Hmmm, scratch off DAX as a dealer for my next 4 stroke motor. I have a 2 stroker now and I do run Opti at 100:1 mix. Where are the "!" marks Dax?
Terry
Terry
100:1 Mix
- Thread starter Retmachinist
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- 100:1 amsoil motorized bicycle opti
I bought a GTR-50 from Dax and thought I would try Opti-2. Mistake. Mixed it according to instructions and the engine heated up and seized up. Looked in the exhaust port and cylinder is scored. Fortunately, Duane at Dax is forgiving of my folly and offered to sell me a new cylinder and rings at cost. I used Opti-2 one time on my Golden Eagle Komatsu engine with no problem, so it seems there are just some 2 strokes that are not compatible with Opti-2.
BiMoPed said:
Can I get that in writing with the agreement to buy my blown motor if it does?
Hi sketchman and GEJoeGEJoe said:
You have to read what I said and the side of the box.
The double your warranty program is for Opti-4 oil which is based
on the same Eutectic anti-wear additive that Opti-2 uses.
You can read about it here.
Opti-4
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ok guys.... and gals.. If any.. Here is my last post on this subject. Since it seems I have offended some, here is the result of even more research into the subject of mix ratios, opti2 and any 2 stroke oil for the matter. There is a problem with going to Opti2 mix 100:1 and I found the problem. And it is a serious problem. Since I have never run such lean oil mixtures, I had not considered this as the problem. And here it is.. The problem going to Opti2 100:1 is the 100:1 ratio and not the Opti2. What I am saying is.. The problem is not the Opti 2 lube. The problem is going to 100:1. After talking with veteran users 20 years or more of selling and using Opti2, the problem is not the Opti2 oil but going to 100:1. All veterans using Opti2 are typically using 80:1 and not 100:1.. And How are they doing this? Well.. They worked their way to 80:1. The did not change from 32:1 then jumped straight to Opti2 100:1 or 80:1. The worked there way to it. If you are using 32:1 Belray Valvoline Golden Spec , or any others, and then you jump to Opti2 80 or 100:1, you will seize your motor. You will have a melt down. And.. Here is the reason. Your displacement of oil per fuel changed so much, you instantly went into a lean condition.. And.. Pow !! Seizure. What I found from calling Opti 2 and Paul at Opti2 gave me his users and Distributors their numbers and I called and asked how they do go to such lean mix ratios . And this is what they told me.. You work your way towards it doing plug chops all the way. You start at 40:1 and then 50:1 and so on doing plug chops all the way and re jetting all the way until you get to 80:1. This makes sense. I was also informed by Dave at Trail sports a seller of over 20 years and users in his race bikes that Chain Saws and weed eaters come so richly jetting from the factory because of warranty issues they jet them so super rich, that in these devices , they typically can go to 80:1 with no jet change at all. So.. I hope my research has helped 2 stroke lovers. Opti2 is indeed a superior oil product from what I can tell. But.. When it comes to Jumping into the 100:1 mix ratio club, it will require some knowledge, some work, and some Patience. For those of you who made the jump with no problems, consider yourself lucky that your engine was running super rich like the chain saws and weed eaters.. Lucky is right !! But for all the high performance 2 stroke engines out there.. Beware.. All this research has helped me. Enjoy the ride..
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Yeah, that's probably why they now mix at 70:1 with the packets. Too many calls from people with fried motors.
Found it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEJ2EidVP8M
Straight gas. 2:34.1 before seizure running WOT the whole time. That'd be 100:0 if I'm not mistaken. Mm, mm, mm , mm ,mm, toasty.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEJ2EidVP8M
Straight gas. 2:34.1 before seizure running WOT the whole time. That'd be 100:0 if I'm not mistaken.
Mm, mm, mm , mm ,mm, toasty.
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wow, it really sucks then how wrong i've been for over 2 years now. i hope my 10,000 mile, 2.5 year old motor doesn't seize up from running 100:1 that first day so long ago.
and those 7 or 8 other bikes i've built that are still on the road, running perfect, with anywhere from 2 years to 2 months riding time, i guess they're just riding on borrowed time, too. i better make some calls and tell them i'm sorry...
and when i talked to Brad at opti before i even ran it, he musta been misinformed about his own product when he told me that it's designed to be run at 100:1 from day one, to it's last day. i guess his dealers don't trust him either, if they aren't running it at specs.
duane, you sure are doing a lot of research into something you say you'll never use. you should just stick to your guns, keep your uninformed, non-experienced opinions about opti-2 to yourself, and let the multitudes of people who actually use it, benefit from it, and are totally happy with it discuss it.
or, you could just break down (no pun intended) and try it. i'm sure you've got an extra 2 stroker you could mount up and do some empirical testing on. then you wouldn't have to rely on heresay, outdated thinking, rumors, fears, and unknowledgable opinions about it.
the best thing about motorized bikes, is you can always back-pedal...
and those 7 or 8 other bikes i've built that are still on the road, running perfect, with anywhere from 2 years to 2 months riding time, i guess they're just riding on borrowed time, too. i better make some calls and tell them i'm sorry...
and when i talked to Brad at opti before i even ran it, he musta been misinformed about his own product when he told me that it's designed to be run at 100:1 from day one, to it's last day. i guess his dealers don't trust him either, if they aren't running it at specs.
duane, you sure are doing a lot of research into something you say you'll never use. you should just stick to your guns, keep your uninformed, non-experienced opinions about opti-2 to yourself, and let the multitudes of people who actually use it, benefit from it, and are totally happy with it discuss it.
or, you could just break down (no pun intended) and try it. i'm sure you've got an extra 2 stroker you could mount up and do some empirical testing on. then you wouldn't have to rely on heresay, outdated thinking, rumors, fears, and unknowledgable opinions about it.
the best thing about motorized bikes, is you can always back-pedal...
Going from 32:1 to 100:1 and not doing anything other on a high performance 2 strokeis a rookie mistake. But.. Do not take my word for it. I never said I would never use Opti. I said I would never go 100:1. Call Paul at Opti 800-332-5851. He is the Opti Expert. Thanks
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Now there's an idea. A real test. How's this? Somebody that's been running the stuff pull a cylinder and snap some shots? Whoever will do it, I will send you a brand new base and head gasket free of charge as I ordered a set and won't be using them. Going to a different engine, but I'd donate it and mail it for free to whoever will do it so there's no excuse not to. Anybody?
Here we are beating this dead horse again..........
I say people will believe what they want too and do everything under the sun to justify their opinions or "facts" that is fine with me, I know what I have done and it works great for me and all the others here that are running 80:1 and mainly 100:1 know that they've had good success as well and it doesn't really matter what anyone else thinks about it..........
As to all that was said about switching from another oil at say 40:1 over to Opti 2 @ 80 or 100:1 I can tell you from personal experience that all....and I mean ALL........... of my engines ran Fuel/oil Rich on the Opti 2 higher fuel to oil ratio, and if I remember right yes the oil does lube things of coarse but it is actually the fuel that keeps the engine cool and not the oil, oil retains heat much longer than gasoline so the more oil in the engine I would think the more retained heat...... just enough oil to prevent metal to metal gaulding is all that is needed in any engine.
When I switched to Opti 2 I had to DECREASE my jet size to stop the increased amount of too rich condition 4 stroking my engine did, and my plug ran black until I reduced the jet size.
I have pulled the jug off my engines several times to do port work or just to change gaskets and the engine is always loaded up real nice with the Opti 2, very oily and slick throughout.
Personally I dont believe in that slowly working your way up to 80 or 100:1 because from my experience the engines start 4 stroking and running richer on the Opti 2 mix as the ratio is increased too 80:1 or 100:1.
Those of us who like it will always run it just like we like it and continue to have the same great success as we have always had..............If someone wants to run a lesser quality oil @ 32:1 or 40:1 that is fine and I'm sure they will have the same great success with theirs too (maybe)...., difference is with Opti 2 we dont smell like oil, we dont see oil behind us and our engines stay cleaner, it's all about preference in my opinion, conventional oil has a long proven track record and over quite a few years now so does the synthetics and synthetic blends.
It's kinda fuuny reading all this on this thread.....I also have NITRO RC trucks and a buggy and if you go to rcuniverse.com you will see this same kinda debate over full synthetic oil or synthetic blend or some will not run anything accept straight good ole degummed castor oil, castor is superior in high heat lean conditions but synthetic runs cleaner and is way less messy.........so.......... ( which oil and how much is best debate will never end )
I say if it works for you then do it, but dont get all humped up and start slinging mud at people who do things different than you do especially when it is proven that they have just as good of success or better than you do with your way of doing things, neither person is wrong for doing what they do if they are both getting the same results in the end. RIGHT.....!
Peace
I say people will believe what they want too and do everything under the sun to justify their opinions or "facts" that is fine with me, I know what I have done and it works great for me and all the others here that are running 80:1 and mainly 100:1 know that they've had good success as well and it doesn't really matter what anyone else thinks about it..........
As to all that was said about switching from another oil at say 40:1 over to Opti 2 @ 80 or 100:1 I can tell you from personal experience that all....and I mean ALL........... of my engines ran Fuel/oil Rich on the Opti 2 higher fuel to oil ratio, and if I remember right yes the oil does lube things of coarse but it is actually the fuel that keeps the engine cool and not the oil, oil retains heat much longer than gasoline so the more oil in the engine I would think the more retained heat...... just enough oil to prevent metal to metal gaulding is all that is needed in any engine.
When I switched to Opti 2 I had to DECREASE my jet size to stop the increased amount of too rich condition 4 stroking my engine did, and my plug ran black until I reduced the jet size.
I have pulled the jug off my engines several times to do port work or just to change gaskets and the engine is always loaded up real nice with the Opti 2, very oily and slick throughout.
Personally I dont believe in that slowly working your way up to 80 or 100:1 because from my experience the engines start 4 stroking and running richer on the Opti 2 mix as the ratio is increased too 80:1 or 100:1.
Those of us who like it will always run it just like we like it and continue to have the same great success as we have always had..............If someone wants to run a lesser quality oil @ 32:1 or 40:1 that is fine and I'm sure they will have the same great success with theirs too (maybe)...., difference is with Opti 2 we dont smell like oil, we dont see oil behind us and our engines stay cleaner, it's all about preference in my opinion, conventional oil has a long proven track record and over quite a few years now so does the synthetics and synthetic blends.
It's kinda fuuny reading all this on this thread.....I also have NITRO RC trucks and a buggy and if you go to rcuniverse.com you will see this same kinda debate over full synthetic oil or synthetic blend or some will not run anything accept straight good ole degummed castor oil, castor is superior in high heat lean conditions but synthetic runs cleaner and is way less messy.........so.......... ( which oil and how much is best debate will never end )
I say if it works for you then do it, but dont get all humped up and start slinging mud at people who do things different than you do especially when it is proven that they have just as good of success or better than you do with your way of doing things, neither person is wrong for doing what they do if they are both getting the same results in the end. RIGHT.....!
Peace
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Again.. If your Jets are so rich, no re jetting may not be needed. If you are using a high performance 2 stroke, you will have to work your way towards this leaner mix ratio and it will require work. It is intrinsic. Since a High performance 2 stroke is typically Spot on Jetting. Again.. Intrinsic. This is true with any 2 stroke mix ratio that if you start to remove the oil, you will need to fatten the jet. It is a displacement function and again..Intrinsic. If you have any problems with Opti2 and going to 100:1 mix, the problem is not the oil but is jetting. You can call Paul at Opti for more Info. The posts in here by me are not intended to anger or insult anyone. I am learning a lot from all this. If you are able to switch to 100:1 mix and not change jetting, then you are a lucky. And you need to know this.. Call Paul at Opti. Also.. Paul can give you contact info on racers using Opti 2 and they too can explain to you all that are interested on what has to be done when going opti2 100:1. Here it is again.. Paul at Opti 1-800-332-5851 . Since it is a 1-800 number there is not excuse to continue any arguments on doing this 100:1 mix endeavor. Just call the 800 number. I asked Paul at Opti and he said he would welcome any calls about this thread as I informed him of what the discussion is all about. . He said it was fine to call him. I have no more help to offer.
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Based on what you know now, would you still say this if a customer started out with Opti at 100:1 since the problem seems to be "switching" to it after running more oil up to a point?
I'll do the pic thing and you don't need to send me any gaskets.
I planned to remove the head after the first 1.25 gallons anyway.
I have a bit of oil seepage from the exhaust port now. Not bad, just enough to pick up dust on the lower cylinder fins. I am running 25:1 Husqvarna oil.
When the break in gallon and a quarter is gone, I will remove the head and take a pic. Then I will run a gallon of the opti 2 at 1 packet / gallon and do it again.
Not taking the cylinder off, too much work.
I planned to remove the head after the first 1.25 gallons anyway.
I have a bit of oil seepage from the exhaust port now. Not bad, just enough to pick up dust on the lower cylinder fins. I am running 25:1 Husqvarna oil.
When the break in gallon and a quarter is gone, I will remove the head and take a pic. Then I will run a gallon of the opti 2 at 1 packet / gallon and do it again.
Not taking the cylinder off, too much work.
No offense sir but No help offered at this point in my opinion, just your opinions that we who run the oil have alreday proven not to be the case..........
The Opti 2 80:1 mix require me too REDUCE THE SIZE OF MY JETS ( make them smaller) not increase the size.....my engine ran way to rich until I did and the plug ran jet black....and oily looking until I soldered and redrilled my jets, had to do this on ALL of my engines when I went to the 80:1 Opti 2 mix.
Why is it that the word of so many that have and is proving daily what 80:1 or 100:1 Opti 2does in these China Girls has to be treated as bunk......
I could care less what this Paul guy says.......if he said the sky wasn't blue would we believe him....?
This entire conversation has become a complete waste of time and I'm done with it, no hard feelings toward anyone or nothing like that......I just cant for the life of me figure out this huge anount of skepticism over something that has already been proven over & over.
mapbike is over & out on this one........wow! this has been freaking crazy!
The Opti 2 80:1 mix require me too REDUCE THE SIZE OF MY JETS ( make them smaller) not increase the size.....my engine ran way to rich until I did and the plug ran jet black....and oily looking until I soldered and redrilled my jets, had to do this on ALL of my engines when I went to the 80:1 Opti 2 mix.
Why is it that the word of so many that have and is proving daily what 80:1 or 100:1 Opti 2does in these China Girls has to be treated as bunk......
I could care less what this Paul guy says.......if he said the sky wasn't blue would we believe him....?
This entire conversation has become a complete waste of time and I'm done with it, no hard feelings toward anyone or nothing like that......I just cant for the life of me figure out this huge anount of skepticism over something that has already been proven over & over.
mapbike is over & out on this one........wow! this has been freaking crazy!
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No offense to anyone, but opinions and personal experience(without empirical data) is just not enough to sell me on anything. I'm a staunch skeptic till something is proved thoroughly. Lots of people run their choice brand of "magic in a bottle" and have for years and seriously believe that it is the reason their engine has lasted so long and run so well. I'm perfectly ready to believe it too, if it can be proved.
Interlube is claiming some weird stuff(compared to what we are used to). I don't think the skepticism is all that unwarranted, but I'm also ready to go with it and will start my new engine out on it at 100:1, beating on it the whole time. If it lasts it'll be worth it just for the oil savings. If not, I'll tear it down and see what's happened.
Interlube is claiming some weird stuff(compared to what we are used to). I don't think the skepticism is all that unwarranted, but I'm also ready to go with it and will start my new engine out on it at 100:1, beating on it the whole time. If it lasts it'll be worth it just for the oil savings.
If not, I'll tear it down and see what's happened.
Please Do NOT call Paul with your questions about Opti- 2.
Please ask all your questions here in this thread and read the
Interlube website.
Paul at Interlube has generously sponsored the Willow Springs race
and just about all the 2 and 4 stroke racers will be getting some oil
from the case that they sent me.
Interlube has been in business for 35 years and sold enough oil for
400 million gallons of gas!
They mainly sell to the lawnmower and small engine equipment industry.
The people who make STP engine treatment have been in business for a long time too and have sold lots and lots and lots of it. People swear by it. Claim it saved their engine. Claim it has worked for years in their engine and far surpasses the invention of sliced cheese in every way, etc, etc, etc,.
Thing is, I know of an engineer who did a chemical analysis on the stuff, and let's just say the results gave one whale of a testament to the durability of engines in general rather than to the "benefits" of using STP in them.
"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof." And, no, a companies own website explaining why their product is great isn't proof, IMHO.
I look forward to seeing Mike's pics, and my own engine internals after a while.
This is totally untrue, there have been absolutely no calls about fried motors
The reason for the packets being 1.8 oz is because the packets are also
sold in the Canadian and Australian market which use metric measures.
Mix instruction on the packet is with 5 litres or 1 gallon of gas.
5 litres gives 100 to 1 ratio
1 gallon gives 72 to 1 ratio which still gives all the benefits.
Paul at Interlube does not recommend mixing Opti-2 at a lower ratio than 72:1!!!!
I just talked to Paul for 50 minutes so there is no need for you guys to call. LOL
Paul says that a 32 to 1 ratio will dirty up your motor and reduce your performance.
Opti-2 oil has a pure base and does not use solvents like other oils so it is really like a
50 to 1 from other oil makers.
Opti-2 is a semi synthetic blend and ideally should be used from day one
on a new motor to get the full benefit.
Opti-2 also uses non alcohol based fuel stabilizer in the blend.
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The actual experience I have with something is all the proof I need, reguardless what anyone one else thinks about it.....No offense to anyone, but opinions and personal experience(without empirical data) is just not enough to sell me on anything. I'm a staunch skeptic till something is proved thoroughly. Lots of people run their choice brand of "magic in a bottle" and have for years and seriously believe that it is the reason their engine has lasted so long and run so well. I'm perfectly ready to believe it too, if it can be proved.
Interlube is claiming some weird stuff(compared to what we are used to). I don't think the skepticism is all that unwarranted, but I'm also ready to go with it and will start my new engine out on it at 100:1, beating on it the whole time. If it lasts it'll be worth it just for the oil savings.
If I hit my finger with a hammer and tell someone it hurt real bad, I don't need anyone to explain to me about how I might actually be misinterpreting what I thought had happened and maybe it wasn't the hammer that caused the pain after all but maybe it was actually what my hand was laying on when the hammer hit it that really caused the pain.
Any intellegent person would know that the hammer is what caused the damage, you can see that the hammer is steel and your hand is nothing more than soft fragile flesh that can't compete with the hammer when it comes to blows.........
Ah ha.......so it's no different with many people over many years running the Opti 2 and giving testimony of their personal experience.......the proof is in the long term results that each person has experienced over a long period of time...........what is there to be skeptical about is my question......this aint no new product that has just hit the market for the population to try, it's been around for what? 35 Years...........my gosh people this aint rocket science its a parafin based super oil ( SEMI ) synthetic and it just works.
This is getting fun now even though I said I was out of it.....it just amazes me how some minds work........and whats funny is I'm looked at the same way.........weeeeeeeeeeeeee!
Us peoples is so dang funny sometimes........
Peace all.......I'm just having fun now no offense intended to anyone and after all this hooooooo-E
(I still love my Opti 2......and if you give it a try you will too..!)
Peace
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