Indian Hiawatha
- Thread starter silverbear
- Start date
Dan,
Silverbear will indeed figure it out. While he's standing in front of the nut and bolt drawers at Ace Hardware looking at the springs saying I "figure" this looks like the right one.
How many of us on here have made the same trip and usually 3 or more time before we got the right one. Nice part is you get to rub shoulders with the other 5 guys who are all in the same boat as you are.
You know the story they have to tell.
I was taking off this small spring and it slipped out of my fingers, took off, hit my foot then it bounced off the paint cans on the work bench, back onto the floor then up to the gas tank and went into the spark plug hole and I didn't sleep last night night so I got up at 3am and went out and took the head off and the when I got to the spring, half of it was missing so now I'm hoping I can find one here since I'm working on a 1912 Nipper.
Fast"been there"eddy
Silverbear will indeed figure it out. While he's standing in front of the nut and bolt drawers at Ace Hardware looking at the springs saying I "figure" this looks like the right one.
How many of us on here have made the same trip and usually 3 or more time before we got the right one. Nice part is you get to rub shoulders with the other 5 guys who are all in the same boat as you are.
You know the story they have to tell.
I was taking off this small spring and it slipped out of my fingers, took off, hit my foot then it bounced off the paint cans on the work bench, back onto the floor then up to the gas tank and went into the spark plug hole and I didn't sleep last night night so I got up at 3am and went out and took the head off and the when I got to the spring, half of it was missing so now I'm hoping I can find one here since I'm working on a 1912 Nipper.
Fast"been there"eddy
lmao Steve, those spring sections need a "spring gauge" to try to match to the little ones we've lost, eh?
Dang GearNut and his "down the spark plug hole", had a nightmare last night...
Hopefully you'll have enough adjustment on your plates SilverBear, but it probably wouldn't hurt to pull them for inspection/cleanage, so you know exactly what you have in there. And at least that'll give you an estimate on how many miles you can get out of them.
Watching intently,
Greg.
Dang GearNut and his "down the spark plug hole", had a nightmare last night...
Hopefully you'll have enough adjustment on your plates SilverBear, but it probably wouldn't hurt to pull them for inspection/cleanage, so you know exactly what you have in there. And at least that'll give you an estimate on how many miles you can get out of them.
Watching intently,
Greg.
I did some serious procrastinating today, putting off the possible and probable loss of springs or similar calamity... went for a long bike ride on the Panther and when I got back the Hiawatha was just as I had left it. So I sucked it up and tried to behave in an adult like manner responsibly, grownup,etc.
I sent an email to Dave the Motorman with the photos below for reference.
"Dave,
I took the transmission cover off today and have attached photos. Judging from the inside of the cover it is very dirty and no doubt your analysis is quite correct.
I see two retaining clips which are positioned at roughly 11:00 and 2:00 in the photos and are more or less rectangular in shape. Where are the springs you mention and which I certainly do not want to go flying off never to be found again? Is the reason you do not leave the engine in place while cleaning because of the mess and possible damage to paint on the bike or is it because of the springs flying off? Thanks for your good advise."
So, now I can procrastinate some more and say that I'm waiting for word back from Dave. Maybe I'll go for another bike ride while I wait...
SB
I sent an email to Dave the Motorman with the photos below for reference.
"Dave,
I took the transmission cover off today and have attached photos. Judging from the inside of the cover it is very dirty and no doubt your analysis is quite correct.
I see two retaining clips which are positioned at roughly 11:00 and 2:00 in the photos and are more or less rectangular in shape. Where are the springs you mention and which I certainly do not want to go flying off never to be found again? Is the reason you do not leave the engine in place while cleaning because of the mess and possible damage to paint on the bike or is it because of the springs flying off? Thanks for your good advise."
So, now I can procrastinate some more and say that I'm waiting for word back from Dave. Maybe I'll go for another bike ride while I wait...
SB
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Maybe you can get lucky by just spraying with break cleaner... those discs do look gunked a bit.
Procrastinators unite!... tomorrow... or maybe next weekend.
Procrastinators unite!... tomorrow... or maybe next weekend.
Looks kind of like a car clutch in a way except only one bolt holding it on. I am thinking if you can get a couple of C clamps on it and undo the center bolt and slowly undo the clamps nothing will fly ........Just my thoughts...........Curt
Silverbear,
You might want to ask him what kind of grease they are packed in. If I remember correctly there is a grease nipple on the outside of the case and Dave said that he had packed one of them in grease so it didn't need to be done for a while.
Looking at your photos I'd pull the motor first since it will almost certainly have to be on it's side so you can put the springs in and the clutch spring plate back on that retains them.
When it's on it's side I'd turn the lock nut off and loosen the clutch rod. You may be able to push down on the plate by hand until you can pull the two locking pins.
If there is still pressure I'd do as Curt said and put C clamps on it until the pressure is released on the two locking pins that hold the spring cover and you can pull them out and then release the C clamps and pull the springs and clutch plates out.
Make sure the spark plug is in the hole. LOL
Steve.
You might want to ask him what kind of grease they are packed in. If I remember correctly there is a grease nipple on the outside of the case and Dave said that he had packed one of them in grease so it didn't need to be done for a while.
Looking at your photos I'd pull the motor first since it will almost certainly have to be on it's side so you can put the springs in and the clutch spring plate back on that retains them.
When it's on it's side I'd turn the lock nut off and loosen the clutch rod. You may be able to push down on the plate by hand until you can pull the two locking pins.
If there is still pressure I'd do as Curt said and put C clamps on it until the pressure is released on the two locking pins that hold the spring cover and you can pull them out and then release the C clamps and pull the springs and clutch plates out.
Make sure the spark plug is in the hole. LOL
Steve.
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Much as I'd like to leave the engine mounted on the bike I can see the wisdom in removing it. I contacted Dave asking about the grease and got this reply:
"Just smear about a 1/2 cup full of wheel bearing grease around the gears & inside the casing does not require a lot."
Today my plate is full with garden work, but as soon as I can I'll remove the engine and have it ready for the next rainy day or free evening. And I will not lose the springs!
SB
"Just smear about a 1/2 cup full of wheel bearing grease around the gears & inside the casing does not require a lot."
Today my plate is full with garden work, but as soon as I can I'll remove the engine and have it ready for the next rainy day or free evening. And I will not lose the springs!
SB
I thought I'd share an update on the clutch cleaning enterprise. No lost springs and the clutch plates are now clean and functioning. The one little question mark regards a bit of metal I found at the bottom of the transmission case while scraping out old grease. It sure does look like a small woodruff key to my eye. Now, did it come loose and fall down there or has it been sitting there since 1934 when the engine was assembled. Without taking the whole transmission apart (horrors at the thought) how can I know?
So, I put the key in a plastic bag, labeled for what it is and re-installed the engine. Once everything was hooked up again I checked clutch and shift function and all seemed well.
Time for a test run. I live on a mountain here in Maryland and everything is hills including a long declining driveway perfect for bump starting the motor without pedaling. It didn't pop off as before, so I pushed it back up the hill and tried again. Checked the choke and petcock, fresh gas in the tank. Tried again. Worn out pushing the bike, I put it away before the rains started.
A few days later I thought I'd try again, thinking that maybe gas had not gotten down into the carb when I tried it before. I put it in low, drifted down the hill a ways and let out the clutch. Nothing. Stopped and realized it was not engaging in low, but was in high. Not the clutch as that is OK. Today or soon anyway (depends on rain) I'll check the shift rod to see if adjusting it takes care of the problem with engaging low gear.
A nagging thought is that maybe that woodruff key fits into the shift lever at the transmission and fell out. I'll figure it out eventually and have set the problem aside for now as I have too many things going on. With help from Tinsmith I'm trying to finish up tack welding a gas tank together for another bike, a 1950 Panther, and am packing up tools, parts and such for my spring migration home to Minnesota at the beginning of May where I'll be for the next six months.
I'm a little discouraged, but just temporarily. Pretty soon I'll have the leaf spring fork for it, I know the engine runs and now know the clutch works. I'll figure it out or take the problem to Dave the motorman if I can't. I never figured this would be a quick build or that there wouldn't e problems to work out. It will run...
SB
So, I put the key in a plastic bag, labeled for what it is and re-installed the engine. Once everything was hooked up again I checked clutch and shift function and all seemed well.
Time for a test run. I live on a mountain here in Maryland and everything is hills including a long declining driveway perfect for bump starting the motor without pedaling. It didn't pop off as before, so I pushed it back up the hill and tried again. Checked the choke and petcock, fresh gas in the tank. Tried again. Worn out pushing the bike, I put it away before the rains started.
A few days later I thought I'd try again, thinking that maybe gas had not gotten down into the carb when I tried it before. I put it in low, drifted down the hill a ways and let out the clutch. Nothing. Stopped and realized it was not engaging in low, but was in high. Not the clutch as that is OK. Today or soon anyway (depends on rain) I'll check the shift rod to see if adjusting it takes care of the problem with engaging low gear.
A nagging thought is that maybe that woodruff key fits into the shift lever at the transmission and fell out. I'll figure it out eventually and have set the problem aside for now as I have too many things going on. With help from Tinsmith I'm trying to finish up tack welding a gas tank together for another bike, a 1950 Panther, and am packing up tools, parts and such for my spring migration home to Minnesota at the beginning of May where I'll be for the next six months.
I'm a little discouraged, but just temporarily. Pretty soon I'll have the leaf spring fork for it, I know the engine runs and now know the clutch works. I'll figure it out or take the problem to Dave the motorman if I can't. I never figured this would be a quick build or that there wouldn't e problems to work out. It will run...
SB
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I hopr you get the bugs out soon I would like to see you posting this soon .
GOT it STARTED an UNDER ITS OWN POWER! I know how agravating it can be chasing bugs out of a project .
Gary
GOT it STARTED an UNDER ITS OWN POWER! I know how agravating it can be chasing bugs out of a project .
Gary
Wow! Those clutch plates are teeny-tiny!
I have faith that you will be enjoying this ride soon enough. You have a good idea of what to do next and good help if you need it.
I have faith that you will be enjoying this ride soon enough. You have a good idea of what to do next and good help if you need it.
It will be awhile before I get back to work on it as I'm now in the middle of packing things up for the migration home to Minnesota. In less than two weeks I'll be home. I decided to hook up the sidecar to the Hiawatha today while the weather is clear. It is now sitting on the bike trailer. At the front end the Panther will go crosswise and underneath the sidecar tool boxes, parts, tires, motors and whatever I can cram on there to leave more room in the jeep for the welder, more boxes of personals and enough room on top of all that for me to nap mid way. Before loading the Hiawatha onto the trailer I did a mock up of the sidecar with the Panther. I think a little tweaking to the sidecar frame will allow me to use it with either bike. The frames are pretty similar. I do like my canoe sidecar and look forward to riding it through my home town, Ely, Mn. which is a tourist canoe town. I live right on the edge of the million acre Boundary Waters Canoe Area, a paradise of interconnected lakes. The sidecar should be a big hit, especially with Aaniimoosh The Wonder Dog riding in it with her cool doggles. Ha, what fun!
SB
SB
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Wow.That is a sweet looking ride. I can see that will be the first order of business this summer if you are able to wait that long.
Should the inside of the canoe be padded and draped in purple velvet as is befitting Her Royal Highness, Aaniimoosh?
Steve.
Should the inside of the canoe be padded and draped in purple velvet as is befitting Her Royal Highness, Aaniimoosh?
Steve.
Heh heh. Looking good silverbear. Best of luck with the migration, don't forget too many things
Silverbear,
I've bought a small barrel of dog cookies for the summer and I mean a small barrel.
Think the doggie cousins will have to help while they're there.
Steve.
I've bought a small barrel of dog cookies for the summer and I mean a small barrel.
Think the doggie cousins will have to help while they're there.
Steve.