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borntofli

Member
Jul 27, 2012
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tx
I'm getting hassled here in Port A Texas.... I wrote this letter trying to get info on registering a mb.....


Ms. Williams,


Recently i have been riding my motorized bicycle to and from work and the beach.


Unfortunatly a copa police officer warned me that i need a registration plate for my bicycle.


I have inquired at city hall to comply ,but was told by barbra that she unable to issue a registration for a under 50cc motorised bicycle. (mine is 49cc).


I have asked the constables about it and they informed me that there is no registration for these type bicycles.


Please inform us the motorized bicyclist on the island and your fellow officers of your finding on this matter..





See picture of bike attached...





Thank you,


Brian Shaw
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


And they responded like this......





I know it is confusing but here is what I have found about motorized bicycles, if anybody else can find something different, please let me know. All references are from the Texas Transportation code:



According to sec 551.301 paragraph 3: A motorized bicycle meets the definition of a pocket bike if the engine displacement is less than 50 cc’s; however section 551.304 specifically states that a pocket bike may not be operated on any highway, street or road.



Sec. 551.301. DEFINITIONS. In this subchapter

(3) “Pocket bike or minimotorbike” means a self-propelled vehicle that is equipped with an electric motor or internal combustion engine having a piston displacement of less than 50 cubic centimeters, is designed to propel itself with not more than two wheels in contact with the ground, has a seat or saddle for the use of the operator, is not designed for use on a highway, and is ineligible for a certificate of title under Chapter 501. The term does not include:

(A) a moped or motorcycle;

(B) an electric bicycle or motor-driven cycle, as defined by Section 541.201;

(C) a motorized mobility device, as defined by Section 542.009;

(D) an electric personal assistive mobility device, as defined by Section 551.201; or

(E) a neighborhood electric vehicle.



Sec. 551.304. APPLICATION OF SUBCHAPTER TO POCKET BIKE OR MINIMOTORBIKE. This subchapter may not be construed to authorize the operation of a pocket bike or minimotorbike on any:

(1) highway, road, or street;

(2) path set aside for the exclusive operation of bicycles; or

(3) sidewalk.





Section 541.201 may (I say may because I don’t know for sure) allow a motorized bicycle to be defined as a Moped if the owner can obtain a certificate of title under chapter 501 classifying it as a moped. The owner would have to go through TxDot to see if this is possible, but it seems to meet the definition. If the vehicle is classified as a Moped it must be registered as such and all licensing requirements apply if it is operated on a street, highway, or roadway.



SUBCHAPTER C. VEHICLES, RAIL TRANSPORTATION, AND EQUIPMENT



Sec. 541.201. VEHICLES. In this subtitle:

(8) "Moped" means a motor-driven cycle that cannot attain a speed in one mile of more than 30 miles per hour and the engine of which:

(A) cannot produce more than two-brake horsepower; and

(B) if an internal combustion engine, has a piston displacement of 50 cubic centimeters or less and connects to a power drive system that does not require the operator to shift gears.





CHAPTER 521. DRIVER'S LICENSES AND CERTIFICATES



Sec. 521.084. CLASS M LICENSE. A Class M driver's license authorizes the holder of the license to operate a motorcycle or moped.

Sec. 521.085. TYPE OF VEHICLE AUTHORIZED. (a) Unless prohibited by Chapter 522, and except as provided by Subsection (b), the license holder may operate any vehicle of the type for which that class of license is issued and any lesser type of vehicle other than a motorcycle or moped.

(b) Subsection (a) does not prohibit a license holder from operating a lesser type of vehicle that is a motorcycle described by Section 521.001(a)(6-a).

Sec. 521.122. TYPE OF VEHICLE REQUIRED TO BE INDICATED ON LICENSE. (a) The department shall show on each driver's license the general type of vehicle that the license holder is authorized to operate.

(b) The department may include on the driver's license an authorization to operate a motorcycle or moped if the license holder has met all requirements for a Class M license.



Sec. 521.225. MOPED LICENSE. (a) A person may not operate a moped unless the person holds a driver's license. An applicant for a moped license must be 15 years of age or older.

(b) The department shall administer to an applicant for a moped license a written examination relating to the traffic laws applicable to the operation of mopeds. A test involving the operation of the vehicle is not required.

(c) An applicable provision of this chapter relating to a restricted Class M license applies also to a moped license, including a provision relating to the application, issuance, duration, suspension, cancellation, or revocation of that license.



The bottom line, as far as I can tell, is this; a motorized bicycle cannot be operated on the street unless the owner is able to get it titled as a moped and it is operated in accordance with the laws governing moped operations.





Scott Burroughs

Chief of Police

(361) 749-6241
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My response to this is FU.......I'm not jumping thru hoops to satisfy some no mind who has nothing better to do than hassle poor people trying to get around....
 

wheelbender6

Well-Known Member
Sep 4, 2008
4,059
221
63
TX
Borntofli -Here's a long shot, but it may work. Gopeds are legal under TX law, with and engine under 40cc, two wheels, and capable of being propelled by human power. If you can convince the officer that you have a 39cc engine, travelling on streets with a speed limit of 35mph or lower, you are in compliance with the law. I got one of those metal stamp kits from harbor freight and stamped "39cc" into the side of my cylinder in case I get pulled over.
 

biknut

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2010
6,653
475
83
Dallas
The bottom line, as far as I can tell, is this; a motorized bicycle cannot be operated on the street unless the owner is able to get it titled as a moped and it is operated in accordance with the laws governing moped operations.





Scott Burroughs

Chief of Police

(361) 749-6241
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


My response to this is FU.......I'm not jumping thru hoops to satisfy some no mind who has nothing better to do than hassle poor people trying to get around....
Have no fear, I was told the same thing by the Farmers Branch police department over 2 years ago, and I ride by them any day of the week with no problems.

The key words to officer Burroughs response are "as far as I can tell". What that means is, he doesn't know lol. Farmers Branch didn't know either.

There's no law in Texas that specifically relates to gas powered motor bicycles. What local authorities rely on are the laws for mopeds. Basically they're trying to say you're riding an unregistered moped.

There's going to be several problems for them trying to get a conviction using that charge. As long as certain conditions apply to your bike, you're in the clear.

Above all there's the definition of what a motor vehicle is defined as in Texas. Don't forget this, it's very important.

In Texas, "all motor vehicles are considered self propelled".


Next most important, is the official definition of a moped. Mopeds are defined as,

"a motor-driven cycle"

Motor driven cycle is just another way of saying self propelled vehicle.

This is where the rub is for them. Certain types of motor bicycles such as a china girl style motor bicycle, have to be pedaled from a stop up to at least a few mph before engaging the clutch. It's going to be hard for a prosecutor to get a conviction in a jury trial, if you can show that your bike must be pedaled to take off from every stop. Pedaling isn't considered self propelled.

So as long as the police officer can't say he saw you ride off from a stop without pedaling, then it's doubtful they can get a conviction.

If they fail in court with that kind of challenge it will set precedent for the whole state. That's the reason no prosecutor has been willing to try one of these cases to date. That's why they still say, "are far as I can tell" lol.

What I will do if I ever get a ticket for an unregistered moped is, I will tell the court of my intention to plead not guilty. This is what at least a few others have done, and in every case, the charges we dropped before the trial date.

So in the future, make sure you always pedal at least a little from every stop, and you shouldn't need to worry.
 

biknut

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2010
6,653
475
83
Dallas
Borntofli -Here's a long shot, but it may work. Gopeds are legal under TX law, with and engine under 40cc, two wheels, and capable of being propelled by human power. If you can convince the officer that you have a 39cc engine, travelling on streets with a speed limit of 35mph or lower, you are in compliance with the law. I got one of those metal stamp kits from harbor freight and stamped "39cc" into the side of my cylinder in case I get pulled over.
This defense won't work for a motor bicycle. Motor bicycles don't fit the definition of a goped.
 

biknut

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2010
6,653
475
83
Dallas
Have no fear, I was told the same thing by the Farmers Branch police department over 2 years ago, and I ride by them any day of the week with no problems.

The key words to officer Burroughs response are "as far as I can tell". What that means is, he doesn't know lol. Farmers Branch didn't know either.

There's no law in Texas that specifically relates to gas powered motor bicycles. What local authorities rely on are the laws for mopeds. Basically they're trying to say you're riding an unregistered moped.

There's going to be several problems for them trying to get a conviction using that charge. As long as certain conditions apply to your bike, you're in the clear.

Above all there's the definition of what a motor vehicle is defined as in Texas. Don't forget this, it's very important.

In Texas, "all motor vehicles are considered self propelled".


Next most important, is the official definition of a moped. Mopeds are defined as,

"a motor-driven cycle"

Motor driven cycle is just another way of saying self propelled vehicle.

This is where the rub is for them. Certain types of motor bicycles such as a china girl style motor bicycle, have to be pedaled from a stop up to at least a few mph before engaging the clutch. It's going to be hard for a prosecutor to get a conviction in a jury trial, if you can show that your bike must be pedaled to take off from every stop. Pedaling isn't considered self propelled.

So as long as the police officer can't say he saw you ride off from a stop without pedaling, then it's doubtful they can get a conviction.

If they fail in court with that kind of challenge it will set precedent for the whole state. That's the reason no prosecutor has been willing to try one of these cases to date. That's why they still say, "are far as I can tell" lol.

What I will do if I ever get a ticket for an unregistered moped is, I will tell the court of my intention to plead not guilty. This is what at least a few others have done, and in every case, the charges we dropped before the trial date.

So in the future, make sure you always pedal at least a little from every stop, and you shouldn't need to worry.
The reason I know what I know is, 2 years ago I had a long conversation with the officer in charge of the DPS motorcycle safety division in Austin. They explained that in Texas motor bicycles are in a gray area of the law. That it was going to be up to individual localities to interpret the law for themselves. At that time there had been no convictions anywhere in the state. And I haven't heard of any since then either. When I ask about using the defense I outlined, I was told "that might be a good defense to use". They didn't want to volunteer any more about how to defeat them. They said as far as the DPS is concerned motor bicycles are legal.
 

happycheapskate

New Member
Nov 26, 2009
1,989
3
0
Rockwall TX
Thank you! Yeah, sounds like the police in P. Aransas just don't know, and it just goes to show, never ask the police for legal advice. cvlt1

Goped
http://www.neoscooters.com/prodimages/Go-pedGSR46R.jpg

Motor Assisted Bicycle
http://cdn2.bigcommerce.com/server9...IKE002_edited__53027.1341268349.1280.1280.JPG

Moped
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/87/Novolette-moped.jpg

This defense won't work for a motor bicycle. Motor bicycles don't fit the definition of a goped.
 

biknut

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2010
6,653
475
83
Dallas
Tonight at 7 pm a bicycle group called Bike Friendly Greenville Ave, is planning a bicycle ride to look at Christmas lights. The ride starts at a bar on lower Greenville. I'm pretty sure the people in this group are casual inner city riders that will be utilizing the bar before starting the ride. I better go and make sure we, I mean they, don't drink too much.

It's about 13 miles from my house so I'll have to ride my MB don't you know. This will be my second outting with a local bicycle group.
 

happycheapskate

New Member
Nov 26, 2009
1,989
3
0
Rockwall TX
There's a bunch of those rides. Here's a 30-50 age group ride, at Highland Park, next Tuesday, 7pm.
http://www.meetup.com/Dallas-Cycling-Trail-Riders-and-Weekend-Pub-Crawlers/events/93080832/

Tuesday, December 11, 2012
7:00 PM To 9:00 PM

Cafe Express LLC
5600 West Lovers Lane #109, Dallas, TX (map)

Tonight at 7 pm a bicycle group called Bike Friendly Greenville Ave, is planning a bicycle ride to look at Christmas lights. The ride starts at a bar on lower Greenville. I'm pretty sure the people in this group are casual inner city riders that will be utilizing the bar before starting the ride. I better go and make sure we, I mean they, don't drink too much.

It's about 13 miles from my house so I'll have to ride my MB don't you know. This will be my second outting with a local bicycle group.
 

biknut

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2010
6,653
475
83
Dallas
I never made it to the Christmas light ride. I got about 7 miles from home, and my pedal side sprocket fell off the hub. I had to turn around and limp home.

But I did make to strokers earlier in the day.

 

biknut

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2010
6,653
475
83
Dallas

lambofgod121980

New Member
May 31, 2012
316
1
0
43
new caney TX
Went to the frankenbike swapmeet on saturday. Saw lots of sweet pedal power bikes that need motors lol. Was at local bike shop in Porter TX called sprockets. The guy who owns the bike shop is cool and wasn't oposed to me having an engine powered bike. First I've met in the area. Dude was so cool I ordered a bent springer for my cranbrook \m/ I still have yet to see another motorized bike but I'm sure there are people who have them. I see ads for them on craigs list and a few of my friends have said they have spotted 1 or 2 on the street besides me
 

biknut

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2010
6,653
475
83
Dallas
I'm planning to ride down to lower Greenville this afternoon to the Dublinr Irish Pub. I'll be there at 3 oclock. Sunday afternoon is when the unusual bikes, and scooters show up.
 

biknut

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2010
6,653
475
83
Dallas
I made it back. I had a great time. 30 miles round trip. I stayed about 2 hours. There was a bunch of alternative types of bikes there, but mine was the weirdest. A guy made me roll my bike into the front so he could get a picture with the Dubliner sign in the back ground so he could post it on his face book. He said my bike was the most unusual bike he had ever seen there, and this is a place famous for unusual bikes.

I cruised down there going no more than 32 mph all the way, but after getting gassed on Vodka martini's again, and raced home down to middle of every big street all the way home getting up to almost 37 mph. I guess my bike runs better on alcohol.

Don't try this at home kids, I'm a professional.

 

biknut

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2010
6,653
475
83
Dallas
I don't know if anybody has heard of Dan Herod, of Mustang Sally Productions, but he hosts car shows regularly around the metroplex.

I sent him an email asking if ever considered having a class for bicycles , and motor bicycles in his shows?

This is the reply he sent me.

"Bicycles and Motor Bicycles are welcomed in our shows! Right now they would need to register in the Special Interest Class but if we got some bicycles that came regularly I would be happy to have a class expressly for them! Dan"

Don't you think it would be a good idea if we got some motor bicycles together and entered them in a show?


https://mustangsallyproductions.com/
 

lambofgod121980

New Member
May 31, 2012
316
1
0
43
new caney TX
OMG - I wish I was in dallas and not houston. I have been looking for places to cruise to to get some sweet ideas. It would be hella cool to be able to see a bunch of bikes together and not just one here or there. Speaking of which I still haven't seen anyone by me riding around. - if anyone in the new caney, porter, splendora area is reading this - hit me up.
 

biknut

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2010
6,653
475
83
Dallas
We finally have one warm day. I think I'll ride down to Strokers for late lunch. Tomorrow the weather is going back in the tank for another week.
 

lambofgod121980

New Member
May 31, 2012
316
1
0
43
new caney TX
Lol I was thinking same thing - finally a day off work and its gonna be nice out \m/ won't be riding to strokers as its bout 300 miles away but deff be cruising around town here in north houston. Today is gonna be epic