Old Guys Simplex moto-peddle bike

Discussion in 'Board Trackers and Vintage Motorized Bicycles' started by indian22, Jan 3, 2015.

  1. fasteddy

    fasteddy Well-Known Member

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    First rate cylinders, Rick. The rest of the motor is going to be well worth the wait. Much what I had thought of for the electric tri car but the chances of that happening are less than slim so I'm looking at a different approach when the time comes. I just have to figure out what that is.

    A lot of skill in the production of this motor and given what Pat had happen with his frame and gas tank being pirated, between his motor and yours they should be for sale on the same site within 60 days of yours being completed.

    I did see a faux V twin on a bike in one of his ads a couple of months ago and it did have a Sportsman Flyer ebike motor look about it. I think the ad disappeared about the time the tank and frame combination came out. There was a sprocket showing on the left side of the crank case.

    Nothing is safe any more.

    Steve.
     
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  2. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Steve. Yes I saw that photo as well. Pat's frame and tanks etc. are so superior in all applicable metrics, including price when comparing apples to apples. Pat's photos show the elaborate measures he employs to build a superior product from design to materials used. The knockoffs ads show one or two poor quality photos from a distance, twenty words or less of description and a price. How's that long distance international call working out for you to gather details of what you're buying let alone a service problem?

    Pat rides what he builds along side his family and they've ridden their creations a lot through the years. Do you think he would risk the lives of his family riding on less than the best? He's got the world record in class at Bonneville, no brag verifiable fact, and he's made that trip to compete on the salt multiple times with his brother & they do the dry lakes speed trials as well. Safety inspections required to run, but really 80 mph plus on salt is comparable to a hundred on asphalt & with a two run mandatory backup speed to certify a record. This guy builds with quality.

    The Orientals can and do build quality in top line plants, but most of what we see being offered as imports for motor bicycles is small shop spec ordered motors and components, built by local cheap labor & low bid from start to finish. Low to no quality control in design or product.

    My experience is when the big guys can't stop the international pirates what chance is there for the small manufacturers to combat it. Trademarks & patents are no longer effective in the world marketplace. This country is in complete denial of the obvious fact that we are currently involved in an economic world war.

    Most consumer's won't spend extra for quality so the market is relatively small for quality products produced domestically.

    Others will copy good ideas and at times do it better and always at a lower price point. Piracy eliminates the high costs of the fundamental product concept and subsequent design, research and development costs. If the pirates are a little patient they even get marketing feedback from the initial round of sales by the legitimate product developers & this is a part of what's called risk management.

    Of course I could be wrong I'm just one old guy whistling in the dark. I'm just going to keep building things while I can and have fun and let others worry.

    Rick C.
     
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  3. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    36 V. lithium packs fits these leather saddle bags perfectly. I could have used these on my Fall ride to free up space for extra gear in my nylon rack bag & back pack, but they will be very useful on future bike adventures. I can quickly dismount these for local rides or swap them between my e-mountain bike and the Hybrid. Just better utilization of batteries I've already purchased as well as great range extenders. Pedal assisted on my mountain bike I'd think 170 mile per day quite possible now using three batteries and with motel charging overnight some extended cross country riding on the MB is in my future.

    With 4 batteries on the Hybrid I could ride a lot of the state highways at biking speeds, in required sections, while pedal assisted using the electric and not having to worry about the State Troopers. ICE just used for the secondary roads. That's my current thinking till a cop tells me I'm in violation.

    Rick C.


    saddlebags.jpg
     
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  4. curtisfox

    curtisfox Well-Known Member

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    That's KOOOOOOOL! Rick. Bags also. Would you bring them inside to charge, or use outside plug-in? Like your thinking for long range travel, Like your mock-up of the V twin, looking mighty fine, right proportions...........Curt
     
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  5. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Curt. I'll set these batteries up to switch between different bikes and the batteries all have the same connecters installed for both charging and running. Battery's just lift out of the bags so charging is either in the bag, on the bike or take out to charge, easy as loosing the straps & buckle.

    I still have to connect the two bags for easy rack mounting on two quite different rack arrangements...I'll give this some thought.

    I finally got around to adding large metal pads to the drive off stand of my Fat e-bike and the tail leaner stand on the mountain e-bike. I'll bet neither one will fall over now. I'd already put duck feet on the hybrid & tested them extensively during my fall ride...literally field tested & approved.

    The proportions of even the spark plugs is important. The originals were rather short and fat compared to most current plugs. I've chosen lawn mower, L head plugs as a suitable look, when installed. Along with 1.25" diameter exhaust stubs.
    The carb? I'll probably use a small motor carb that's altered a bit to appear a period piece...more searching to do.

    Rick C.
     
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  6. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Good day to stay in 40mph out of the N. & chills in the teens. Had the lights out for a couple of hours but back up and running now. I've been busy scaling out the valve train rocker and spring tower, actually quite a large affair. The complete engines of the day are so agricultural in design & pretty much rough as a cobb finish on the cast pieces, with a bit of polish and paint spattered about. Some might say ugly but I prefer the term charmingly simple. Just plain and utilitarian for the most part but surprising, almost wistful architectural details in spots. The spring tower & rocker assembly being one of them. The rocker seems almost a bobbing duck standing atop a cone while pecking at corn. Doing some justice to the heads is going to be fun.

    Rick C.
     
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  7. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    I ordered the leather and brass rivets to couple the battery pack saddle bags together on the hybrids rack, my high exhaust requires the bags to be mounted high enough to clear the pipe my a couple of inches for cooll air flow. When I switch the bags to the Mountain bike, no problems.

    Rick C.
     
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  8. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Weather 9 degrees and 0 wind chill with just light winds. Yesterday 60 mph winds made getting around outside difficult, but drew up some templates for making the required valve train parts, so I've got those to cut out this week along with the motors 45 degree base plates. I really need the base plate to mock up the two cylinders at a 45 angle for better perspective on component positioning while the cylinders are vertical & clamped to the work bench.

    Though there be no camshaft internally the relationship of visible valve train components should at least reflect the possibility that a cam mech is in place just as one should suppose valves exist in some relationship within the head/cylinder set & spark plugs to valve pockets too.

    I'll not probably not spend the time to fake the exhaust port to head passage casting a reality rather just let the fins obscure it's absence and rely on a decent representation of a lifter and exhaust port casting to carry the duplicitous weight of this motor features absence.

    All things are possible however if absolutely required.

    Rick C.
     
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  9. sportscarpat

    sportscarpat Bonneville Bomber the Salt Flat record breaker

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    Hi Guys,
    I see my name mentioned a couple times and appreciate the kind words. I must admit I never considered how the Chinese would steel my designs, copy them exactly or very close, then sell them on ebay or to other vendors who then sell them as Sportsman Flyer parts. They are not the only ones, either. I have had plenty of issues with vendors in this country. I am at the point I have discontinued some of my parts and others I only sell on complete builds. It really is frustrating. I try to keep my parts out of the wrong hands and invariably sometimes deny my parts to quality people. To those people I am sorry.
     
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  10. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Totally understand Pat you do this for a living and must take care of your interests first. Best of luck!



    Rick C.
     
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  11. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Some may be interested in an update about a build I posted about a couple of weeks ago. I presented the company with some options that I felt would serve them better. One of these was putting them in contact with Comeback Motors in Argentina. They actually have an office in Buenos Aires & they were able to purchase a 1917 Indian replica that only had a couple of hundred miles on it. I think the difference was that the replicas built by Comeback use modern internals and can be ridden anywhere and are rebuildable. Feather in my cap with the company and a small consulting broker fee to boot. Everybody happy!

    The original & complete Harley F head I'd spotted for rebuilding is being shipped to a collector in Florida, same guy that bought my rebuilt knucklehead HD engine a couple years back and a finders fee coming for this engine as well, plus a favor to be collected later 'cause I called him first.

    Selling parts is ok I just really don't want the hassles involved with building to suit others. I really prefer to just complete a few projects of my own.

    Rick C.
     
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  12. curtisfox

    curtisfox Well-Known Member

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    Amen to that, wait till you get my age, you will find way more so, just don't have the strength or speed it would take to do a lot of that anymore. Besides the old thinker is slowed down also.........Curt
     
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  13. Bob53

    Bob53 New Member

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    Rick, You did them solid. But, we're sure going to miss watching another first class cool build. I guess winter is here in Okla. Not many more rides on nice days I'm afraid. But what a time to build inside out of the cold. Bob
     
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  14. PeteMcP

    PeteMcP Well-Known Member

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    Everybody happy, you said Rick. Including us forum members in the peanut gallery who are pleased to see your faux V-twin jump nearer the head of the build queue.
     
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  15. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Curt I've not noticed you're thinker being impaired in the least, but it's a good cover story to use at times.

    Rick C.
     
  16. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Bob I appreciate you. I was hoping for a little bit of real Fall weather for some rides and building out doors but perhaps it's not to be this year. Yes indoor work it will be & the last couple of days that's been it. I',m hoping for the wind to lay for a couple of hours before dark so I can get some welding done out side.

    Met Dave B. recently over at Elk nice guy and he built a fine Simplex with the Hummer engine, better than the photos I'd say. Hope to meet you guys some day....maybe take a ride in the Spring.

    Rick C.
     
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  17. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Pete I was just talking with a friend about your modeling, bike builds & Steve's tri-car Indian at lunch today. He was blown away by the quality of all the photos shown.

    I feel nothing but relief at not having to turn down doing a bike build for these guys. They really treated me well on the bike lease arrangement & I wanted to make sure they were left in good hands. The result really couldn't have gone smoother. I didn't want to mess up my hobby by building for others. I'm not at the chasing money stage of life; been there done that and still bear the scars. Now if I screw something up I just build another more carefully & I'd hope better. No pressure to count hours or pennies just work when it pleases me and enjoy the results.

    It's also a relief that I didn't leave them in a lurch and was able to put them together with three reputable builders each with much to offer, though each unique in what they had to sell: all three build accurate replica board track bikes, but two use fantastic replica V-twin engines and the other features actual rebuilt vintage motors. It was their decision to make, and though they had led me to believe they were only interested in 1915 HD with vintage motor, they ultimately selected a lightly used replica 1917 Indian Daytona frame and engine.

    Yes I do think we're happy. I know I am.

    Rick C.
     
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  18. Bob53

    Bob53 New Member

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    Dave is a great guy. I've been meaning to go see the finished product with the hummer. I was there just before the project got started. Wish I lived close enough to have been a part of it. Looks like an outstanding job. He's got some other cool toys too. He is supposed to be moving soon. House he's always wanted and a bigger shop. We'll come to the big city some day. Would really like to meet you and talk shop. Can't wait to follow the new build. You just keep raising the bar.
     
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  19. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Bob I'm not so certain he's not already in that house & shop. Both are quite nice and he was installing central air in the shop the day we visited with him. Since I sold my machine shop, I'm in the tightest of quarters for building anything and storage is in multiple locations in town. I waste so much time trying to locate what I have...which is a lot, that often I just order another. It's quicker. I envied Dave's quite empty shop, one reason that makes me think he just moved in. I use space from time to time in other shops and use their machine tools, but try to not take undue advantage of their workplace.

    Bring bikes or you can use a couple of mine and we'll ride a bit!

    Rick C.
     
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  20. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    I spent a couple of hours cutting out small pieces for the cylinders including the 45 degree base that is absolutely vital to going forward with the top end work of this fake engine housing for a real motor. It's quite rough still but starting to see some semblance of symmetry. I've a few days of decent weather forecast for afternoon working outside. I have some visual impairment that is greatly aided by natural lighting,especially when working on small things, forget miniature altogether. I'm expecting some real progress on this housing.

    Rick C.
     
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