Indian Tadpole

Discussion in 'Motorized Tandems, Trikes and Recumbent Bicycles' started by silverbear, Dec 3, 2010.

  1. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Yep the seat post motor with the camel back tank box or open van was what I had in mind, V frame, very realistic, but myself I'd opt for Pat's standard size loop frame, very cool look with a round crank case single seat post motor. The bottom straddle tube could be left in place and used for a fill in signage plate or just eliminated. V frame or loop very cool project Steve.

    52v. is a good choice as well. Is your motor a direct drive or is it a planetary geared motor?

    "Squeeze a little more out of the motor". These motors though marked 48v. or 60v. etc. can all be over volted if the controller is matched to the amount of over-volt and increased amp. The motor just runs as instructed by controller and fed by the appropriate battery pack. Matching the components is important and there are limits to how far one takes this. Add voltage get more motor speed add amps, current, more power.

    Rick C.
     
    #3301 indian22, Feb 16, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2020
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  2. fasteddy

    fasteddy Well-Known Member

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  3. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Steve that's a great looking frame you've started. Nominally750 watts to the horse so 1.6 hp at 1200 watts. So you'll be carrying quite a lot of weight to power. I like the powered hubs on the street & mid-drives for off road, but both can work for either just not as well. Design parameters on classic builds are to be considered. I think the hub motors look like drum brakes, so time period doesn't necessarily rule them out just as disk brakes are seen on all manner of classic style builds and are obviously not correct, but many opt for safety and they look fine.

    The hubs put a lot of strain on the drops so a lot of strength is required at that point, plus torque arm for larger hub motors of 2kw or larger. I suggest some form of gear reduction either built into or added onto either a mid drive or hub for a heavy project that's to be conducted at 25mph or less. The direct drive motors aren't all that off the line on heavy bikes. 3kw or 4hp continuous duty rating on motor and controller @ 48v. or more can move a substantial weight with some gear reduction and without resorting to electronic hot rod mods. Knowing the mods are out there makes it not a financial disaster if you ever require more power. The 3kw motor can dependably deliver considerably more power than it's rated at & geared right 4hp can do some work!

    Loop for the 212cc is sweet!

    Rick C.
     
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  4. Tom from Rubicon

    Tom from Rubicon Well-Known Member

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    #3304 Tom from Rubicon, Feb 16, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2020
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  5. Tony01

    Tony01 Well-Known Member

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    With a modern efficient controller you can make a smaller motor perform far more than its rating. A ported, 18lb spring, stock internals 212 is like a 6-8000w peak ebike. Depending on setup and build of course. Bet you could push that 1200w to 4000w at least. 74v is nothing scary except that everything is more expensive. I am currently running 77.7v. How fast do you want to go, and how fast do you want to get there?
     
  6. fasteddy

    fasteddy Well-Known Member

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    Hi Tony,

    Here in Canada the legal limit is 32km/ 20mph. The motor can't be anymore than 500W. The reality is of course if the police can't hear an engine and your not tearing up the highway there isn't a huge chance they would bother you.

    Twenty mph is fine with me. Given that many of our drivers here were members of the elite if they were using a donkey and cart made out of a truck rear axle in the old country before they moved here and the B.M.W's and Mercedes are a whole new experience. Paved roads absolutely amaze them. Most of them were using Flying Pigeon bicycles or walking.

    Then again at 76 the need for speed was satisfied many years ago to be replaced by the need to get there safely if I can remember where I was going.

    I can't imagine the tri cars handle like a sports car so until I find out how they do I'm going to going with an eye on the safe side. I believe the controller is programmable so I could add battery capacity as I need it.

    Steve.
     
  7. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Steve Tony got skills and this is the direction I'm going thanks to Tony. Now for me speed isn't the goal, but read this as power, that could be used for speed, but in my world of riding power gained, which is seen in the increase of watts is most important, and that coupled with gear reduction will give a small motor an impressive amount of grunt. I've chosen to power up and gear down to fine tune my motor for my style of riding.

    Oh yeah it is more expensive, but seems you expressed a desire to build your own battery pack awhile back if I'm not mistaken?

    Rick C.
     
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  8. fasteddy

    fasteddy Well-Known Member

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    Hi Rick,

    Tony has a far better handle on this than I do for certain. I don't know how much use the bike would get but distances would be under a mile around here. It's just too dangerous unless you use the side streets and most of them dead end into another street and you would be zig zagging back and forth to get anywhere.

    Main streets here are like riding in Beijing and New Deli in rush hour with people from both countries. Toss in the soccer moms in the Land Rovers who are late leaving the latest must do exercise class who are rushing to pick up their kids from school and it's really interesting to be on anything with two wheels.

    Driving a Dodge van with a raised fibreglass roof and the headlights on you would think that you'd be highly visible but except to the brainless swarms who pull out in front of me then look at me like they can't believe I'm 2 feet from their drivers door after they pulled out in front of me. That's why I parked the van a week before Christmas and didn't drive again until the end of the first week in February.

    I am going to make my own battery simply because I can add to it as I go if the need arises.

    Steve.
     
  9. fasteddy

    fasteddy Well-Known Member

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    Tom, I wonder if there are any more Minneapolis tri cars stashed away too. I would guess that there were not of them made to start with compared to the Indian tri cars and there are few of them.

    Steve.
     
  10. fasteddy

    fasteddy Well-Known Member

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    I mentioned the Monark with a sidecar that I built but didn't say where to find it. Look in the Board Trackers and Vintage Motorized Bicycle just below this section.

    The side car thread is pinned at the top of the page. My build started about half way down page 2. Just look for "fasteddy" in the heading.
    The canoe sidecar is one I helped my friend Silverbear build.

    Steve.

    https://oi866.photobucket.com/albums/ab228/speedydick/NikonPictures025-2.jpg

    https://oi866.photobucket.com/albums/ab228/speedydick/NikonPictures023-1.jpg
     
    #3310 fasteddy, Feb 17, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2020
  11. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    As if Steve needed any help with his bona fides! Both the Monark and canoe sidecars are epic builds with talent on display. The collaboration on the canoe build shows what two friends and much talent can accomplish with a bit of determination thrown in. Just a couple of their fine builds. I miss Silverbear's posts.

    I do love me some polished classic wood power launch, in or out of the water!

    Rick C.
     
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  12. fasteddy

    fasteddy Well-Known Member

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    Rick, I often pictured myself in a 30' barrel backed mahogany three cockpit speed boat with a pair of Packard V12's for power with it's polished magnificence glistening in the brightness of a summer day.

    I settled with reality and wound up with a Monark bicycle and a mahogany side car.

    Steve.
     
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  13. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah but you don't require water to float your boat!

    Rick C,
     
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  14. fasteddy

    fasteddy Well-Known Member

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    Went through the gas line for the tri car and wound up having to replace some of it. The glass gas filter leaked but it was an old one that came with a gas tank

    No matter what I did to make a new gasket it still leaked so I installed a new one I had. Haven't tried it yet but I'll find out how it works when I fill up the gas tank. Perhaps it will be one of life's more exciting moments but you take them where ever you can find them at my age.

    The new filter of course is of an amazingly poor quality where the gas cut off screw is concerned. The screw that holds the glass bowl tight has a somewhat usable place for your fingers to fit to turn it but the gas shut off screw needed a pair of pliers to grip it or maybe it just needed younger hands.

    I cut a piece off an old bike fender and folded it over and clamped it onto the gas cut off screw to form a T handle. Spot welded it on the cut off screw and it works well now. Forgot to take the camera with me so I'll get a photo tomorrow. Remade the gas filter to carb line so it runs down to the carb instead of slightly up hill.

    We've had some nice sunny days and today it actually made it to 50F. I have about three more hours of work on the bike and by then I should have run out of things to "correct." Might have to wait Sunday out. The one time I dropped some gas down the spark plug hole and started it, it sounded like a berserk chainsaw on steroids. The engine is a 2 stoke snow blower engine so that is to be expected. The muffler is a greatly cut down stock muffler so that adds to the joy but not the neighbours listening pleasure..

    Steve.
     
  15. indian22

    indian22 Well-Known Member

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    Final approach Steve!

    Rick C.
     
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  16. curtisfox

    curtisfox Well-Known Member

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    You can sand the glass bowel with wet and dry sand paper, and water if it is warped. Good to here it barks. LOL.............Curt
     
  17. fasteddy

    fasteddy Well-Known Member

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    It is Rick. Just going out to the garage to hopefully finish it once and for all.

    Steve.
     
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  18. fasteddy

    fasteddy Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for that tip Curt. Hadn't thought about that angle to the problem.

    Steve.
     
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  19. fasteddy

    fasteddy Well-Known Member

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    Here are a couple of photos of the new fuel filter to engine gas line and the T handle I added to the fuel filter to make it easier to turn off and on. I'll try and include a photo of the original gas cut off screw that was so small I couldn't turn it.

    Bike goes out tomorrow if the weather is decent for a bench test run and we'll see how the clutch works and if there are any problems with the drive train.

    Road test is a week or so off until I can get it off the work bench. Went together in pieces but getting it off now that it's all together will be a challenge. Long ramps are in the near future.

    Steve.

    https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url...ved=0CAIQjRxqFwoTCLjk2c3D6-cCFQAAAAAdAAAAABAD
     

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  20. PeteMcP

    PeteMcP Well-Known Member

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    The one week countdown to the big reveal has begun Steve....
    When the time came, free beer was enough inducement to round up a few friends from the village to help me lift my Aero Cycle Car down from its build trestles.
    FSCN5336.JPG
     
    #3320 PeteMcP, Feb 25, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2020

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