Would anyone but me buy a smaaler still China Girl?

Discussion in 'Motorized Bicycle General Discussion' started by Nashville Kat, Apr 20, 2016.

  1. Nashville Kat

    Nashville Kat Active Member

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    Would anyone but me buy a smaller still China Girl?

    What I envision is a smaller lighter and quieter China Girl motor, maybe 35 or 38cc with a slightly longer pipe to make it quieter still-

    that I can clutch power on, on a traditional lightweight bike, or one of the newer 700C commuter/transportation cruiser.

    something like this, or a vintage road frame:http://www.amazon.com/Schwinn-Mens-Wayfare-Hybrid-Bike/dp/B00TYB8QDE/ref=dp_ob_title_sports

    I want a lighter kit- they've pretty much ENDED the 415 Industrial/trike chain with the shorter profile that's half the kit weight- I suppose a 410 might be more viable but I like chain play to keep it on the sprockets-

    I want a smaller plastic tank with neither the nipple or the fill hole mounted dead center, so as to be in the Plastic Corporate mold way, for pedaling- or at least give us back the hanging tank for a diamond frame, we've been able to see but not purchase for years now. And I think it's fair to say, after doing my first build in 2009- that any progression in our activities is always TOWARD motorcycles- speed and power- and AWAY from the bicycle aspect.
    I want a china girl that more bridges a gap between its' current state, and the rising world of electric bike motors- where batteries are still sky high and not all that long of life.

    I see a top speed in the low 20's, but more of a pedal start up to normal speed- then pop on the afterburners- I ride pretty much that way now, and kill the motor approaching any stops- and COAST up to it- a bike and motor with a total combined weight of about 35 or 38 pounds- hey- the same as the cubic inches.

    I ride my bike in urban and suburban streets - mostly smooth and flat and I generally make the same 6 mile round trip, although sometimes to other stores and locales. Would anyone else buy a kit like that? Or do I stand alone as an ancient road racer?

    r.ly.
     
    #1 Nashville Kat, Apr 20, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2016
  2. bluegoatwoods

    bluegoatwoods New Member

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    Yes, I like the idea.

    I wonder, though, if it could be done so that there is enough weight saved to make a true difference in pedaling.
     
  3. Nashville Kat

    Nashville Kat Active Member

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    Re: Would anyone but me buy a smaller still China Girl?

    I run cruiser frames now with 700c wheels- the real pedaling difference comes with the lightweight and narrow wheels. My 50cc build on a modern light Huffy cruiser frame comes in at about 40 pounds and handles much like a road bike. With sound dampeners- the 50's are quieter and vibrate less, but with stock Speed carb, not as powerful as a 66.
    Most MB's have their seats too low for good pedaling, and if their approach is for a lot of speed I can respect that- but I got used to a good pack speed with my legs almost extended fully on a road bike. The 415 Industrial Trike chains peddle much easier too,-MUCH less rolling resistance- and so you KNOW they're helping the motor out too. I bought my last one a year or so ago- and it was a hard search then- the cost had gone up to over $20. I was getting them delivered for $12 a few years ago and still have them on both my builds.

    below 50cc huffy with 700C wheels

    and aborted Schwinn Traveller project 2010
     

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    #3 Nashville Kat, Apr 20, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2016
  4. bluegoatwoods

    bluegoatwoods New Member

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    Ahh.....the Schwinn Traveller. A fine bike. Too bad that build didn't work out for you.

    I've had a few Travellers over the years. A bit more than thirty years ago, when I first saw mountain bikes, I got rid of the drop handlebars on mine and put near-straight bars on my Traveller. It was a fantastic bike setup like that.

    A year or so later I spent a pretty good wad of cash on a Miyata Ridge Runner mountain bike. And it was a fine bike, I won't deny.

    But from day one until now I'm not sure it was superior to the Traveller.
     
  5. Nashville Kat

    Nashville Kat Active Member

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    Re: Would anyone but me buy a smaller still China Girl?

    The Traveller ran into a host of problems putting it together- the clearances were tight but it looked as if I could get the chain to clear the stays- I'd opted to try for a 1/8" 410 chain and a narrow front motor sprocket- it looked aligned but still threw the 410 off the first few meters. I went to switch back to 415 kit chain and lost the woodruff key. Buy the time I got another, I'd found the orange huffy frame. The other big factor was that the teardrop tank was totally in the way of my knees pedaling- they didn't have the small one liter plastic tanks then which would be my choice mounted on an alloy rear rack.
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mini-Gas-Fu...ash=item3cd4a63f70:g:gRwAAMXQb2JSFN9U&vxp=mtr
    The poo poo pipe wouldn't have had good clearance either and I used it on my 66 build for awhile- quiet.
    So anyway, I sold the Traveler without a motor and regretted it later- I'd gotten it incredibly cheap 10 or 20 dollars from a junk guy- and it renovated nicely, but I had to leave the flood property with the FEMA buyout and had little room- had to sell the 88 Festiva too- Ouch- but got another 91 later on.
     

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    #5 Nashville Kat, Apr 21, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2016
  6. allen standley

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    Not unless I needed a gas powered boot scrubber during mud season!
     
  7. Ludwig II

    Ludwig II Well-Known Member

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  8. Nashville Kat

    Nashville Kat Active Member

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    Thank you for sharing that- I'd never heard of that bike. Yet what I want would be much lighter and not carry so much gasoline.

    There are 38cc 4 strokers out there- the friction drive that Bike Berry sells for instance- and while I'd prefer a 4 stroke for dependability, and for being quiet, they still generally DON'T fit between unaltered pedals on most bikes.

    A 35cc China Girl would still just kick-on with the clutch and I've grown fond of that. A smaller motor could be replaced even easier too, and not as likely to damage a frame.
     
  9. Ludwig II

    Ludwig II Well-Known Member

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    Cannonball2 has used V belts to turn drive from a lengthways Maytag crankshaft through 90 degrees. Could a small engine be done the same way? They are sometimes thinner that way round.

    [​IMG]
     
  10. curtisfox

    curtisfox Well-Known Member

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  11. Ludwig II

    Ludwig II Well-Known Member

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    You can find Cucciolo engines in Europe quite easily but they cost money and go fast for an old 4stroke.

    It's possible to place an old 10mm carb on a Mobylette engine and hold the performance down as well. They can fit within the frame, it's how the Genuine Fake is being built, except I'm going 12mm unrestricted.
     

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  12. Nashville Kat

    Nashville Kat Active Member

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    I once had Oil Spill tires too.......

    I once had Oil Spill tires too- my new name for Beach Tires-

    I was calling them Old Indianapolis Wasp tires-

    Still have the same bike I first built w/the same 66 motor from '08 but it's changed incarnations a bit, including the alloy 34 sprock directly bolted to a high flanged flip/flop hub

    the orange 50 has a custom GT 39 front sprock, drilled and hole enlarged as the back motor drive.

    The silver 66 will do 35 but cruises best between 25-3o. At 62 I don't want to fall and either of these builds could do with a tamer motor.

    Don't get them out much anymore, but great weather now- riding my road bike on the Baldwin Path in Jacksonville- beautiful!

    below- micargi 66 with "oil spill" tires, then 1.75 street and finally 27 x 1 1/4 wheels
     

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    #12 Nashville Kat, Apr 27, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2016
  13. Ludwig II

    Ludwig II Well-Known Member

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    I put things in the wrong section as well :)
     
  14. Ludwig II

    Ludwig II Well-Known Member

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    Bumpbumpbump
     
  15. Nashville Kat

    Nashville Kat Active Member

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  16. Ludwig II

    Ludwig II Well-Known Member

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  17. Nashville Kat

    Nashville Kat Active Member

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    Well bike berry is selling a 38cc friction drive here for a fairly low cost- I just don't want an over the wheel friction drive. I want a 33 cc China Girl that weighs half as much as a 66.
     
  18. Ludwig II

    Ludwig II Well-Known Member

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    It's a shame all the hub motors or hub mounted motors are this side of the water, Cyclemaster/Rabeneick or BSA Winged Wheel or Spartamet sound like the ideal size and power for what you want.
     
  19. sbest

    sbest Member

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    I like the idea of smaller lighter and quieter, but it will be harder to sell the idea of less displacement to the US market. Most jurisdictions specify less than 50cc and 20mph so there are pretty good target goals. So how to make it smaller lighter and quieter?

    A large weight reduction is in the flywheel. Aluminum cheeks with steel weight rings on the outer diameter could reduce weight 3-4 lbs in a standard China Girl. Thinner precision casings and plastic covers would take 2-3 lbs off and reduce all dimensions 1" in every direction. BMX chain and aluminum sprockets. These things would double the price of production.

    The plastic gear and chain covers would dampen a lot of their noises. A new air filter cover and fine foam filter would quiet a lot of the intake noise. Rubber pegs between the cylinder and head fins would quiet those noises.

    The exhaust would be a pipe tuned for max torque at 20mph and +50% over-rev so extra pedaling would be rewarded with up to 30mph speeds but still meet the legal 20mph condition on flat and up hills. Ideally the torque tuned pipe would be thinwall construction with a surround type muffler to quiet it to a whisper.

    The beauty of this approach is that each component would still interchange with all the 50cc and 66cc motors that are still out there. Development could start as aftermarket sales of individual components as a complete package is developed.

    Think about it;
    meets all legal requirements, 50cc, 20mph flat speed
    will haul touring weights up hills
    can still pedal or down hill to 30mph
    whisper quiet
    half the weight due to precision thinwall castings and aluminum/steel hybrid crank
    1" smaller in all dimensions
    Complete interchangability

    Will someone build this?

    Steve
     
    #19 sbest, May 18, 2016
    Last edited: May 18, 2016
  20. Ludwig II

    Ludwig II Well-Known Member

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    The only people likely to make it are hobby builders, not commercial suppliers. I looked at ways to chop a strimmer engine down but it's not realistic.
     

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