Just purchased a Western Flyer Hiawatha

[porch lizard]

I went by our local junk yard and found a Western Flyer Hiawatha made by Shelby I think. The #'s on the bottom of crank housing = H05108 AC with I think a w inside the C (its hard to see it ).
The Hiawatha badge # is: 15 WG6 24 1036 . It looks like a fine bike for motorizing, but after "Googling" it may be worth more as a bike. Does anyone know what year it is and/or the value? I haven't found one like it yet so I need input before going further.

 

[porch lizard]

I had to take fenders and wheels off to get it in my Chevy Sprint. The wheels are junk but straight rims. Here's some more pictures. I've seen a red 1954 that's close to it but different chain and sprocket and guard.

 

[rustycase]

Nice bike!

...yah, might be best to check on it's value AS IS before axing it up for a custom mab...
I've axed up and dumped a LOT of stuff I should NOT have, over the years.
Best
rc

 

[Red Light Bandit]

It's only worth what someone will pay for it! just my two cents. Cut it up and bring some new life into it.

 

[porch lizard]

rustycase...I know what you mean, I chopped up an old Murray 3 sp for an electric pusher trailer and even though I had alot of fun with it, I should have looked for a different bike to part out.

 

[Allen_Wrench]

I'm so jealous. You've got the bolt adjusters on your drop-outs. You've got a killer vintage seat (very much worth restoring, I think). You've got a fantastic fluted chain guard. You've even got a tank which, with skill, could be turned into a fuel tank or used as an ideal pattern for one.
I confess, if it were me, I'd motorize. You only live once. And what's yours is yours. But hey, with a little elbow grease you'll have yourself a real gem there. Take good care of her.

 

[porch lizard]

Allenwrench....Thanks for agreeing with me. This Hiawatha does have alot of good points about it for motorizing. I bought it just for the strong frame, the in frame gas tank possibility, and the adjustable drop outs. I bought two more bikes today from the same junk yard...another Hiawatha without the in frame tank, but everything else on the bike is similar, except different chain guard and it has a rear rack (maybe a 50's bike),and a girls frame bike with a springer front fork that is old, and I've never seen one like it. Too late to haul them in and take pictures, so it will have to wait. I'd like to know the age of both the Hiawathas and the make of the girls bike. Three bikes in one week, now I need engines! And I'm already over budget for the month.

 

[silverbear]

Nice find. Why do you say it is Western Flyer? Hiawatha was sold through Gambils hardware stores. Some years Shelby made the frames. You have a skip tooth sprocket, so that likely places it in the late thirties to early forties... pre-war. I guess it's worth finding what it might bring on ebay, but I'm with Allen, I'd give it a motor, good wheels and make it into a really sweet old motorbike. The seat is well worth restoring and not that hard to do. Nice tank, but if you make one then you can sell that tank on ebay, or as Allen suggested, make that tank functional. I'd like to see photos of the other ones. Might be the best thing is to motorize the other men's bike and use the springer from the ladies model. Need to see the pictures. If you can get a cool motorbike from the other two, sell this one. Nice find, whatever you do.
SB

 

[porch lizard]

Silverbear... I call it a Western Flyer only because of the front sprocket design. I found a site(don't remember what one) that listed different designs for various distributers and the sprocket I have, matches the Western Auto brand of the bike they called Western Flyer. It seems there were only a few makers of bikes, but every dealer had their own design on the chain ring. For instance, J.C. Higgins had their name cut in to the chain ring. Unless this bike is worth alot,(what's alot mean) I plan on using it for a MB build. I still would like to know more about it especially before sanding and painting as some people prefer the old paint even if rusty. The web site for sprockets is : The Sprocket guide-Comcast.net

 

[porch lizard]

Silverbear...don't you also have tips on seat restoration? Waaaay back I ran across some info that mentioned elk hide and the thread was very informative, but I can't remember where to find it.

 

[silverbear]

http://motorbicycling.com/f38/rebuilding-vintage-seat-24473.html
Here's the link, hope it is helpful.
I don't think this is Western Flyer or it would have the Western Flyer head badge. Hiawatha was a brand name, not a model, and was sold by Gambil's hardware stores. I guess there used to be a lot of them as it was a chain. In the late thirties Shelby supplied the frames. I don't know what year this is, but you can find some stuff on Hiawatha on Google. Whatever year it is you've got yourself a real nice bike. Are there a couple of holes on the front fender where there used to be a fender ornament?
SB

 

[porch lizard]

silverbear...Thanks for posting the seat thread for me. I guess I'm getting myself confused on this bike, I've googled alot of different ways to find out for sure but am getting no definite dates or makers. Thanks for your input on it, and yes it does have 2 holes on the front fender, and one hole on the back fender. They also have a bend down the middle length of the fender and a pinstripe on each side.

 

[Allen_Wrench]

silverbear...Thanks for posting the seat thread for me. I guess I'm getting myself confused on this bike, I've googled alot of different ways to find out for sure but am getting no definite dates or makers. Thanks for your input on it, and yes it does have 2 holes on the front fender, and one hole on the back fender. They also have a bend down the middle length of the fender and a pinstripe on each side.

The front fender probably had a torpedo headlight on it. The back probably had a glass reflector.

 

[brett7777]

DO IT ! MOTORIZE IT ! You know you want to.
It has a nice loop in the frame too.
The seat looks too far gone to me. Just my humble opinion.

 

[silverbear]

Rest assured that you have a Hiawatha, probably late 1930's. The head badge and tank decal tell you the make. And the skip tooth sprocket and chain give it a genera time period. And who's to say the sprocket didn't get changed along the way, especially if the crank got damaged? Boys then weren't all that different from the boys now. They wanted cool stuff, too.

Very likely the two holes in the front fender were for the fender ornament Hiawatha used on the full sized bikes at that time, as in the photo below from a 1939 ladies model. Mine had a kick stand and not a drop stand, so Hiawatha must have switched over fairly early. These bikes are not as common as the old Schwinns, Elgins, Monarchs and such, which is nice I think.

Brett,
As long as the hardware is all still there and the springs are good, that seat can be saved and is worth the effort. I've brought ones back from the dead in worse shape than that. Strip it down after soaking the nuts in penetrating oil... run everything through a wire wheel to remove rust... prime it and give it a coat of enamel. Then some good padding better than it had originally and cover it in a nice leather either new or salvaged from a jacket, ladies purse or whatever and it will be better than new for very little money. And it won't just look like a vintage seat... it will be the original seat that came with the bike back in 1930 something. Woohoo! If the chrome or nickel plating is shot, wire wheel or sand that part down some and paint it.

That's gonna be a cool motorbike. Take your time with it and it will be well worth your effort... a head turner for sure.
SB

 

[porch lizard]

Brett... You're right, I do want to motorize it! I've been searching the net to find similar ones, and no luck on finding this particular one. Some go for as little as $90.00 and really nice ones go for around $300.00 to $800.00 I even ran across one that they were asking $7,200.00 for! I don't know why they thought that one was so valuable, but it did look nice. The front fork badge has these numbers on mine: 15-WG6 - 24 - 1036 . Maybe manufactured in Oct (10) 1936 (36). That would make it 75 years old. The frame numbers-- H05108 ACw (the C has w inside it). All the Gambles models seem to have WG3 on the badge, and none fo them have the same badge as mine. It makes me wonder??? Oh yea...the Gamble models seem to have frame numbers that are H105000 numbers. There's a web site thats trying to figure out what the numbers mean. There's a book out there somewhere that supposedly identifies most old bikes, but I haven't found it yet. I think I agree with Silverbear about the bike seat, after reading his post again on how to restore bike seats, I think I'll try it. There's two layers of metal on the seat, the top one is toast, but could be remade and the bottom one looks solid enough to save. Lots of rust, but after two days of soaking with WD40 finally got the seat off the bike with out breaking anything. I did break off the screw that holds the front fender on, so will have to drill that one out, and the screws that hold the tank on will probably break because I can't get to the threads inside. Silverbear ... I'll try to get going on the seat and any suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[porch lizard]

Here's the badge on the front forks of my Hiawatha.

 

[silverbear]

If you upholster the seat the way I did it in that thread, you won't be sandwiching the leather between the two layers of metal as it was done originally, so they don't have to come apart. But you do want to get rid of whatever is flaking off. In looking at that one I think what I would do if it were mine is to fill in the areas where the metal is gone with a good epoxy like JB`Weld. Sand it out fairly smooth so that the shape is right, paint it and then cover it with a closed cell foam or rubber padding to whatever thickness seems right. Then cover it with the leather as in the how to thread. No one will ever know the upper layer of metal was partly gone and it will last as long as you have the bike.

I like the head badge.

What kind of shape are the other two bikes in?
SB

 

[porch lizard]

Here's pictures of the girls bike (brand unknown) that I bought for the springer front end:

 

[porch lizard]

Here's pictures of the second Hiawatha I bought. The Badge #'s 25 - WG6 - 1048 and the frame #'s F54 ACw (with 'w' inside the C). It has the same badge design as the other one, same chain ring, different chain guard, a rear rack, and metal cups on the seat springs. Its been painted primer on top, then black, and original paint is red. Its a complete bike with fenders, skip tooth chain, and trashed out wheels,(no tank on this one) Seat looks like it's been recovered.