98cc Villiers on a 1945 Sears Roebuck

Harold_B · Feb 25, 2016

Please post a link to your build when you start a thread. I like the layout you've got going there. That engine looks like it belongs in that frame! Should be seriously cool. The Coventry Eagle drive train is very much in keeping with the direction I'm heading. Thanks for the link. At a glance I think that might even be the same Albion gearbox I just picked up.* What will you be doing about a clutch?

Also, feel free to post pics or whatever about your build. I can use your creative problem solving on your build to give me ideas and with the pace of my build it keeps me excited about it.

*Edit - nope it's not. I have a kickstart on mine.

fasteddy · Feb 25, 2016

Here is a link to Atco Villiers parts in Britain on E-bay. Having had a lot of Frances Barnett and James motorcycles powered by Villiers motors 50+ years ago I found the one biggest reasons they wouldn't run were the ignition coils.
They were made of very fine wire which would break but the motor would run until they shorted out but not show up in a visual inspection.

Check the left hand side of the E-bay page for more Villiers and Atco sites.

Steve.

https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=...engine&usg=AFQjCNHyUZkG6wDnku6XtRuWk6AQuRz9Dg

Harold_B · Feb 25, 2016

Thanks Steve. When I bought the engine Dave had said he'd replaced the coil but to be safe I think I should be searching for spares.

fasteddy · Feb 25, 2016

Harold,

Spare coils are usually plentiful on the U.K. E-bay sites. Heaven only knows that every Villiers I owned needed one when I bought it. They are good for quite a while then they get brittle form age and use.

Steve.

silverbear · Feb 25, 2016

Sounds like I should be on the lookout for a spare coil as well.
CB2, your bike is going to be a sweetheart.
SB

fasteddy · Feb 26, 2016

Silverbear,

I'd have a back up coil simply because the motor is rare in North America and if it needs a coil you may have a wait to get another one.

Steve.

cannonball2 · Feb 26, 2016

I got the same sales pitch from Dave, and in fact the coil does look new as he said.

If worse comes to worse you can run a M/C coil through the points and condenser with a battery. Its a total loss system but will run for hours with the right battery. I run one of my Maytags this way.

fasteddy · Feb 26, 2016

I'm sure that Dave replaced them because they are a major problem with the Villiers motors as I said. He has connections all over the world and I'm sure that someone is sending him the motors and coils from the U.K and he is getting them in running shape.

The motors would run forever it seemed but the coils weren't as willing to help. A lot of the used Villiers motors you see on E-bay say they aren't running and I'd be willing to bet unless they are worn out a coil will get them going.

Every Villiers power motorcycle I owned and there were a lot of them needed a coil. The previous owners couldn't figure out how I got it running when they couldn't. The bikes had a cup attached to the underside of the gas cap. This was to measure the oil for a gallon of gas if I remember correctly and the smart owner mixed it in a separate can to make sure the ratio was right.

Pumping an exact gallon gas and adding the oil into the tank and sloshing the gas back and forth by rocking the bike side to side was an art that every owner learned sooner or latter if they traveled very far from home.

Steve.

Harold_B · Feb 26, 2016

Thanks again Steve. Dave had sent this link while my engine was in transit. http://www.villiersparts.co.uk

SB has posted fuel/oil mix recommendations in his build thread. I'll need to go through it again later for a link.

Your insight is greatly appreciated. Please don't assume I'm aware of these nuances of ownership. This is my first vintage engine and I don't want to be the death of it!

silverbear · Feb 26, 2016

fasteddy said:
Silverbear,

I'd have a back up coil simply because the motor is rare in North America and if it needs a coil you may have a wait to get another one.

Steve.

I concur: my thought exactly.

This thread is becoming a nice repository of Villiars information. Maybe at some point the links can be posted as a sticky for those who come later into ownership of one of these vintage engines.
SB

Ludwig II · Feb 26, 2016

I was reminded of these, I can't remember the last time I saw one on a forecourt.

Harold_B · Feb 26, 2016

"forecourt". I had to look that one up. Thanks. I've learned something new today!

fasteddy · Feb 26, 2016

Ludwig,

Thank you for the photo. Even with our strong British influence here in Canada I've never seen a 2 stroke mixer before. Just when you begin to suspect that you've seen everything something new comes along.

Steve.

fasteddy · Feb 26, 2016

Harold,

I'm sure that Silverbear mentioned that the oil used is a 30 weight non detergent. Dave suggested that the best one was an air craft oil due to the fact it stuck to the metal best. We bought a case from a company on the internet. There are many companies sell it.

I believe it was $65 for a case of 12 bottles. If you need more information I have some downstairs and I'll pass it on.

I think you will like these engines because of their reliability and simplicity. The 98cc bikes I had weren't going to slide you out from under your hair with the strong acceleration and high speed but they were a joy to ride and I wish I still had a Francis Barnett to ride. Especially for the $50 or $75 dollars I usually paid for them.

Most of mine came with a fine coat of olive drab paint since they were WW2 surplus. They were assigned a year when they were put into civilian use. That being the year they were registered.
Anywhere from 1948 up to the early 1960's when the last of them were released to the public.

Steve.

Harold_B · Feb 26, 2016

silverbear said:
I concur: my thought exactly.

This thread is becoming a nice repository of Villiars information. Maybe at some point the links can be posted as a sticky for those who come later into ownership of one of these vintage engines.
SB

That's an excellent idea SB. I've started accumulating links on the first page, first post. Facebook, Villiers parts and reference, and Albion parts and reference. Let me know if the links are not working or if there's something that I've missed or should be added.

Harold_B · Feb 26, 2016

fasteddy said:
Harold,

I'm sure that Silverbear mentioned that the oil used is a 30 weight non detergent. Dave suggested that the best one was an air craft oil due to the fact it stuck to the metal best. We bought a case from a company on the internet. There are many companies sell it.

I believe it was $65 for a case of 12 bottles. If you need more information I have some downstairs and I'll pass it on.

I think you will like these engines because of their reliability and simplicity. The 98cc bikes I had weren't going to slide you out from under your hair with the strong acceleration and high speed but they were a joy to ride and I wish I still had a Francis Barnett to ride. Especially for the $50 or $75 dollars I usually paid for them.

Most of mine came with a fine coat of olive drab paint since they were WW2 surplus. They were assigned a year when they were put into civilian use. That being the year they were registered.
Anywhere from 1948 up to the early 1960's when the last of them were released to the public.

Steve.

Wow, $50. That's pretty close to what I paid for shipping for my gearbox!
Information would be greatly appreciated. I'm still looking for the post in SB's build thread but more information would be great.

indian22 · Feb 26, 2016

Villiers engine caught my attention a few decades ago. I've been a 2 stroke fan from my first encounter with a Vespa 3 speed scooter as a preteen. The Villier's info would be a great resource for many including myself. Does anyone have specs and info on the 1916 Villiers 221 cc 2 cycle engine used in the Model K Featherweight Hendee Indian 2 speed...be much appreciated. Rick C.

fasteddy · Feb 26, 2016

Harold

The oil is, Aero Shell 65, SAE Grade 30 Straight Mineral Oil.
A case of 12 quarts is $88.22 or $7.84 a quart.

Sky Geek has it.

This is what we paid I think plus the shipping now that I see it. Dave recommended it because this is what the fellas racing vintage 2 stroke outboards use.

The mixing ratio was 25-1.

Steve.

fasteddy · Feb 26, 2016

Inndian22,

No engine info but nice photos of an 1916 Indian Featherweight.

Steve.

https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=...e.html&usg=AFQjCNG3dTbSoCMl2nf-l4gO_6VLKqEbOQ

fasteddy · Feb 27, 2016

Double post.

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