Finding a v-belt and pulley narrow enough would be a challenge. I'm not sure about tooth belts/pulleys. My own experience with Gates PowerFlex 7 mm belts is that they tend to be somewhat on the ragged edge of their rated power when run on a 30 cc weedeater engine. They will slip a little when wet and the pulleys run a bit warm, which says to me that they're losing some efficiency to friction. Not to mention that Gates does batches of rare sizes of their PowerFlex belts, which makes ordering them ( in the US, where they're made..) hit and miss for timely shipping, and the 60 degree 'V' X 7mm width pulleys are hard to find.Yes exactly so
I'm wondering how it would go driving the hub with a belt and pulley instead of a chain.
Cannonballs Abbynormal 3Speed.
- Thread starter cannonball2
- Start date
This is a timely post. Since I cant use the Shimano on the mule bike, I have decided to incorporate as a 3spd friction driver like Bowljoman has done in the past on the Maytag bike and of course its belt drive. I found on ebay a company selling pulleys with the option to have the keyed hub welded or unwelded. I opted for unwelded. If the specs are correct there is enough clearance in the open center of the pulley to pass over the hubs drive. The pulley is also very narrow not having rolled edges, and is steel so I can weld it to the hubs sprocket. It will fit into the mount just like the S3X hub does.
Not sure what good a Maytag with three speeds is gonna be(maybe I can use low as a spin cycle), but there so much weird stuff on the bike why not add more.
O yeah thinking about water cooling too. Look for this saga when the Maytag thread pops back up. Waiting on parts now.
Heres the pics of the chain tensioner. Nothing remarkable. looks like some of the ones for sale on the net. I only made the spring arm. spring and anchor. I was able to make the arm long enough to where the mechanical advantage allows a fairy weak spring to exert a lot of force. The real difference in this one is the limit( the little bolt in the second pic) that keeps the arm from being straightened on starting. Works like a charm. With out it the chain will get loose enough to skip the sprockets on start.
The wet clutch has made the bike nicer to use, being smoother on take off, and seems to shift better as there is less drag when disengaged. The GenIII pucks seem to be doing well, they are not burnished in yet, that takes a while. Time will tell how they work out. I hope well, they are the easiest to make.
Not sure what good a Maytag with three speeds is gonna be(maybe I can use low as a spin cycle), but there so much weird stuff on the bike why not add more.
O yeah thinking about water cooling too. Look for this saga when the Maytag thread pops back up. Waiting on parts now.
Heres the pics of the chain tensioner. Nothing remarkable. looks like some of the ones for sale on the net. I only made the spring arm. spring and anchor. I was able to make the arm long enough to where the mechanical advantage allows a fairy weak spring to exert a lot of force. The real difference in this one is the limit( the little bolt in the second pic) that keeps the arm from being straightened on starting. Works like a charm. With out it the chain will get loose enough to skip the sprockets on start.
The wet clutch has made the bike nicer to use, being smoother on take off, and seems to shift better as there is less drag when disengaged. The GenIII pucks seem to be doing well, they are not burnished in yet, that takes a while. Time will tell how they work out. I hope well, they are the easiest to make.
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Tractor supply outfits sell those keyed pulleys in many different diameters and are meant to be welded onto a shaft. Curtis Fox recently converted an automatic clutch for me which had been sprocket drive. He ground the sprocket down so the pulley would fit onto it and welded it in place. I have one for something else which is 16" diameter. The one Curt did was 2 1/4". I think they start at 2".
I like your chain tensioner.
SB
I like your chain tensioner.
SB
We are about to try a standard 3 speed hub in reverse. I believe that will make it a 2 speed, I need to re read this thread in its entirety. If it works out we will have the mount and chains set up for the standard 3 speed. It should mostly cross over to the fixed Sturmey 3 speed which we will use for the durability. This is a great read and source of knowledge, thank you Cannonball2 for starting it. Did some testing yesterday and the bike pulls a little higher RPM now with the 36 tooth than it did with the 44 so the crank balancing and port refinement done while I had it apart had a good effect. Not to mention it is much smoother, I have some pics but it is best to watch some youtube videos on static crank balancing to get an idea of how to do it. I will post some pics here as I mount the 3 speed if it's ok with you Cannonball? It felt like I had a lot of time to get ready for Bonneville when I started this and now it feels like I am running out of time fast. Happy motoring everybody!
Would it really be too ugly to offset the IGH hub out the left side of the bike and drive it forward? I braced one mounting 'triangle' style. It would stick out less than most people's asses do 
Does it really need to fully tuck into the frame? I braced mine with simple expansion eyes.
The aluminum bars shared the same mounting point were independent. The adjustable bolts did all the actual aligning. The Bars only carried the load. Weld up a rod sticking out to the left, and the add the bars which hold the hub so it can swing. Lock it in via adjustable rods.
Does it really need to fully tuck into the frame? I braced mine with simple expansion eyes.The aluminum bars shared the same mounting point were independent. The adjustable bolts did all the actual aligning. The Bars only carried the load. Weld up a rod sticking out to the left, and the add the bars which hold the hub so it can swing. Lock it in via adjustable rods.
Ahh I've not seen those belts before. Very interesting. Do they work with normal V-belts? I would have paid for those instead of the belts I've got now just for the adaptability. Especially if they made a PolyFlex taper.Citi-sporter, I was going to use this type of belting
Link belts will replace conventional 'V' belts without any problems. Their big advantage is being able to be adjusted and repaired easily without all the drama of having to find a v belt of the right length.
This is a New Zealand link, but most good belt stockists would carry these belts.
http://nz.rs-online.com/web/p/twist-link-belting/7005497/
This is a New Zealand link, but most good belt stockists would carry these belts.
http://nz.rs-online.com/web/p/twist-link-belting/7005497/
IWW, is this for your modular add on motor concept? If so cant you just move the wheels sprocket to the right side and use the IGH as a jackshaft using all three speeds? You could even double belt drive that which would be very smooth/quiet. Just would have the CG to listen too.
I have seen those belts on many things including a few belt driven cycles. I have never used one. The seem kind of pricy but I have been in situations between belt sizes where there was no chance for and idler to be installed that I would have gladly paid the price.
I don't think installing a pulley on the hub is going to be a huge issue. will know more good or bad when the pulley arrives.
Bowljoman, if the IGH is offset to the left on a bike I don't think a rider can pedal(haven't visualized the scenario with the bike yet). Might work in some situations.
Given enough span of belt one can always twist the belt to reverse the direction. Seems like I have seen that done before some where.
I have seen those belts on many things including a few belt driven cycles. I have never used one. The seem kind of pricy but I have been in situations between belt sizes where there was no chance for and idler to be installed that I would have gladly paid the price.
I don't think installing a pulley on the hub is going to be a huge issue. will know more good or bad when the pulley arrives.
Bowljoman, if the IGH is offset to the left on a bike I don't think a rider can pedal(haven't visualized the scenario with the bike yet). Might work in some situations.
Given enough span of belt one can always twist the belt to reverse the direction. Seems like I have seen that done before some where.
Thanks SB!
You are right about TSC. I totally forgot! I have seen those there. I could have bought the pulley less the hub for less$$. Oh well now will have to base a build around the unused hub--lol.
Those belts have been used for wood working for years,like table saws and the like. They are really good and flexible.I bought one at Harber freight and put it on my brothers table saw,they don't flop like regular belts. They stretch at first so need to reajust and save the exses for future use.
But i don't think they would be any good for belt tightener clutch as to flexible and won't hold the forum like regular belts...............Curt
But i don't think they would be any good for belt tightener clutch as to flexible and won't hold the forum like regular belts...............Curt
I'm still working all this out CB, but really everything is wide open for experimentation. Thanks for the suggestions I'll have a play around and see what can be done.
With the link belting it's the convenience of being able to make adjustments on the spot and not having to mess around trying to order the right sized belt from some manufacturer's list and then the wait until it finally arrives only to discover it doesn't fit. Living in a small country town is nice, but difficult at times when trying to find any non-standard or one-off item.
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Bowljoman, I thought about having the hub stick out the left side like you mentioned and it's doable on my bike. The main reasons I want to tuck it in the triangle are aero and a more rigid mount. Both of those reasons are negligible though. I am trying to take the single speed to the absolute limit for aero and weight, plus a can't really afford any parasitic loss. The 3 speed may prove necessary in the end though and if set up right is probably very efficient. For a street riden bike I think it's absolutely brilliant and am really excited to build one.
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The link belts are something I had to work with years ago on a machine for granulating plastic. Every so often you'd have to open up the bottom casing and tighten up the belts. When there was no more adjustent, wind the adjuster all the way back in, take out as many links as needed and carry onas before.
It's a very practical way to use a belt drive, you'll never be totally stuck miles from anywhere even if a link failed, provided you had a spare, where a conventional belt would be too worn, or simply broken and beyond immediate repair.
It's a very practical way to use a belt drive, you'll never be totally stuck miles from anywhere even if a link failed, provided you had a spare, where a conventional belt would be too worn, or simply broken and beyond immediate repair.
So after many miles of "shifty" riding my conclusion is the SA hub is pretty tough. Before the shifting became reflexive I banged and missed a good many shifts. I start the engine in second now, use to use only third(direct), it will start just as easily in first, but I prefer second. I guess what I am saying here it doesn't much matter what you do with it with in reason you wont hurt it.
So this is a very nice way to get a shifter bike if three speeds will do you. Its not hard to fab the mount or convert the hub. If you can find a deal on the hub(they are out there) its a pretty reasonable way to get a very non-temperamental shifter bike. By all means try to get the handle bar top mount shifter, not the bar end version. There virtually no drive train back lash or freewheels to deal with making this the most motorcycle like MB I have ever ridden.
I think I have laid out the bits to convert the hub further back in the thread.
Build one and have fun!
So this is a very nice way to get a shifter bike if three speeds will do you. Its not hard to fab the mount or convert the hub. If you can find a deal on the hub(they are out there) its a pretty reasonable way to get a very non-temperamental shifter bike. By all means try to get the handle bar top mount shifter, not the bar end version. There virtually no drive train back lash or freewheels to deal with making this the most motorcycle like MB I have ever ridden.
I think I have laid out the bits to convert the hub further back in the thread.
Build one and have fun!
This has been one of the more interesting mechanical adventures of yours that I have followed. And it has certainly borne fruit. Well done, sir.
SB
SB
Thanks SB! I hope some one else will pick up the gauntlet and run with it. Done right they wont regret it!