Breather

[OG-Whizzerdude]

Thanks Quenton and everyone else posting here! I have learned so much already. To Quenton, yes this latest info does help. Understanding what’s going on between your legs is important and very enjoyable to me. The pic and info from jbcrusin eliminated a lot of confusion. I was thinking of using a small stainless steel thermos bottle I have and don’t use anymore. Now I know the diameter is too big and that’s too bad. I thought I could clamp it to the seat down tube like a water bottle. Maybe I can put the PVC inside the thermos just to hide it. I think the stainless would look better than PVC. I’m off to the auto parts store today. Thanks to all of you! This problem has been driving me nuts for years now. I was starting to feel guilty for grabbing those big hands full of throttle and blowing my oil out. Jim

 

[OG-Whizzerdude]

jbcruisin, If I may pick your brain one more time. How did you fasten that PCV tho the PVC?

 

[jbcruisin]

jbcruisin, If I may pick your brain one more time. How did you fasten that PCV to the PVC?

2 drywall screws. Once it's tied to the seat post it kind of holds itself together. On the top I cut a coupling in half. The coupling has a ridge in the middle. Put the PVC valve on top of the pipe & slide the coupling down over it & the ridge in the inside holds the PVC valve in place.

 

[OG-Whizzerdude]

I made up a breather system yesterday. It's almost a direct copy of the of the one jbcruisin posted. Hope he doesn't mind. A picture is worth a thousand words. I even got it started after some carb cleaning. Not much gas coming from that flithy petcock either. Now I need to go for a test ride and it's so cold outside, ha.
I hope this will solve the problem it's self. I'm not looking forward to pulling that barrel off of there just to alter the gasket. Thanks guys! It sure helps to understand the problem and have a fix for it too. Jim

 

[Quenton Guenther]

Hi Jim,

Hopefully the breather will solve your problem. The odds are high if I did the cylinder upgrade, the base gasket is already altered correctly.
There are 3 possible conditions of the gasket....WC-1 no hole, Stock NE hloe too large, WC-1 cut to cover 50 percent of the hole [This is the gasket I use and supply].

I am currently working on a new design using a flexable section in place of the metal or PVC pipe. I have completed the math needed to caculate a thinner but longer breather to make it less "bulky" and a different color to blend better with the bike design. I just need to find some extra time to work on the proto-type and testing.

Have fun,

 

[mason_man]

I don't like seeing whizzer motors look like there on life support. This is not a cure, its only a temporary treatment at best.

I'm going to see if (dmb) Dennis will donate one of his whizzers to do the fix, none of my whizzers have this problem, I love Whizzers, I hate hearing the vintage whizzer guys say we have chinese junk. This life support thing proves it.


Ray

 

[Quenton Guenther]

Hi Ray,


Sure am glad the vintage Whizzers guys on this side of the USA don't "down" the new edition Whizzers, in fact some of the biggest Whizzer experts have both vintage and new edition bikes in their collections.

Sounds like a few good men need to "upgrade" the image of the new Whizzers.

I too think the breather looks a "bit much", but all the vintage Whizzers had a crankcase breather system [just looked like part of the motor and always worked] and the new edition motor doesn't. I too have several motors that run much cooler, and use special pistons, and manage to keep most of the oil intact far longer than stock, but isn't the norm. While I agree some of the problems are heat related, and reducing it would be a great thing, it will be difficult to overlook "sloppy bores" that normally cure themselves during the break-in process.



I think with a little American engineering, we should be able to make a workable, inexpensive, crankcase breather system, that looks nice. At least it will keep the oil in the motor during the break-in process, and shouldn't cost much.

Sure interested in your tests, I have a bunch of numbers when a did heat tests on the motors with the high fin heads, and the differences between the WC-1, NE and Westman's cast iron cylinders, just need to remember where I filed them.

Hope you can do the test on a WC-1 to see if it helps keep the seats in longer. Looking forward to the results, maybe you could start a new thread with some pictures [I already saw the coated parts], and details of the process.

Have fun,

 

[OG-Whizzerdude]

Thanks guys, it sure is nice of all of you to share your wisdom on this breather thing. I was stumped and needed a fix. Its 40° out right now so no test ride yet. I’m a desert rat and that’s too cold for me these days. Funny I rode for a 10 year stretch years ago and didn’t have a car. I was no fair weather biker back then. I think my blood was hotter, ha.
I was blowing through that PCV valve before I put it on. Just to see which end was up? I’ve never seen one before. It makes perfect sense. I made up the whole rig for a grand total of about $13.00. Not bad for what it does!
I’m really glad Quenton is working on a more streamline version of this thing. It does look a little bulky on there and it is obviously home made.
I’m pretty sure it is going to work and I don’t mind having it on there for the Grange race in April.
I have another appendage hanging off my bike up front. There is nowhere to hide all the wiring because I can’t hide it behind the stock Whizzer fork. I’m using an aftermarket Crossbow/ Monarch fork just for the look. I’ve spent a few bucks trying to get the look I want on this bike so I will be rewiring and a few other details after I win this race, oh yeah! Jim

 

[dmb]

sorry ray i've been working alot lately. i can donate both a wc-1 and a ne. i also tried to donate my body but they took one look and said ''no thank you''

 

[mason_man]

sorry ray i've been working alot lately. i can donate both a wc-1 and a ne. i also tried to donate my body but they took one look and said ''no thank you''

Hi Dennis, Thanks for taking one for the team. I'll get with you soon. Ray

 

[Quenton Guenther]

Hi,

Just designed a new breather, it is lightweight, looks decent, can be taken apart for service, and didn't cost a bunch to make. I Had to travel about 60 miles to purchase the parts needed. It required a stop at NAPA, ACE Hardware, The Dollar Store, and Home Depo. I made about 12, and ordered enough parts to make another 24.

Have fun,

 

[jbcruisin]

Hi,

Just designed a new breather, it is lightweight, looks decent, can be taken apart for service, and didn't cost a bunch to make. I Had to travel about 60 miles to purchase the parts needed. It required a stop at NAPA, ACE Hardware, The Dollar Store, and Home Depo. I made about 12, and ordered enough parts to make another 24.

Have fun,

Send me 3 along with the EZ drive. One for Eric (Jim's bike), one for Dustin (he bought the upgrade kit at my rally & his brother bought the Predator drive) & one for me to test. I'll call you today for price.
Jay

 

[OG-Whizzerdude]

Very clean look Quenton! Form and function. I like it. I'd like to get a couple of those. What's the deal?

 

[OG-Whizzerdude]

Please put me down for two. I hope you can take a check. Just maxed the card for Christmas! Ha, Ha! I'll find your mailing address in some old paper work. If your okay with this scenario. I have til April before riding either bike.
You are so right. Your version will blend nicely with the bike. Mine has a black frame for now. Thanks for doing this Quenton. I can see where the demand would be high. I have two Whizzers and neither one seems to like it's oil very much.

 

[BarelyAWake]

While we allow product development in other sections as such examples, tips & feedback assist our memberbase - this is a primarily DIY forum and all posts made with a commercial intent (self promotion, pricing, etc) must be confined to our Swap and Shop section to protect the integrity of the information found on our forum, as per our rules: http://motorbicycling.com/f21/please-read-these-simple-rules-2.html & http://motorbicycling.com/f21/attention-vendors-8015.html

Feel free to add a link to a Swap and Shop thread in your sig and/or contact members/vendors by PM or email.

 

[Quenton Guenther]

Hi,
Sorry I misuderstood your rules.

No problem, will most likely stop making the part as it is time consuming and no prophit. I didn't want to make the part and market it because of the time needed to do so, only trying to help the thousands of Whizzer owners solve a problem the correct way.

If I elect to make the part in the future, I will list it in the Swap and Shop section, but for a higher price to compensate me for the extra time needed to market and keep track of product inventory.

Have fun,

 

[Quenton Guenther]

OK, Ok, Okay!

After many phone calls and emails I will continue to make the breathers. Go to Swap and Shop for more details.
If anyone wants to make their own, there is plently of information on this site to do so.
It was made from parts commonly found in hardware, and auto parts stores.
Have fun,

 

[OG-Whizzerdude]

That's the spirit Quenton! We need ya out here man!

 

[wrench]

Howzit Everyone,
I know this tread is old.
Here's some info ya all might want to know.
I would like to share with ya all how to make a COOL looking (C.A.O.S.) crankcase air oil separator breather for your New Gen Whizzer.
The PVC or the Big Rubber Hose C.A.O.S. looks very homemade.
I guess that's why people say that it makes the bike look like it's on LIFE SUPPORT.
The C.A.O.S. Breather concept was invented over 100 years ago.
When I first got my NE-5 Whizzer in 2005 and the stock vent hose would spit oil everywhere I knew something had to be done.
I looked at all the C.A.O.S. Breathers available on the market for Motorcycles, Scooters and Motorbikes. I didn't see any that were COOL enough to mount on a Whizzer.
So of course I had to design my own.
Here's what I came up with.
I call it the Seatpost C.A.O.S. Breather.
I'll explain how to make your own

Make a COOL crankcase breather for your New Gen Whizzer.
First cut 1" off the bottom of the Chromolly seatpost.
Then cut and spread the piece to slip on over the seatpost.
Now TIG weld the piece in place with stainless steel (for support) stainless steel and chrome go good together.
A welding shop should only charge $20 it's a small job.
Next drill and tap a hole for a 3/8" hose fitting.
Seal inside the seatpost with a 7/8" rubber stopper and epoxy.
Seal the inside of the seatpost right below the hose fitting.
No oil gets into bike frame. All oil drains back to crankcase.
Use 3/4 of a pot scrubber pad (air oil separator)
I have also attached a 3/8" ID hose to the top of seatpost with RTV silicone and attached a small breather filter up under the seat ( I like the look).
Yes the Seatpost C.A.O.S. Breather requires some Thought and Skill.
For those of you that like it CLEAN and COOL. This is for you.

I have also designed a Straight Seatpost C.A.O.S. Breather that can be used with the seat in it's lowest position. Just ask and I will explain how that kind can be made and installed.

I think it's time I shared my design.
I have been using this seatpost C.A.O.S. Breather since 2006.
I now have over 36,500 miles on my 2005 NE-5.
No problems with this breather. It works great.

ALOHA Wrench
Take your Whizzer off LIFE SUPPORT

 

[wrench]

Howzit,
Some more info I would like to share.
The 3/8" ID hose that I recommend using is too small to fit on the vent tube on the compression release cover.
I recommend using Made In USA NAPA hose 3/8'IDx5/8"OD
These pictures should explain everything to make it all work.
I also recommend using the left side vent port. As this vent port offers excellent oil drainage back to the crankcase from the Seatpost C.A.O.S. Breather. Plus assists in more air flow.
I suggest routing all hoses to run up hill. Oil has a much harder time going up hill.

PCV or no PCV
Quenton use a PCV valve (one way check valve) on his Big Rubber Hose C.A.O.S.
Quentons says the reason for using a PCV valve is so the PCV valve can beat back any oil that is trying to escape and some Theory about the PCV valve pulsing?
This is not what a PCV valve was designed for or how it is suppose to perform. (look it up)
He then goes on to suggest to use special pistons. No Thanks.

The Seatpost C.A.O.S.Breather will keep 100% oil from escaping at high RPMs without the use of a PCV valve or any special fancy pistons.
I only use a small Breather filter after my Seatpost C.A.O.S.
In my opinion The motor needs to breath in and out not just out.

For those of you that want to use a PCV valve (one way check valve) after your Seatpost C.A.O.S.
There are many very very very low pressure one way check valves available on the market and will fit in line under the seat between the Seatpost C.A.O.S. and the small Breather filter.

The Seatpost C.A.O.S. Breather can control 8oz to 10oz of oil.

If a One Way check valve or a PCV valve is used with the Seatpost C.A.O.S. Breather and it starts to spit oil.
REMOVE the one way check valve.

INFO
Quentons Big rubber Hose C.A.O.S. uses a PCV valve. (one way check valve)
The PCV valve allows the Whizzer Motor to only exhale not breathe.
The Big Rubber Hose C.A.O.S. really can't be called a Breather.
It can be called a C.A.O.S. (crank case air oil separator)

This is not intended to bash Quenton
This is just correct info.
I'm glad that the Big Rubber Hose C.A.O.S. works well for so many people.
Have Fun

ALOHA Wrench