is what I prefer and I have three motors and several controllers which are simple to just plug and play on this bike.

Original track bikes ran 2.5 to 3 inch wide tires on 28" rims. I use 26 inch x three which stand 27.5" tall on the Ol' Crow. Pretty close to original without the cost.

I did indeed plan to mount a 250cc Yamaha in a frame and had everything in hand to do so and I think that's a great setup still, but I really wanted a engine that looked original early teen's so I waited and the Ol' Crow developed and it doesn't leak or smoke and fires up without a push, wheel pull or pedal and it has a reverse for the sidecar. Three speeds, hand shift lever, not yet hooked up and eventually running a full suspension side car with foot pedal activation of a disc brake, definitely not vintage, but the bike's twin drum brakes just not up to stopping the weight of a side hack even from a modest 25 mph.

Tony I love what you do and how you innovate on both gas and electric builds. Real bikes are meant to ride, and are certainly not posers. I ran out of power, in the middle of nowhere a while back, and a guy in a PU pulling a well used cattle trailer (3" of fresh bull crap front to back) stopped to help. He was amazed that I didn't hesitate to lay the Crow flat in that mess to haul. I like bikes I can daily ride without worry of getting dings and scratches. Bottom line with me is how dependable and safe they are and if they clean up good that's fine too.

Good is when good works!

Keep building cool stuff and share often with us.


Rick C.

 

[indian22]

My thought on replacement of the lightweight pedal bike rack, is to use the steel saddle bag supports and attach two heavy duty tube supports to the big axle plates on each side. The result is a much smaller length rack, but able to support a lot more weight with no rack movement and without drilling additional holes in the axle plates. The saddle bags actually covering the support legs, except at the axle plates. Overkill support for batteries, but able to haul an adult in an emergency. A shorter rack also alows me to run 5" barrel coil saddle springs with full articulation using my saddles existing mounting hardware with out striking a rack or rear tire.

The current rack held up better than exprcted but with batteries in both bags it's not a matter of if it fails, but when? The answer is at the worst possible time.

Rick C.

 

[indian22]

Temporary rack and bag setup.

Rick C.

 

[indian22]

Yes Rick it would look best in line with the tank IMO. Gotta have lights. It looks good the way it is too though.

I agree Tony I will fab a low bracket. I also need to machine a light control switch to operate the light's three functions, paint, put a new lens seal in before calling this a done deal basically.

I ordered oiled leather boot laces to wrap my grips too.

Three speed tank shifter with reverse should be a fun project. The controller does have 3 speeds I can hook into.

Finishing details to add to my already lengthy to do list for the Crow.

Rick C.

 

[indian22]

Hi guys yesterday was a good day. Lot's accomplished on the Ol' Crow.

I rethought my saddlebag rack and simplified it while making it far more robust. Really strong and useful design. No bike parts used all heavy steel plate and welded construction and super compact. Can bear the full weight of a 200lb. rider and two batteries. A longer rack can quickly bolt onto the small rack top to equal the length of a standard cycle rack or a box can bolt on for enclosed hauling, or use a wire basket. This is a Swiss Army knife of bike racks!

This small footprint allows room for saddle flex when using 5" length barrel springs too. I have good tire clearance as well. Rack allows tire change without removing rack or bags. Lots of room to mount a tail light bracket too.

Using the bike with a hack is in my mind for changes and additions for the cycle itself. Including functional gearshift 3 speed tank lever w/reverse. Lower power "gears" will be useful for both running and reverse and look nice also.

Machining a push button headlight switch out of brass is on my to do list also.

Raining and high winds today; though temps are in the mid 60's....shop day for sure.

Rick C.

 

[curtisfox]

KOOL! nice work.......Curt

 

[indian22]

Thanks Curt 5" springs out for delivery today. I will halt other work to get those mounted. The bag rack was my prep work for installing these Harley Springs, not cheap pedal bicycle stuff but real deal cycle heavy duty saddle springs. These don't bend and lean to the side after a couple of weeks use. Think this will really improve the ride.

I still need to finish dialing in the front forks after I pulled them apart for cleaning and lube.

It's hard to believe I've been riding this bike for over two years now. Since I installed the reduction gear I've ridden over 500 miles, way over, 'cause I rode for several weeks without the gps on it. 500 plus since I mounted the GPS. I'd guess total miles on this bike around 2,000 miles? So far so good. I don't get in a hurry to finish bikes and testing goes on for ever I suppose.

Rick c.

 

[indian22]

Well the barrel springs are mounted and I'm pleased as they are not rigid, but dang sure don't flex much. I'm certain they will hold their shape long term.

Headlight bracket tomorrow and brass light switch. Followed with wrapping the bar grips with black heavy leather boot strings.

My bike is pretty heavy so the four springer fork is now set quite firm, it was a bit spongy for my taste even as a solo. With or without the sidecar I think this is now a good fork setup.

I'll take photos this weekend.

Eliminating the 35 amp discharge function of the 48v BMS frees my controller to work to its current capabilities and adds a couple more hp. The low gearing with my reduction gearing won't allow much more speed using the 44t final sprocket and that's fine, but it will add a lot of extra torque for the side hack. We have a lot of rolling hills here and very few actual flat roads even in town so more power is a good thing with a heavy rig.

Rick C.

 

[Mossy]

Well the barrel springs are mounted and I'm pleased as they are not rigid, but dang sure don't flex much. I'm certain they will hold their shape long term.

Headlight bracket tomorrow and brass light switch. Followed with wrapping the bar grips with black heavy leather boot strings.

My bike is pretty heavy so the four springer fork is now set quite firm, it was a bit spongy for my taste even as a solo. With or without the sidecar I think this is now a good fork setup.

I'll take photos this weekend.

Eliminating the 35 amp discharge function of the 48v BMS frees my controller to work to its current capabilities and adds a couple more hp. The low gearing with my reduction gearing won't allow much more speed using the 44t final sprocket and that's fine, but it will add a lot of extra torque for the side hack. We have a lot of rolling hills here and very few actual flat roads even in town so more power is a good thing with a heavy rig.

Rick C.

I have that fork and curious about what spring you put in there to stiffen it ? And what hubs your useing ? I'm 240# and am going to go down the same more or less route...

 

[indian22]

You have a good fork then! I didn't change the springs these are the originals. All I did was clean and relube the slider and opened up the upper bushings. Then adjusted the tension on the springs and adjusted to suit me. My bike is heavy, over 170 lbs now, but I'm light at 150 lbs. So 320 total weight.

The springs I added to the saddle are barrel springs for a Harley Davidson solo seat, before it had no springs like most board track bikes and my butt took a beating. Saddle height did not change.

Rick C.

 

[indian22]

Bad photos but proof of actual work progress on Ol' Crow. Rack, saddle springs and headlight; that head light throws a beam! I did lower the headlamp 4", so split the difference.

A lot of wire management, paint etc yet to be addressed, but so much yet to do before it makes sense to tidy things up. While this is going on I'm also riding her everyday, so she's fully functional.

Rick C.

 

[Oldbiscuit]

Wow ! That’s really looking good !! I love those saddles .