Craft work of all disciplines are of value on this thread Dan. Lot of young folks looking. It is our duty to lead the way. If your goodwife can help, more power to her.
Tom
Bike builders that have machine tools/shops
- Thread starter Tom from Rubicon
- Start date
Tom
I'll chip in about Dan's work. I was in the antique business for over fifty years. In the era when antiques could still be found from a hundred years before I started. I started re-finishing furniture at 14 working for an elderly furniture re-finisher who was a second generation restorer. It's easier to spot a reproduction when you've been responsible for some yourself.
Dan's work was on par with the work that would have been seen a hundred and fifty years earlier. I wouldn't have spotted them as a reproduction if Dan hadn't told me. Everything was done by hand in the correct manner. The evidence of period hand craftsmanship that would mark it as an original were there. Made using antique tools in a time honoured way.
Museum quality at it's best.
Steve.
Dan's work was on par with the work that would have been seen a hundred and fifty years earlier. I wouldn't have spotted them as a reproduction if Dan hadn't told me. Everything was done by hand in the correct manner. The evidence of period hand craftsmanship that would mark it as an original were there. Made using antique tools in a time honoured way.
Museum quality at it's best.
Steve.
It’s hard to believe that glue will hold over time, I may be wrong, I was about the Glock “plastic gun”, I said it would never sell!
Tom's, thread & he asked for photos Dan so it's fine.
Automotive adhesive is amazing & I've used them for years. The 3 M double side tape is one great product and is really strong. Exterior mirrors and body moldings are often attached with this or similar products; while 2 part resins are tough enough to machine for many applications, though not all. The key is knowing the required stresses at the point of attachment and joining with the appropriate technique; welding, fasteners, adhesive etc. or in combinations, all used as necessary. I'd say attaching a trailer hitch with just adhesive would not demonstrate good fastening design application. I love the resins when appropriate for the application and they are getting stronger, and are being used now in designs that only a few years ago wouldn't have been thought possible.
Rick C.
So true Steve. I've no skill with wood work, but so admire the skill of those who do. I became friends with a West German immigrant to this country who was naturalized and lived in Houston. He was perhaps the most ardent Texan I've ever known. I thought I knew him really well after a couple of years, but had never visited his wood working shop. Amazed is understating my astonishment upon entry. He had multiple projects under way all involving concert quality pianos, mostly Steinway Grands! He was a master builder of pianos who could and had designed pianos and built from scratch, not just the wood but the foundry castings as well! His family business for hundreds of years in East Germany, and they had a large factory, prior to the Communist take over, when they fled to the Western zone of Berlin. Peter was in his forties when I first met him so he grew up in the West, but the family was still building pianos on a smaller scale. He was the most precise woodworker & perhaps the best of any builder, regardless of discipline or material involved. Good enough to Peter wasn't ever. He only recognized perfect.
These guys are still among us, but are only occasionally encountered, mostly not recognized by most. Blue jeans and cowboy boots mixed with a deep German accent is a pretty good disguise for a master craftsman of concert pianos!
Rick C.
I have experience of using the 3M automotive adhesive tape. Top quality brand. Expensive, (there are cheapo copies that'll bond nowhere near as good). but you get what you pay for. Used it extensively when building my replica Morgan 3 Wheeler. All the alloy body panels were designed to be attached to the square steel tubular chassis/body frame using mastic and rivets, but I wanted the panels to be removable for easier access to the car's internals should that ever be necessary in future. So instead of rivets, I used button head stainless screws and ended up drilling/over 300 holes and tapping them M8. Only managed to snap one tap but I lost count of the blisters and callouses! To try and minimize the risk of electrolytic corrosion between the steel frame and the alloy body panels, I laid down a layer of 3M tape between. Once attached to the frame, it wasn't ever coming off again without resorting to grinding it off. I used double sided 3M tape to attach a couple of panels that weren't required to be removable and it was absolutely necessary to get them positioned correctly first time, 'cause even the initial 'grab' of the adhesive means it's stuck for good.
Sticks like s- -t to a blanket as my old Dad would have said. Highly recommended stuff.
Sticks like s- -t to a blanket as my old Dad would have said. Highly recommended stuff.
Rick, I restored or had a hand in helping restore a dozen pianos over the years. I always marvelled at the fine cabinet work used in the construction of them. The refinishing was enough for me.
Steve.
Steve.
Pete, My dad always said it was a Salvation Army blanket.
Steve.
Steve.
You guys a killing me. "Sticks like $hit to a _______ blanket." My dear old Dad never uttered such a thing.
Best chuckle all day, thanks.
Tom
Tom, My dad only swore in my presence once other than quoting a saying. That was when he was standing at our side door at 1am as my brother and I and some of our friends pushed our just purchased 1939 LaSalle hearse into our driveway.
Dad didn't do well with anything that had something to do with death. He told us to get that F'n thing out of the driveway and promptly went back to bed. We had it for quite a while. Dad gave it the evil eye as long as we had it.
Steve.
Dad didn't do well with anything that had something to do with death. He told us to get that F'n thing out of the driveway and promptly went back to bed. We had it for quite a while. Dad gave it the evil eye as long as we had it.
Steve.
Neil Young and band by hearse
Other than the mild stuff, my Dad never swore in my presence either. I must have been in my forties when I effed at him while we were in a pub having a drink and the look of disappointment on his face meant I never went there again. He never once raised a hand to me either. Can't ever recall my Dad hitting me - but my Mum never held back, for sure! Maybe those traits were a small part of the reason over 450 folks showed up for Dad's funeral. Me and the Vicar thought we were going to have two sittings at one point!
Dad had loads of ol skool sayings that used to make me laugh. 'Face as long as a Gas Man's overcoat' still cracks me up.
Dad had loads of ol skool sayings that used to make me laugh. 'Face as long as a Gas Man's overcoat' still cracks me up.
Took a drive up to Fond du Lac with Mona today. Drove into Lakeside Park on the South end of Lake Winnebago, mostly to observe the ice fishing activity. Spotted a bike rider coming from opposite direction and he ain't pedaling.
As he passed, I saw and heard a two smoke engine. I knew there are a few of us in Wisconsin, most in the Milwaukee area.
Was a sunny late February day in the high 40's. Think Spring.
Tom
As he passed, I saw and heard a two smoke engine. I knew there are a few of us in Wisconsin, most in the Milwaukee area.
Was a sunny late February day in the high 40's. Think Spring.
Tom
Hey Al, Finally found you out using the member map. For what ever reason my location was indicated as WB too? So I fixed that and went back to clean things up and there you were. How goes it?
Tom
Hi guys, my purchase of a mini-lathe started on my Old guys Simplex thread as brief few posts and it quickly enlarged. So I'll keep expanding here on Tom's thread. After I sold my machine shop a few years back due to some health issues; I've been fabricating with just hand tools: grinders, drills and small flux welder & it's been fun. I wanted some of the less experienced guys to know they could build pretty cool bikes with not much equipment. This past year finding parts which suited me were at times either not available or were slow delivery. Also my go to local guys with machine tools were closed down. Some pieces I ordered over a year ago are still not fabricated. I decided it was time to step up and set up a shop with some basic machine tools.
The Sieg 7"x14" lathe was selected. This is the third such machine I've set up in the past 6 months or so and the first two are performing well to this point. I'll duplicate a couple of photos on this thread for those not signed on to my Old guys Simplex thread. Some of the good things (and there are also some bad) about this Chinese mini are it has really decent metal change gears, plastic used only on the electronic controls, DRO speed indicator, quick lock tail stock, 4" three jaw chuck (quite a few only offer a 3" chuck), 20 mm chuck bore, which clears 3/4" rod. It has power feed only on the carriage. It also has a 3/4 h.p. variable speed/ direction motor.
Some of the negatives, just some. The motor isn't geared & d.c. motors lack torque at low rpm so it lacks low speed grunt that is an irritant when one wants to cut slow when coupled with feed speeds which are determined by the change gear ratios. I have the lowest ratio gear set installed and it's still to fast a feed at r.p.m. levels where the motor has nice torque. Of course this means really thin cuts on tough metals at slow travel.
The tool post wasn't horrible, but I bought a quick change post. It works well & really saves on tool setup time. Tailstock dead center was the only center provided. It's a MT-2 taper. I ordered a 1/2" Jacobs chuck and a live center for the tail stock. I also have a Mt-3 dead center coming for the
drive spindle and "Dogs". Steady rest is also on the way. set of Indexed bits, brazed cobalt tools, cutoff blades, boring bar set ...you get the picture.
I also require a 4 jaw independent adjustment, 5" chuck with a 1.25" spindle bore. This is a back order item and not available till late June. I like to work with 1" thru 1.25" tube so the big bore is a real need. I'll probably fab a face plate, they seem to be hard to find, but I'll keep looking. Ideas are welcome on the face plate. I've checked Grizzly and Little machine shop, but not located yet.
Ok up to speed kinda' ; ordered some tool box's to protect & organize my tooling and measuring/setup.. instruments close to hand
Lathes are needful things and I'm leaving a lot of stuff out, but compared to milling machines lathe tooling and accessories are inexpensive.
I'm not complaining it's more of a warning to those wanting either a mini lathe or mill.
I have a lot of things to address with this lathe to get it ready to make chips. I don't actually need tenths & I don't expect that from any of these small machines, but reliable low thou can be a reality when they are dialed in.
Rick C.
The Sieg 7"x14" lathe was selected. This is the third such machine I've set up in the past 6 months or so and the first two are performing well to this point. I'll duplicate a couple of photos on this thread for those not signed on to my Old guys Simplex thread. Some of the good things (and there are also some bad) about this Chinese mini are it has really decent metal change gears, plastic used only on the electronic controls, DRO speed indicator, quick lock tail stock, 4" three jaw chuck (quite a few only offer a 3" chuck), 20 mm chuck bore, which clears 3/4" rod. It has power feed only on the carriage. It also has a 3/4 h.p. variable speed/ direction motor.
Some of the negatives, just some. The motor isn't geared & d.c. motors lack torque at low rpm so it lacks low speed grunt that is an irritant when one wants to cut slow when coupled with feed speeds which are determined by the change gear ratios. I have the lowest ratio gear set installed and it's still to fast a feed at r.p.m. levels where the motor has nice torque. Of course this means really thin cuts on tough metals at slow travel.
The tool post wasn't horrible, but I bought a quick change post. It works well & really saves on tool setup time. Tailstock dead center was the only center provided. It's a MT-2 taper. I ordered a 1/2" Jacobs chuck and a live center for the tail stock. I also have a Mt-3 dead center coming for the
drive spindle and "Dogs". Steady rest is also on the way. set of Indexed bits, brazed cobalt tools, cutoff blades, boring bar set ...you get the picture.
I also require a 4 jaw independent adjustment, 5" chuck with a 1.25" spindle bore. This is a back order item and not available till late June. I like to work with 1" thru 1.25" tube so the big bore is a real need. I'll probably fab a face plate, they seem to be hard to find, but I'll keep looking. Ideas are welcome on the face plate. I've checked Grizzly and Little machine shop, but not located yet.
Ok up to speed kinda' ; ordered some tool box's to protect & organize my tooling and measuring/setup.. instruments close to hand
Lathes are needful things and I'm leaving a lot of stuff out, but compared to milling machines lathe tooling and accessories are inexpensive.
I'm not complaining it's more of a warning to those wanting either a mini lathe or mill.
I have a lot of things to address with this lathe to get it ready to make chips. I don't actually need tenths & I don't expect that from any of these small machines, but reliable low thou can be a reality when they are dialed in.
Rick C.
Rick seeing your lathe reminded me of how much I miss the access to the machine shop where I retired from, it’s been over six years since I’ve used one but I probably could figure it out.
Most people don’t realize how much you can use a mill or lathe if you think outside of the box, I remember building conveyor rollers that it would take four weeks to get from the manufacturer in just a few hours.
Greg I know how you feel. I've owned machine shops since the Seventies even after retirement, so medical problems (Dr. orders) I sold my small "retirement shop" which was packed with machine tools and welding equipment. Now with health greatly improved I'm going back into this with mini machines to force me not to tackle big work (health consideration).
Manual machining is like riding a bike; slower pace maybe, but you don't forget the how's & whys. Waiting and not receiving coupled with custom items that must be fabricated one off are the biggest reasons for setting up with mini equipment. I've several projects planned & ready to go once some key lathe equipment arrives via UPS this Wednesday. Delivery on the rest of my orders is strung out over the next couple of weeks. Hurry up and wait applies.
Rick C.
Manual machining is like riding a bike; slower pace maybe, but you don't forget the how's & whys. Waiting and not receiving coupled with custom items that must be fabricated one off are the biggest reasons for setting up with mini equipment. I've several projects planned & ready to go once some key lathe equipment arrives via UPS this Wednesday. Delivery on the rest of my orders is strung out over the next couple of weeks. Hurry up and wait applies.
Rick C.
It burns me up to need something that I know I could make if I only had the equipment, I look at some of the parts and pieces we buy for our bikes and wonder how long the machinist had been practicing.
I agree Greg. Serviceable most often yet not showing much tradecraft skill or pride. Dang sure not tool makers & neither am I.
Rick C.
Rick C.