Phantom Bike...out with the Small Block in with the Big Block

[culvercityclassic]

Jeff I'll bet you smile with pride when you hear him hit it, out of sight & think "my boy"!
Bike sounds stout & has a quite pleasant exhaust note.

Pat D's 3 piece hub adaptor holds big torque better than the Manic in my experience. I tried both on my two bikes using 10 hp + 5 speed wet clutch Honda 125 cc clones & the Sportsman product is what I stayed with. That said I am also using red locktite applied to the clamps surfaces, not the threads (blue for that), after prepping the hub and clamp surfaces with 80 grit & de-greaser. No slip to this point, many miles, later and that wet clutch really locks up and launches incredibly hard. Though I'm positive lacing up a moped hub with 8 gauge spokes is the real answer to wheel problems & braking while using more powerful motors; I'm really looking for the look & feel of a bicycle in my builds, regardless of motor size.

I like "more power & torque" as long as it's dependable and usable, the 212 can be "carted" out to well over 20 hp...lots of after market parts available & race engine builders have led the way to proven modifications. Just from the video & audio I'd say your bikes are somewhere comfortably in the middle & that's a great place to be riding day in and day out.

The little things, like selecting clamps for motor supports, are actually huge in the areas of practicality and dependability. I've used Harley tube clamps as the sole support for a 70 lb. motor/transmission & it's remained rock solid & vibration free...good clamps, accurately positioned really work as motor mounts. Look great also. Use of the small rear sprocket on the pedal side gaining case clearance was innovative and absolutely solved a real design problem often faced with big motor builds.

Though I love your Excelsior bike I was glad to see the two 212 cc bikes that also really shine with almost no glitter. Two totally different design concepts both of which stopped me for multiple long inspections and many approving nods.

I also am a Phoenix frame fan & like Velodrome I was surprised that the 212 fit so well & looks wonderful in the frame too. Rick C.

I need to try what you say about the sprocket adapter, checked my stock and looks like I have the first version Pat made, looks a little weak and the 40 tooth is small, have another one from Jakes Bikes with a little more meat on It i may try...46 sprocket.

I like the clamps you use and need to do the research to find them, you do have a monster motor in that frame with no issues I see.

A short video after jetting the carb and adjusting fuel mixture, CVT disconnected so this bike does not act like a BULL while tuning...

 

[indian22]

Jeff the HD clamps are the go to clamp for Harley's 1" and 1/1/8" tube diameter, black or chromed. 1/2" hole is most common I've noticed, which I've made bushing for several times. I'm telling you they CLAMP. and I'm pretty familiar with the high dollar tube clamps used on roll cages and tube frames for off road racing. In the sizes available these are better. The size spreads the clamping surface area & really resists lateral forces while preventing tube damage from clamps compression, though not a problem with even thin wall DOM tube, could possibly damage a box store frame, but know you won't be using anything that is suspect. For those who don't have a good AC/DC Tig and want to build using an aluminum frame they are quite helpful in the limited sizes available.

I'm intending to use them for my Simplex side car to bike frame connections 1" Dom steel so I can run solo or convert to side car in a relatively short time and not have the bike frame cluttered up with brackets when running solo.

A two piece adapter may hold firm with Locktite though I haven't tried it with a high power and low ratio engine and drive train, my Simplex runs a 56 tooth rear (really low with the 5 speed gearing & rendering 1st. gear a seldom used selection) and the Harley runs a 44 tooth...& the same light drive reduction from engine secondary offset sprocket cluster, although the Harley has some significant additional power mods compared to the stock CG 125 in the Simplex build, which I'd estimate add add 3 or 4 hp to the output. I bang into second and third occasionally and the setup hasn't bent any spokes to date.

I initially set up my adapter against the spokes. My thinking being that if the hub adaptor slips it won't have that extra inch or so (at the hub) to pick up momentum from the drive train & slam into the spokes.

Love the vids, sounds like you've got it tuned in. Rick C.

 

[msrfan]

Great job Jeff, Looks and sounds cool. Always love all your details and parts you make. If you want something of good quality and looks, you have to make it yourself.

 

[culvercityclassic]

Great job Jeff, Looks and sounds cool. Always love all your details and parts you make. If you want something of good quality and looks, you have to make it yourself.

Thanks msrfan...always admired your craftsmanship too..

 

[culvercityclassic]

Out today on my first big ride on the bike with Venice Motor Bikes and Bob The Turkman...30 mile ride, first stop was breakfast in Santa Monica next to the airport (great food) then south along the beach...That Venice Motor Bike is fast..so was the pace of the ride... Great times with good solid people...

BTW the bike ran great with no issues....

 

[culvercityclassic]

Jeff I'll bet you smile with pride when you hear him hit it, out of sight & think "my boy"!
Bike sounds stout & has a quite pleasant exhaust note.

Pat D's 3 piece hub adaptor holds big torque better than the Manic in my experience. I tried both on my two bikes using 10 hp + 5 speed wet clutch Honda 125 cc clones & the Sportsman product is what I stayed with. That said I am also using red locktite applied to the clamps surfaces, not the threads (blue for that), after prepping the hub and clamp surfaces with 80 grit & de-greaser. No slip to this point, many miles, later and that wet clutch really locks up and launches incredibly hard. Though I'm positive lacing up a moped hub with 8 gauge spokes is the real answer to wheel problems & braking while using more powerful motors; I'm really looking for the look & feel of a bicycle in my builds, regardless of motor size.

I like "more power & torque" as long as it's dependable and usable, the 212 can be "carted" out to well over 20 hp...lots of after market parts available & race engine builders have led the way to proven modifications. Just from the video & audio I'd say your bikes are somewhere comfortably in the middle & that's a great place to be riding day in and day out.

The little things, like selecting clamps for motor supports, are actually huge in the areas of practicality and dependability. I've used Harley tube clamps as the sole support for a 70 lb. motor/transmission & it's remained rock solid & vibration free...good clamps, accurately positioned really work as motor mounts. Look great also. Use of the small rear sprocket on the pedal side gaining case clearance was innovative and absolutely solved a real design problem often faced with big motor builds.

Though I love your Excelsior bike I was glad to see the two 212 cc bikes that also really shine with almost no glitter. Two totally different design concepts both of which stopped me for multiple long inspections and many approving nods.

I also am a Phoenix frame fan & like Velodrome I was surprised that the 212 fit so well & looks wonderful in the frame too. Rick C.

Hey Rick, think I have the sprocket issue resolved, did a couple things you mentioned, thanks for the help.

I have been on a couple decent rides on the bike and noticed the engine and cvt plate had issues, the motor was moving around a little too much and the cvt plate was flexing bad during hard acceleration. Added a couple supports, one on the head and another on the cvt plate to the rear motor mount. Made a big difference and put it on a good test ride today. A couple pictures which include the Porsche event at the Flying Museum in Santa Monica I stumbled upon on my ride.

 

[indian22]

Great pics of your ride outing with Norm. I always loved visiting Venice though my last trip was in the early '80's. You guys rolled good & looked great getting it done. Thanks for the museum photos. I was a Porsche guy from jump with a new 1972... 2.4 litre 911 S my first & sold my last pair in 1991 with a half dozen or so in between. "There is no substitute" yet I moved on with really only one regret: I always wanted a silver 356 Carrera coupe & just never connected with the right deal. Bucket list car for the Old Guy still. Maybe yours too!

Building something that really works well (for what it is intended) is huge. I'm so glad the problem issues mentioned are being gathered in. I've used the head bolts as an attachment point for frame support since my purchase of a Cushman Eagle in '59 or '60. It had a small bracket that secured the cylinder to frame that kept breaking & the big bore engine would shake like an out of balance washing machine! I finally made one that held up to the stresses. Some well balanced engines may not seem to need cylinder support. but I think it a good idea anyway. Sometimes the answer lies in using the head...good solution on your bike.

Keep building it adds some extra zest to your life & is a joy to others. Rick C.

 

[Tony01]

Looking good. So what is your final drive ratio not including the cvt? And is that a 6, or 7" driven pulley?

 

[Hoofbeats64]

I bought the CNC One Inch Hub adapter. Needs a shim of sorts to fill a micro gap... I bent and broke some spokes due to a slip. Really need to find a way to lock that adapter tight. It is the weak link of my bike. Are you guys suggesting here to use any bonding agents to accomplish this?

 

[breath_easy13]

A few more pictures, Made a combination chain tensioner/ brake arm holder attached to the frame tab. View attachment 95643 View attachment 95644 View attachment 95645 View attachment 95646

hey man are you selling these forward mounts you built?