How to run bearings in this set up?

indian22

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Dec 31, 2014
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it seems like that's becoming more normal these days, sadly. The new generation are finding less interest in older automotives.
Build on! There aren't many which voice an opinion that's based on real knowledge of what they're passing judgement on. I really value constructive input & ignore the snarky posts along the way. I had one gentleman recently that stated one of my bikes lacked something and my response was that he was absolutely correct and that thing was finishing! I consider all my builds ugly until finished. I've been to a lot of automotive and bike shows and the best builds were all completed and thus ready to be judged. I respect the builder and hold value judgement on the bike till it's completed to his satisfaction. Along the way I try to lend encouragement unless I see a feature that I feel is not well thought out and or will pose a safety risk.

Meanwhile ignore and build on!

Rick C.
 

Tom from Rubicon

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Apr 4, 2016
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Some guy on the motorized bike subreddit just called my build fat ugly and weird. I...just...what? Have they seen their builds on that sub?
Take heart Rocket, wanna be's don't have a clue the engineering challenges you are working through. Both Forums are cheap kit builds. Builders like you advance the technical developments that straight kit builders have not clue about. Even I have some esthetic (Me} not centering the engine in the frame loop. Just get done and debug it. Then ride it to the pleasure of all who see you riding a anachronistic machine.
I wished my engine was a 212 cc instead the 79cc I am running. Fine on the flat but no grunt for hills..
Tom
 

RocketJ

Active Member
Jun 20, 2018
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Take heart Rocket, wanna be's don't have a clue the engineering challenges you are working through. Both Forums are cheap kit builds. Builders like you advance the technical developments that straight kit builders have not clue about. Even I have some esthetic (Me} not centering the engine in the frame loop. Just get done and debug it. Then ride it to the pleasure of all who see you riding a anachronistic machine.
I wished my engine was a 212 cc instead the 79cc I am running. Fine on the flat but no grunt for hills..
Tom
Thanks Tom. Is it possible to upgrade your engine to a 212?
 

indian22

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My frame is actually a howle frame. It's slightly more robust than pats
Yes but I was referring to Tom's bike frame as he is running the 79cc motor at the moment and answer your question in post #90. He of course knows what has been done on his Sportsman built frame; others may not be quite as aware. Your frame looks quite large enough to house a 212cc motor too.

Rick C.
 

Tom from Rubicon

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I knew my frame with a mounting system from Sportsman Flyer could fit a GC 160 cc.
But a Pred. 212cc ? Rick, what do you know? Were the original Worksman drop loop frames Pat used also carrying 212's?

Sorry Rocket for the distraction in your thread. Us old guys are fast and loose on content treating the threads we participate in as a Party Line. We old guys grew up with it.

My frame is actually a howle frame
For the enrichment of the forum Rocket, a link of this frame builder source needs to be in MB data base.
Tom
 
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indian22

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Tom I'm speaking of dimensions of the "small" Sportsman frame I used to build my Harley "peashooter" with. I remember Pat suggested that I upgrade to the stronger frame used with the 212 & I'd doubt he would knowingly sell a small frame for that purpose & for liability reasons that would make good sense. He constructs the front frame himself and sources the rear triangles. The pedal bike NIB Worksman loop frame seems too tiny for the larger motor, but I've not measured one, I rode one years ago though and it was too small for me to comfortably pedal.

I welded gussets in place on my peashooter and unitized the engine & 5 speed to form a unit member frame on a "Marion drop clip" ....a lot of work to modify the frame including cutting the drop loop out for the motor clip. This lowered the motor a couple of inches as well. Long way around to say that I'm certain Pat was right, though it's worked well to this point.

The 212cc fits into the Grubee & Felt tank bikes and they are V frames. Neither of these frames allow the motor to be aligned vertically however. I own an original Grubee (love it) frame and I'd bet the small Sportsman frame is structurally far better suited to carryng the bigger motor with a few mods.

I'm not suggesting that anyone should do this 212 conversion but it seems quite possible if one is willing to put in the effort. I'd think your 160 is a better match in your frame though, and I don't recall Pat posting anything about putting a 212 in the small frame. I use the term small in certain tube size differences and tube wall thickness. The Bonneville are DOM heavy wall tube, but that's overkill for a street bike.

Rick C.
 

RocketJ

Active Member
Jun 20, 2018
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I knew my frame with a mounting system from Sportsman Flyer could fit a GC 160 cc.
But a Pred. 212cc ? Rick, what do you know? Were the original Worksman drop loop frames Pat used also carrying 212's?

Sorry Rocket for the distraction in your thread. Us old guys are fast and loose on content treating the threads we participate in as a Party Line. We old guys grew up with it.

My frame is actually a howle frame
For the enrichment of the forum Rocket, a link of this frame builder source needs to be in MB data base.
Tom
No worries, Tom. I enjoy anything that adds discussion to these threads. I'll post a link of the frame builder later.
 

indian22

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Dec 31, 2014
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Guys I'm a fan of either building your own frames or using a reputable fabricator for the work. One thing I'd add is that building a motorized bike and using a frame fabricated by either a custom shop or a mass produced "pedal bike" frame isn't a sure thing, but you can talk to the custom shop to clarify what you intend to do and that's not an option with big factory bikes. My rule of thumb on using pedal bike, off the rack frames and parts is to take the factory recommended maximum weight limit as a hard fact and subtract my weight, fuel & installed motor weight & an extra 50lbs. (margin of error) from the recommended factory maximum. If the number is greater than the max recommended by the factory I don't use that frame. Even if I went to reinforcement I'd have great concerns using mass produced frames.

I feel relatively safe riding a straight neck , short wheelbase pedal bike frame up to about 30mph. If you go much over that I'd recommend checking "trail" accurately your fork needs some positive trail, I use 1" as a minimum number for going at higher speeds. My more powerful bikes are set at around 2", but deciding on exact trail varies bike to bike and many factors are involved. This is just a a place to start & to verify that your bike does have some positive trail. Death wobble is a real thing on both motorcycles & motorized bicycles and is definitely a threat to life!

One other safety concern is adequate wheelbase at higher speeds. Short wheelbase is less stabile at higher speeds, three of my bikes have 53" wheelbase. 46" to 48" is common pedal bike frame wheel base. I fabricated extension dropout plates for my Grubee hybrid and it tracks great at over 40mph. This bike also has 1.5" of positive trail lead fork gained by using a spring fork.

Rick C.
 

MEASURE TWICE

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Jul 13, 2010
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Also low to the ground for speed.

Though seriously the gear box, not that it looks to stick out some, that I know the gyroscopic effect of the wheels make that less of an issue, but the gear box ground clearance. Where you ride and in turns I was wondering if it is OK?

Other: I did not go for keeping pedals on my off-road DMV stickered bike and it looks like a Mad Max construction. Some people think its great, some others not. I though do like the DIY builds and think about how they built what I'm looking at. That is what starts conversation.