Velocars and other interesting vehicles.

[fasteddy]

You could mount a body like this on a Crosley frame as long as you have the matching paper work and a body vehicle number.
There must be small cars in Europe that have a frame that would lend it's self to this. if you change the body style do they make you go through a motor vehicle test?

Steve.

 

[plycar]

Hello Steve

Luckily, the number of wheels doesn't change the bicycle status in Germany.
I posted a eight wheeled cargo bike from Berlin somewhere in the thread, it's legal here.

I guess, if you want to build a four wheelded bicycle (velocar) in Canada, you have to turn it into a motorized car by mounting a larger engine.
Is that possible?

Are four wheeled bicycles generally legal in the US, or depends it on the laws of the state?

Kai

 

[Allen_Wrench]

Hello Steve

Luckily, the number of wheels doesn't change the bicycle status in Germany.
I posted a eight wheeled cargo bike from Berlin somewhere in the thread, it's legal here.

I guess, if you want to build a four wheelded bicycle (velocar) in Canada, you have to turn it into a motorized car by mounting a larger engine.
Is that possible?

Are four wheeled bicycles generally legal in the US, or depends it on the laws of the state?

Kai

In most states (maybe not all) a four-wheeled bicycle with no motor is legal. But, if it has a motor and four wheels, most state's laws say it is now a car.

And, after January 2015, in Indiana (and a few other states too, I believe) a bicycle with ANY SIZE gasoline engine will need to comply with the licensing and registration laws for motorcycles. Any vehicle with 2 or 3 wheels and a gasoline engine will be basically considered a light motorcycle according to state law.

And I would love to have enough money to move to Germany. I have relatives in München. I have never been to the land of my ancestors, but I have always heard how beautiful it is there.

 

[fasteddy]

Hello Kai

The government has said that as long as a bicycle has two or three wheels and can be driven by human power it is legal to add an approved electric motor but no gears to change.

As soon as you add the fourth wheel it becomes a car and must meet all the requirements of a car to be on the road. A 4 wheeled bicycle with a motor of any kind would be almost impossible to get certified so you can put it on the road as a car.
Doesn't make sense to me but I guess they felt the need to draw the line somewhere and that is what they decided.

To build a hot rod here it is best to find a car frame with paper work and a vehicle number plate or buy a frame from a builder that the government has given permission to sell them

Four wheeled bicycles are legal here. In fact many wheeled bicycles are legal here as well and as many people pedaling as you want to carry so long as it has the safety equipment needed and is well and properly built.

Are you allowed to buy an older car frame with the body removed and put your own body on it with the proper window glass and windscreen wipers, head lights ect. on it in Germany?

Steve.

 

[Intrepid Wheelwoman]

Here in New Zealand the MoT has finally ruled on motorised bicycles after them being somewhat of a grey area for a long time. Essentially electric power is fine and provided the motor is 250watt or under and the vehicle has no more than three wheels no form of official paperwork is necessary. I will add though that in all the time I've been building and using electric tricycles none of the local police guys and gals have ever stopped me to 'officially' ask about the finer details of any of my tricycles. I think being an 'elder citizen' and female somehow makes me 'harmless' whereas teenagers riding all manner of lashed up bicycles with added powerplants much too fast get officially noticed all the time.

When it comes to petrol engines bicycles and tricycles have to be now registered as mopeds provided the engine is under 50cc. There's a weight limit too, but I can't think what it is at the moment. Older more softly tuned engines such as the Villiers Midget which are larger than 50cc can be 'grandparented' due to their lower outputs.
Over 50cc and the official weight limit and full motorcycle registration is required which is more complicated to get as compared with a moped rego.

Four wheels still unfortunately is motorcar territory

 

[Intrepid Wheelwoman]

This is very nice I wouldn't say 'No' to one of these at all.

http://gas2.org/2014/01/11/pedal-power-sc-1-biposto-concept-brings-sexy/

 

[silverbear]

This is very nice I wouldn't say 'No' to one of these at all.

http://gas2.org/2014/01/11/pedal-power-sc-1-biposto-concept-brings-sexy/

Oh my... that is wonderful!
SB

 

[Allen_Wrench]

That is very slick-looking. I like the classic lines. Just think what it would look like with a pair of headlights on there.

 

[curtisfox]

That is very slick-looking. I like the classic lines. Just think what it would look like with a pair of headlights on there.

Yep got to be frog eyes for sure...........Curt

 

[moto-klasika]

This is very nice I wouldn't say 'No' to one of these at all.

http://gas2.org/2014/01/11/pedal-power-sc-1-biposto-concept-brings-sexy/

Hello IWW,
Beutiful velocar (just not say that to Scuderie)!
However, I am afraid - too sexy for my taste! And, too expensive! Just short quote form thier web-site:
"If that demand does materialize, each SC-1 will be to order, 'tailor-made' in the Parma workshop, customization options are vast, from the exterior design through colors and equipment... it’s worth noting that Scuderie Campari’s primary business is the construction of high-quality, high-end pedal child-size cars that are directly patterned after old Bugattis and the Ferrari-driven, pre-war Alfa Romeo race cars... ”

 

[moto-klasika]

... I think that I would have frog-eyes if I ever knew the price! (made in Parma!)

 

[moto-klasika]

Hello Annie the Great!
Congratulation on 100th page of this magnificient sub-forum!

 

[moto-klasika]

[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]Hello,
As Kai explained, situation in Germany (and possibly in greater part of Europe) is cleared a lot with quite logical systematisation and definition of a few classes of light motorized vehicles. I am still not sure for Switzerland (I will check that if I need that), but in my country Serbia – there are new law and standards for all such vehicles, according to European Union Directives.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]
[/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]To simplify:[/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]bicycles: pedal powered, with two, three or four wheels;[/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]bicycles with assistance: pedal-powered (effective) and electric-motor up to 250 Watts – speeds up to 25 km/hour;[/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]mopeds - gasoline engines up to 50 cc, or 4 Kilowatts from electric-motor or Diesel engine, with 2 wheels (moped) or three wheels (light three-wheelers) or four wheels (light quadricycles) – speeds up to 45 km/hour;[/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]heavy three-wheelers and quadricycles – with three or four wheels and any kind of engine-motor up to 15 Kilowatts, no restriction of speed.[/FONT]



[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]As Annie mentioned for NZ, there are restriction for wight, size and payload – but that shouldn't be problem, neither standard equipment. Above mentioned restrictions, everything else is motorcycle (single or with side-car) or automobile (could have three or four wheels).[/FONT]



[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]I do not believe that assistance of 250 Watts should be enough for two of us on our present quadricycle, and for sure not on new velocar. So – I should jump at least in category of “light quadricycle”! Probably better with electric-motor of 4 Kilowatts then moped's engine of 50 cc. Small diesel of 4 Kilowatts should be good, but too expensive.[/FONT]



[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]If somebody is interested, I could post (or sent on PP) extracts from EU Direction.[/FONT]


[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]I am not sure for process of attesting and regsitration - that could be different for any state, simpler or more complicated, cheaper or more expensive.
[/FONT]

 

[moto-klasika]

You could mount a body like this on a Crosley frame as long as you have the matching paper work and a body vehicle number.
There must be small cars in Europe that have a frame that would lend it's self to this. if you change the body style do they make you go through a motor vehicle test?
--- ---
Are you allowed to buy an older car frame with the body removed and put your own body on it with the proper window glass and windscreen wipers, head lights ect. on it in Germany?

Steve.

[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]Hello Steve,
I couldn't say anything about Germany, but know a lot about attesting of DIY, modified or reconstructed motorised vehicles in Serbia. (I had a friend that work for Institute of Belgrade’s University that is in charge for such attests) I suppose that similar situation is similar in other states of Europe.

With my friend I discussed a few of my projects and it was obvious that the easiest way is to use registered vehicle (moped, motorcycle, automobile...) as a base of project. Then, keep the part of chassis with printed number on it and belonging engine with printed number on it. Everything else could be changed, or made new - but, it is simpler of steering, brakes and suspension stay original. Of course - all proscribed equipment add. After attest and registration, something could be changed according to our wishes, cheating a little (but staying in limits of “normal” looks and use).

I had two projects on good European chassis: the first was with TRIUMPH Herald 13/60, the second was FIAT 500 C Topolino, and the third was VW-beetle 1300. With absence of necessary resources, all projects were abounded in the first phases. [/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]Beside mentioned chassises, used could be chassis of CITROEN 2CV and RENAULT 4 TL, but they are mostly heavily rotten (platform types). In some countries, could be used chassis of WARTBURG (still could be found good and cheap in Belgrade). Small and simple automobile engines are now rare, but in Serbia still could be found.

As I often wrote: beside desire and some knowledge, essential is working space, free time, supporting family (if it is around) and MONEY! Other issues could be solved. [/FONT]

 

[Intrepid Wheelwoman]

Here's a Happy Page 100 picture I found. An adult sized pedalcar, - why should the kiddies have all the fun



I agree Zoran, - money or the lack of it is the curse of the home velocar builder. But on the other hand a lot can be done with very little provided one has the time and one's health.

 

[Intrepid Wheelwoman]

Another one

 

[moto-klasika]

Here's a Happy Page 100 picture I found. An adult sized pedalcar, - why should the kiddies have all the fun

I agree Zoran, - money or the lack of it is the curse of the home velocar builder. But on the other hand a lot can be done with very little provided one has the time and one's health.

[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]Hello Annie,
Quite right for kid's fun! Beside, being older-and-older, I feel as kid again! Alas, there are the same issues as had as kid, including less of money – only more knowledge and experience are present, with a lot of free time. (thanks God – no more school). But, not a lot of time to postpone some projects for “better times” (always that BUT).

You chose cute photos for 100th page ceremony! I prefer one with two seats! Does anybody think that aerodynamic is essential for slow speeds up to 20 mph ~ around 30 km/hour? Classic velocars looks quite aerodynamic, but shown pedal-cars are cute, too. Shape of cycle-cars, or even veteran cars could be easily achieved and looks good?[/FONT]


[FONT=Comic Sans MS, cursive]P.S.: Photos are from nice album with interesting pseudonym!
[/FONT]

 

[curtisfox]

Another one

Looks like a big long oil pan with atop and wheel.........Neet stuff.....Curt

 

[fasteddy]

Hello Zoran

Someone in the U.S. made a copy of a three wheeled cycle car and used a V.W. front axle and a motorcycle as the power plant. He removed the forks and gas tank as well as anything else he didn't need and used the wiring from the motorcycle to power the head lights, signal lights and brake lights.
It was registered as a trike I think using the motorcycles paper work. Certainly the fastest way to do it.

Steve.

 

[moto-klasika]

Hello Steve,
maybe I mentioned (or not), but some years ago I started such project with VW-beetle front end and son's motorcycle JAWA 350 cc... It had two-cylinder two-stroke engine with 20-22 HP. probably too heavy front part for such motorcycle, but that was that I had. Unfortunately, I abounded such project - had to quit my job and came to Swiss. Everything is still at Belgrade, if my son didn't sell everything to Gypsies, according to my advice... That project should be dead anyway, because all papers were lost and couldn't be reconstructed again. (I didn't transfer ownership to us and seller left to Australia)

As I often said, maybe next time! Pity - it was so close to realisation.

Attached are some photos, especially interesting is one with Indian three-wheeler and two JAWA three-wheelers, that would be good inspiration for my plans.