The Epic an electric tri car.

Tom from Rubicon

Well-Known Member
Apr 4, 2016
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Rubicon, Wisconsin
Sounds like you are getting ready for the long grey time Steve. You talk of pickles. Do you know of, or do you pickle kelp stalks?
Or are you too far inland? Time Life Books in the 70's published a series of cooking books. one featured the PNW.
Pickled kelp stalks. Like watermelon rind I expect with a salt tang.
Family duty, do it.
Tom
 

fasteddy

Well-Known Member
Feb 13, 2009
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British Columbia Canada
The bike portion of the tri car is primed and ready to sand and paint. Motor is ready as well. Barrel are painted where they need it and the crank case is ready for sand and paint.
This week the tri car portion needs to be smoothed out with body fill and primed and I hope to get up to the paint shop and get the paint if they can mix it to the paint code Pete was kind enough to send. I'll call Monday and find out. I did find what is supposed to be the paint code numbers and colours so we'll see.

Other bits for the tri car. My old Bike Camp buddy decided to come along for the ride. Silver bear has an early Golden Motors front hub motor that he purchased years ago. It's going on a Schwinn woman's bike from the early 1960's I believe.

The State of Minnesota is paving a 130 mile bike and walking path which will go past their cabin and end up in Ely near their home. He and Sue hope to be able to use it to travel back and forth using electric bikes. Silverbear is building one over the winter to see if they want to build a second one.

They also have what is called a Pedal Coupe which a 4 wheel pedal and electric quadracycle. They can be found on the net but long out of business. Re-power with Lithium batteries and perhaps a larger motor.

Silverbear and I are building our own batteries. They will be 52v running through 48v controllers capable of handling the 52v. Most of the motors it seems are capable of using the voltage.

The batteries. We are using battery holders that clip together. You can make different sizes of Lithium batteries with 18650 cells.

They can be found here along with battery chargers and a Battery Management System {BMS} as well as assorted parts. Click on shop.

VRUZEND battery kit

{Vruzend battery kit V2.1} This is the better one for high powered batteries. Scroll down to see it. it's near the bottom.

The batteries. Purchased in China from a recommended battery supplier. We need 28 cells so we purchased the 30 cell offer. Cost to me here in Canada delivered was $107. Silverbear's was cheaper in U.S. dollars. That includes the $18 shipping. I'm waiting for them to arrive as $20 lamp shades. It's happened. Aliexpress gives you a 75 day return policy.

They are Panasonic NCR18650B cells.

Hot NEW 10pcs/lot LiitoKala original 18650 battery 3400mah 3.7v lithium battery for panasonic NCR18650B 3.7V flashlight battery

Now it's a parts wait once more but while the wait is on the bike needs to be finished.

Steve.
 

fasteddy

Well-Known Member
Feb 13, 2009
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British Columbia Canada
Now I can get into my photo file I'll post the photos I couldn't before.

Steve.
 

Attachments

silverbear

The Boy Who Never Grew Up
Jul 9, 2009
8,212
175
63
northeastern Minnesota
American Flyer
This is the current project, putting together already used bike parts from past builds. Front wheel is an early generation Golden Motor which was originally 36V and probably 500 watts and which I'm upping to 52V, hopefully without sparks or smoke. When I first used it with heavy lead acid batteries mounted behind the seat some years ago the balance was terrible and I put it away, but now with the new, light weight batteries the situation has changed. Rear wheel hub is a 3 speed Sturmey Archer with drum brake. Front fork is from a mountain bike with a V brake and the step through frame is a 1960's Schwinn middle weight. The head badge says "American Flyer", so that's what I'm calling it. The plan at this point is to locate the controller behind the seat and to mount the batteries low off the rear wheel axle in something like the welded wire newsboy carriers years ago. I'm looking at ammo boxes from Harbor Freight as possible carriers, but won't know for sure until the battery bricks are made (one brick on each side of the wheel). I picked this step through frame because I like the clean lines and ease of mounting the bike. I find that at 76 yrs old swinging my leg over the seat is awkward and a difficult maneuver, so stepping through makes sense for an old guy. The center stand keeps the bike upright when parked and is something FastEddy modified for me years ago. We welded large washers onto the threaded adjustable legs as "feet" to keep it from digging into soft ground and potentially tipping over. Works well and is an essential part of the build. I'm trying to keep the bike simple and clean and very much look forward to riding it next summer. We have a new paved bike trail close by which passes by our lakeside cabin and on through the Superior National Forest to local towns, about twelve miles away and continues on for a total of 135 miles or so. I think the idea was to promote tourism in the area. Anyway it looks inviting to me. No gas bikes, but electric is okay. So electric it is! I'm mostly putting parts together at this point and ordering battery cells and such. The long cold dark is coming so it will be a winter project out in the boathouse along with a sail canoe project. Let it snow, light a fire in the wood stove and coffee cup in hand do some creative staring and tinkering. Life is good...
SB
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indian22

Well-Known Member
Dec 31, 2014
4,196
5,930
113
Oklahoma
American Flyer
This is the current project, putting together already used bike parts from past builds. Front wheel is an early generation Golden Motor which was originally 36V and probably 500 watts and which I'm upping to 52V, hopefully without sparks or smoke. When I first used it with heavy lead acid batteries mounted behind the seat some years ago the balance was terrible and I put it away, but now with the new, light weight batteries the situation has changed. Rear wheel hub is a 3 speed Sturmey Archer with drum brake. Front fork is from a mountain bike with a V brake and the step through frame is a 1960's Schwinn middle weight. The head badge says "American Flyer", so that's what I'm calling it. The plan at this point is to locate the controller behind the seat and to mount the batteries low off the rear wheel axle in something like the welded wire newsboy carriers years ago. I'm looking at ammo boxes from Harbor Freight as possible carriers, but won't know for sure until the battery bricks are made (one brick on each side of the wheel). I picked this step through frame because I like the clean lines and ease of mounting the bike. I find that at 76 yrs old swinging my leg over the seat is awkward and a difficult maneuver, so stepping through makes sense for an old guy. The center stand keeps the bike upright when parked and is something FastEddy modified for me years ago. We welded large washers onto the threaded adjustable legs as "feet" to keep it from digging into soft ground and potentially tipping over. Works well and is an essential part of the build. I'm trying to keep the bike simple and clean and very much look forward to riding it next summer. We have a new paved bike trail close by which passes by our lakeside cabin and on through the Superior National Forest to local towns, about twelve miles away and continues on for a total of 135 miles or so. I think the idea was to promote tourism in the area. Anyway it looks inviting to me. No gas bikes, but electric is okay. So electric it is! I'm mostly putting parts together at this point and ordering battery cells and such. The long cold dark is coming so it will be a winter project out in the boathouse along with a sail canoe project. Let it snow, light a fire in the wood stove and coffee cup in hand do some creative staring and tinkering. Life is good...
SB View attachment 108616 View attachment 108617
Time to properly reply to your long awaited post SB. Aggregate is I like everything you mentioned; well thought out as always.

American Flyers and Western Flyers were common on head badges of the fifties in Indian Territory U.S. good, solid bicycles which got handed down frequently with maturation. Nice memory makers.

Center stands with "Duck foot" pads are a priority on the bikes I ride year round. Twelve bikes, no leaners.

Voltage jump 36v 48v or 52v is really common upgrade with BMS and controller upgrade to correct voltage and 48v controller won't do with 52v unless marked as a "multivolt" design. Use at least 30 amp controller & BMS, though I use 40amp on 48v. These are continuous ratings however as you are over volting the motor 40 amps used continuous will really heat the motor. Full throttle, especially when climbing, should be used with great caution and of short duration.

Bagging lithium batteries on a rear rack is my favorite go to now. Fuel tank batteries are really cool looking but suck for battery size and ease of access. I use small leather bags made in India for cheap, but really good quality. Getting15 to 20 lbs of two 48v 20 amp batteries at near axle height really is a noticeable difference. Side note the weight of a single battery mounted over the rear tire on a rack or tank mounted lithium battery up to 72v 20amp balances just fine.

I'm jealous of that long trail dedicated to bikes and ebike. I love gas bikes but I select my e bikes to ride more often. I don't view them as more reliable or less to maintain or more fun, but electrics are what I usually ride these days.

Rick C.
 

silverbear

The Boy Who Never Grew Up
Jul 9, 2009
8,212
175
63
northeastern Minnesota
SILVERBEAR, welcome back, glad to have you hear again. Electric ug but have been thinking it I will be 80 in a month, still pedal everyday some, but also getting to be another ug. Seems to me Fleet Farm has ammo boxes, we also have Harbor Freight store now. .............Curt
Good to learn you’re still waking up in the morning, Curt… always a good way to start the day! Life is kind for an old guy if you have both a tractor supply and Harbor Freight nearby. And I’m glad you’re still riding your bike. I just ride my exercise bike (a Schwinn!) first thing every morning along with meditation and some time on the water rower, trying to stay alive awhile longer and stretching out my time here. Life is good. Not so sure about the alternative…
SB
 

silverbear

The Boy Who Never Grew Up
Jul 9, 2009
8,212
175
63
northeastern Minnesota
Time to properly reply to your long awaited post SB. Aggregate is I like everything you mentioned; well thought out as always.

American Flyers and Western Flyers were common on head badges of the fifties in Indian Territory U.S. good, solid bicycles which got handed down frequently with maturation. Nice memory makers.

Center stands with "Duck foot" pads are a priority on the bikes I ride year round. Twelve bikes, no leaners.

Voltage jump 36v 48v or 52v is really common upgrade with BMS and controller upgrade to correct voltage and 48v controller won't do with 52v unless marked as a "multivolt" design. Use at least 30 amp controller & BMS, though I use 40amp on 48v. These are continuous ratings however as you are over volting the motor 40 amps used continuous will really heat the motor. Full throttle, especially when climbing, should be used with great caution and of short duration.

Bagging lithium batteries on a rear rack is my favorite go to now. Fuel tank batteries are really cool looking but suck for battery size and ease of access. I use small leather bags made in India for cheap, but really good quality. Getting15 to 20 lbs of two 48v 20 amp batteries at near axle height really is a noticeable difference. Side note the weight of a single battery mounted over the rear tire on a rack or tank mounted lithium battery up to 72v 20amp balances just fine.

I'm jealous of that long trail dedicated to bikes and ebike. I love gas bikes but I select my e bikes to ride more often. I don't view them as more reliable or less to maintain or more fun, but electrics are what I usually ride these days.

Rick C.
Hey Rick, I appreciate your comments and will welcome any advice from people who know more than I do about bikes and new to me electrics. I defer to Steve (Fasteddy) as a mentor when it comes to purchasing what I need and how to assemble the batteries and what controller, etc., but one can always use a second mentor to guide the way. And I do need guidance.
No, I don’t want to over heat the motor and also don’t want for batteries to catch on fire or explode, particularly near where I’m sitting. Yesterday I scored on a Labor Day sale at Harbor Freight, buying new 50 caliber metal ammunition cans for $11.99 each. Bought two for the American Flyer and one for the Quadracycle (more on that later) for housing the lithium batteries. Those should be safe enough. Steve can clarify, but I don’t think that these bricks will carry that much amperage so I’m hoping that the motor is not going to be in jeopardy. Good to know what’s what, however to avoid having to say “oops, where’s the fire extinguisher?”. Steve has kindly offered to share this thread with him and there is common ground in that we are building the same batteries, but on different kinds of bikes. It would also be something like being at Bike Summer Camp For Boys Who Never Grew Up, as in years past. Or I can start my own thread to keep things simpler and not have three different builds going on in one thread which could be confusing. Don’t know.
SB
 

indian22

Well-Known Member
Dec 31, 2014
4,196
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Oklahoma
Steve and I share back and forth & pretty much stay on the same page for similar projects. He's a great mentor and friend as you know.
18650 lithium cells pack a lot of amps so take care when working with them.

Rick C.
 

Nightster

Well-Known Member
Mar 3, 2021
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Texas
Steve and I share back and forth & pretty much stay on the same page for similar projects. He's a great mentor and friend as you know.
18650 lithium cells pack a lot of amps so take care when working with them.

Rick C.
I used 18650s for a ozone generator I created for hunting applications. I think I was running almost a dozen of them to keep the ozone genny running for several hours or more.
Have a bunch of flashlights that run off of them also. Rechargeable is great.

and my understanding is that most laptop batteries have these enclosed in the battery pack. I’ve bought them used like that before
 

silverbear

The Boy Who Never Grew Up
Jul 9, 2009
8,212
175
63
northeastern Minnesota
Well, Steve (Fasteddy) and I have decided that his Epic build and my American Flyer are going to share this thread. A couple of things in common are that both frames were salvage buddies at bike camp many years ago... his 1950's Monark frame and my 1963 American Deluxe step through frame. So the frames have clunked together already. And they will share the same battery build which Steve described a few posts back. We each ordered our batteries at about the same time and they have now arrived for Steve in Canada and for me in northeastern Minnesota. He had ordered his Vruzend kit some time ago and mine also arrived recently along with a 52V charger and BMS. I imagine Steve will start assembling his battery brick from the 18650 lithium cells pretty soon and following his lead and with whatever guidance comes my way I will swallow hard (gulp) and nervously build mine.
I have a second Ebike project which is for me a deep plunge into unfamiliar waters. It is a Quadracycle which was sold briefly as a Pedal Coupe. It was given to me by my brother-in-law several years ago as he knew I had once been an avid gas bike builder. At the time I was more involved with sail canoes and Grumman Sport Boats so the quad bike has been quietly gathering dust. With a new local bike trail open to Bikes, but not gas, I have a renewed interest in building bikes and restoring this Pedal Coupe with updated electrics. It is enough different from the builds of this thread that it deserves it's own which I will start now. I guess we'll call it "Pedal Coupe".
SB
 

silverbear

The Boy Who Never Grew Up
Jul 9, 2009
8,212
175
63
northeastern Minnesota
The American Flyer is out of the basement, into the back yard and now in the boathouse where it will share accommodations with a Quadricycle. Winter is right around the corner in northern Minnesota. The other morning it was in the low 30's. the days are much shorter and leaves are already changing. In another month we can expect snow so this is the time for finishing up projects at the lakeside cabin and getting it shut down for winter... water lines drained and that sort of thing. It is also the time to be gathering information and trying to understand electrics which is a real learning curve for me, but very interesting. And it is the time to order parts and do some creative staring at the bike as if listening to it tell me what it wants to be and then giving hints along the way on how to go about it. Not that I really hear bicycle voices, mind you, but in it's own way a creative project can "tell you" what to do. With a fire in the wood stove and a cup of coffee, while snow falls outside my window there is a creative pleasure in giving a good long look of appreciation
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at a bike in a state of becoming something cool and that when spring comes I can give the motor juice and ride off into the sunset. Woohoo!
SB
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