Indian Tadpole

[fasteddy]

An old timer told me when I was a kid the the only job where you start at the top is when your digging a hole for your self. If that is the case I'm about half way through the earth about now.

This build has been a knuckle buster but the end is so close now I can see the light at the end of the tunnel and for once it's not the 7:15 Express out of Topeka. It took some effort to get the front of the chain guard looking right but that's done.
I have to change the welding wire over to .023 so I can weld it together but that will have to wait until tomorrow due to the pending rain. I have to weld outside and Saturday and Sunday will be sunny and in the upper 60's and lower 70's.

Next week I have to make a run up to the metal supply and get what I need to finish off the jack shaft. With any luck I'll have the parts in the machinists hands soon.

Steve.

 

[fasteddy]

I jumped the gun once again. I put the chain cover on the bike for a final look and stepped back and now attempt two will happen tomorrow. Didn't like the way it looked and that was it. It didn't cover enough of the sprocket like the original one did to suit me so it's not good enough. We've all gone this far and we deserve the very best.

Couple of hours tomorrow will set it right.

Steve.

 

[fasteddy]

Silverbear,

What you said is so true. I think this is because the pattern that the administrator set out from the beginning. Then it was carried on by the moderators who let things flow until they feel there is need for a warning before Gracie says goodnight as rare as that is.

This has made the rest of us who are on the forum feel welcome and that leads to people being open to sharing ideas and helping others solve their problems. New members pick up on this as they follow along until they join us and post their own builds.

When this thread started I would never have imagined that it would have stretched to almost 1,400 posts. Of course I never thought it would take this long to build either and if I had I still would have started down the path.

What a glorious journey of discovery it's been. When it is finished I will in many ways miss it but if I do live to be 110 in good health and win the lottery there will be others built but no more #$*^*#@+$# Indian tri cars.

Steve.

 

[fasteddy]

I've been side tracked for a short time. Went looking for a part on the shelves and have now started reorganizing the shop. The chain guard is roughed out and I hope to get to it this afternoon right after I get the swamp cleaned up.

There are so many things that I don't remember buying it's kind of like Christmas.

Steve.

 

[curtisfox]

HO!HO!HO! it's sometimes fun to clean, LOL. A couple weeks ago found some slides didn't know i had, was sure happy to find .......................Curt

 

[fasteddy]

The Bully clutch came this morning. I"ll put photos of it on the thread later but it is far more than I expected it to be. Beautifully packed and packaged.

Now it's out to the garage to see how it lines up.

Steve.

 

[indian22]

Steve it is a real Indian Morini 2 stroke built in Taiwan during the early 1970's....bummer. Nice find but no real treasure here. I did however locate a complete HD "knucklehead" motor in excellent external condition...running status unknown but does turn over. Shipping it to my "elf lord" Harley guy to rebuild along with a later model tranny.
Rick C.

Steve good news about the Bully clutch, you be rollin' before you know it!

Wendel (my pack rat buddy) found me another Indian...this time a V-twin. One of his dozens of cousin's took it as security on a loan that he finally realized would never be repaid. He's had it for quite a few years because the owner is away for life without the possibility of parole & recently his ex-wife signed it over as payment in full for the old debt.

I'm busier than a one arm paper hanger but I should have gone over this morning with check book in hand, yet that might have been a mistake. By the description I was given it sounds like a post war Indian "Warrior" but V-twin Warriors it seems are extremely rare (vertical twin Warriors are quite common)...so I lean to thinking it's a prewar Scout 1930 to 1940 bike, but the frame & tank description seem wrong for a Scout. It could also possibly be a V-twin conversion of a Warrior, as Indian had a great deal of problems with some of the vertical engines. Evidently the bike has been in "barn" storage since the 1960's & remains in relatively good condition. Wendel's cousin, who's a pretty fair mechanic, said the motor turned over freely.

These guys are pretty private by nature and Wendel said they might just drop it off at my shop for me to examine which I hope they don't do 'cause every body who's watched a "reality" barn find show on TV will be giving "expert" evaluations because they saw one just like it on a Meacham auction bring big bucks...of course they will ignore the years of restoration hours and money spent to restore it. I should have looked at it this morning.

Rick C.

 

[moto-klasika]

Silver bear your threads and posts set a great example for us to follow: civil, humble & insightful laced with wit & a well developed sense of humor (most at your own expense). Your posts aren't centered on you or your builds, but an interest in others & learning more, even as you instruct us all with your life experience in general & specifically your broad knowledge of 2 & 3 wheeled transports & the devices which power them. You my friend are an encouragement & I count you as a mentor of the first caliber & not just you but those fine forum contributors who share in that same spirit of growth.

Rick C.

=============================

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Hello There,
Just to sign such words from Rick! [/FONT]​

I enjoy reading, learning and following your projects! Nice company in nice café!
(as other threads with same boys and our girl - where is she now?)

In a few days I am going to Belgrade for 3 weeks to finish formalities about my Serbian pension, and after that to finally test my HPV quadricycle and see what to do with it later...

My Very Best Regards to you all,
Zoran​

 

[fasteddy]

Rick, given that your friend Wendel is telling all his family that he has a friend looking for Indian motorcycles I figure you should have about a third of Texas looking for you in a year. Given that when extended family members gather for hunting, fishing, BBQ's, family reunions and just plain gatherings somewhere in the conversation motorcycles will come up and that will trigger memories of who has or had one and the man looking for them.It will be interesting to see what it is.

New England is the same clannish nature when it comes to people. My son and his girlfriend at the time rented a farm house and it had been a rental for some time. When they moved it it took six large trailer loads just to clean up the yard and then they had to start on the barn.

It was over a year before they got much more than a nod when they passed a neighbour on the road and a full two and a half years before the chap on the corner who's family had lived there for over ten generations talked to them. He eventually open up and told David that since he liked motorcycles he had a couple to show him. They were Indians and I think they were either just before or just after the war years and one had the sidecar still attached to it. I'll ask him just what they were when I talk to him this weekend. He was eighty+ years old and became a good friend of theirs and of course he knew what he had and didn't want to sell them.

You just never know who has an early motorcycle stashed away.

The clutch is a dream piece and worth the money it cost. Now I have it I can get the measurements for the sprocket distance and see about getting that finished.

Steve.

 

[indian22]

First time I saw that clutch on one of Pat's builds I was intrigued especially by the cost... two and a half times more than the HF engine more or less, but over time I've become a believer (though I still consider the disparity of cost compared to a complete & proven motor hard to understand) but if your going to ride much the Bully should more than pay off in the long run. I've spent a lot of money on go cart clutches over just the last few years & the aggravation factor of down time alone is worth a lot. The real value, besides quality, is they're tuned for bikes and proper engagement speed makes for a more enjoyable riding experience including all around improved performance. Good call on your part for using the Bully on your Tadpole Steve.

Dealing with family clans & individuals themselves is interesting to say the least Steve. Indian Territory (Oklahoma) is primarily made up of very friendly & outgoing people, but there are a few clans that indeed remind me more of some east coast regions of the U.S. Wendel's people are good folks that are just not very out going by nature. They distrust most outsiders they are about family and are extremely self reliant... which I admire. I'm never quite sure what they have in mind so I try to exercise patience and restraint and let them tell me what they want to do. I'm quite excited about the possibilities; yet I'm not sure why.

I have at this point almost no hard data to work with. I've two reliable eye witness accounts by men who've ridden bikes all their lives, but who have no specific knowledge of Indians, but no photos; as flip phones not smart ones with cameras seem to be still in use by some. They know a V twin when they see it & have been led to believe it is a post WW2 model. 1950 has been mentioned but I can can find scant evidence of V twin Scouts that were factory built after 1949 & only 25 "large V-twin 648's" Scout's total were built that last year, 1949, of V twin Scout production. Indian Chief's with V-twin were however produced through 1953 at least. I just need to chill & wait, but having awoken this morning at 3:30 with Indian on my mind might lead one to think I'm obsessing a bit at this point. What if it's a 1949 Scout 648 racing which at past auction fetched bids of over $150,000. yes I'm obsessing more than just a bit!

Rick C.

 

[fasteddy]

When I don't know about something that I'm interested in I make a point of studying what's involved. The computer now makes this a lot easier and Go Kart clutches are something I have no knowledge about. After looking through the forum and then on Go Kart sites and seeing the different ideas on how to set up the proper clutch and the cost of getting the parts I looked at Pat's site to see what he was selling. He has worked hard to find the best of everything to put together a trouble free motorized bicycle.

I believe it was Culver City Classics who said that clutches with a plate were the only way to go so I put in my order.

Funny that you mention the cost. You may have seen me say that some times it doesn't pay to be Canadian but it @%$^*&@ well always costs you to be one. The clutch is a perfect example. Talk about being ridden hard and put away wet.

With the cost of the clutch and the Canadian-U.S. dollar difference and the deluxe shipping and the Canadian federal and provincial sales tax payed at the front door the clutch cost me $450 in Canadian dollars.
It was still worth it in my mind.

When I hear or read that someone is going to move to Canada if (Pick a Presidential Candidate) is elected in November their moving to Canada I just laugh. They better do their homework and try a dry run first.

We have the second largest country in the world but the State of California has more people in it than Canada does.

Steve.

 

[indian22]

Strange timing for your post to come through. I seldom discuss costs of my builds, but I'll make an exception here as I'd just finished totaling the initial cost of parts actually ordered for the Peashooter, including shipping costs from 12 separate vendors. $1,300. I then estimated I'd require about $1,500. more in parts to complete the build...no labor, just parts & shipping. Your clutch alone cost more than my 125cc 5 speed basic engine; not including electrical's, fuel delivery system exhaust, cables and controls.

All this is relative of course & I'm in no way suggesting you should have selected the same or similar engine to what I've chosen. You are on the right path to finish a great build. It's just #@!+?* expensive yet necessary expenditure for proper completion of the Indian Tadpole.

It's doesn't have to be an expensive hobby but sometimes is.


Rick C.

 

[fasteddy]

I was thinking that your post about the clutch cost was strange timing as well. I wasn't going to mention it but thought it might be a point of interest when we are looking at the cost of a built.

I'll have well past $2,000 in the tri car when it's done. It's provided me with more fun, frustration, problem solving and fulfillment than I would have believed possible. If I were to give it to someone when it was finished and never rode it the journey would have been well worth it to me.

I'll bet I have close to twice what you have in that little engine of mine. It was my choice and I certainly could have walked away from it at any time. So much custom work has gone into it to get it to look as much like the original as possible as well as make it usable. Spread over the years it hasn't been terrible and when it's up and running it will have been worth it and I will have accomplished what I set out to do.

Would I do it again knowing what lay ahead of me? With a lot of of thought and reflection on the past years, no I wouldn't have as much as I like to say I would. It would have been Steve's version of a tri car front end and the rest would have been Sportsman Flyer. Neat, quick and less expensive.

The pleasure and I'm sure excitement everyone of us feels when we walk out and look at our bikes knowing that no matter what it cost or how long it took the fact that we built it cannot be surpassed.

Steve.

 

[Tinsmith]

Just wanted you fellas to know I'm enjoying the conversation and the sharing of knowledge and opinions.

Dan

 

[curtisfox]

Just wanted you fellas to know I'm enjoying the conversation and the sharing of knowledge and opinions. I couldn't agree more, and i have learned a lot form this build, and the Simplex Gater. Love it all ..................................Curt

 

[indian22]

Curtis & Dan I appreciate you guys as well as Steve and Silver bear. Together you've formed a tight bond over the years & that means I, by initially following the threads and posts of Silver bear, was introduced to the work & insights of you all. I thought it strange that your interests matched many of my own & those that didn't intrigued me to follow along till I became interested in them as well. My thanks to you all for that & to others of like spirit on the forum as well. I feel we're all seeking harmonious outcomes and association with others of like mind, while sharing our strengths and hopes is key in accomplishing these goals. I appreciate you all! Rick C.

 

[fasteddy]

Thank you Dan and Curtis. You both have added a lot to the pleasure of this build. Rick your so right. We have formed a tight bond and Dan, Silverbear, and I have met each other as spread out as we are and Curtis, Silverbear and I have met each other as well.

Glad you've joined us Rick. Your thoughts and kind words and most certainly your fine builds are putting the spur to the horse for me and I appreciate it.

Just amazes me how the computer and a love of motorbikes brought us all together.

That and the Silverbear saying when your passing through to New Hampshire to see your son, stop in and see me. The key words there were " Stop in and see me." A month later, one canoe sidecar body, a lot of creative staring. swimming, visiting, town dump metal pile raiding, story telling, a couple of boxes of beer consumed and plans made for Bike Camp in the Birches by the Lake for the next year I was off to continue my journey.

Some "Stop in."

Steve.

 

[fasteddy]

Here are some photo's of the Bully clutch. Sportsman Flyer has them built for motor bikes. Worth every penny in my book.

Steve.

http://s866.photobucket.com/user/sp...uild/DSC_0010_zpsbql38ay9.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0

 

[Allen_Wrench]

Dang, man! That's one seriously solid clutch. It looks like the last one anybody would ever need.

 

[indian22]

Thank you Dan and Curtis. You both have added a lot to the pleasure of this build. Rick your so right. We have formed a tight bond and Dan, Silverbear, and I have met each other as spread out as we are and Curtis, Silverbear and I have met each other as well.

Glad you've joined us Rick. Your thoughts and kind words and most certainly your fine builds are putting the spur to the horse for me and I appreciate it.

Just amazes me how the computer and a love of motorbikes brought us all together.

That and the Silverbear saying when your passing through to New Hampshire to see your son, stop in and see me. The key words there were " Stop in and see me." A month later, one canoe sidecar body, a lot of creative staring. swimming, visiting, town dump metal pile raiding, story telling, a couple of boxes of beer consumed and plans made for Bike Camp in the Birches by the Lake for the next year I was off to continue my journey.

Some "Stop in."

Steve.

These "conversations" & my interest in the sidecar, tri-car & the whole process covering 6 years has led me back to Silver bears Hiawatha thread. I'm reading the whole thing again...'cause it's awesome & because of SB & his buddies Steve, Dan & Curt. I know it's called the Indian Hiawatha, but I also think of it as the Sachs & Fox Indian as well! (yes I know I'm taking liberty with the spelling & pronunciation, but still...) No slight intended to the great Hiawatha or his tribe. Rick C.