Eliminating the driven sprocket

[Ghost0]

Andrew,
The front freewheel is not a problem, we found a source. As for the rear derailluer, I think a standard one will live if you don't abuse it. You can use a standard casset, an internal or a NuVinci. Either way you still need the front freewheel.

 

[Andyinchville1]

HI Ghost,

I have no idea what a front freewheel system would run but.... if you use the Nuvinci (or possibly another internal geared hub with minor modification) you can run WITHOUT the need for the front freewheel system....I think Staton makes a dual freewheel sprocket for the rear where by the rider pedals on one freewheel and the engine sprocket drives the other freewheel....sinve both sprockets are freewheels (single speed units) the engine can power the bike without turning the pedals YET both the rider and the engine can benefit from the gearing offered by the internal gearing hub (engine starting is not a problem either)....That is the way I would have gone to obtain gearing BUT I didn't have a good Jackshaft system figured out (appears you have a good one tough!)...

The above is just a thought....I'd LOVE to see multiple speed gearing no matter how we get it!!....I have a certain scooter I'd love in mind I'd love to smoke! HA ;-)

Andrew

 

[Pablo]

Wow - I never heard of such a thing. I can't exactly get my head around it.....how could this work? I'm not saying it wouldn't work I just can't picture it.

One chain, right?

Almost forgot. Our BOM is complete, some few logistics to work out, we have a domain name for our website. Need to place an expensive order with a supplier. As I mentioned, board meeting this coming weekend.

 

[paul]

here is how the hub works. Fallbrook Technologies i drove one at the bike shop and it is unbelievable. infinate gearing. no clicking or adjusting. really a nice set up

 

[jezusjonz]

Now a double freewheel on a Nuvinci or any internal hub gets the mind to rethinking everything again.
Cant wait is all I have to say. One thing on the 200 is that everything to convert to the jackshaft?

 

[Ghost0]

Yes that comes with everything, cranks, freewheel, spindle, sprockets, jackshaft, bearings, mounting hardware etc.

 

[jezusjonz]

Well let me ask you this are you going to sell just the jackshaft kit? I really what to try it on this schwinn FF crank.
Terry

 

[sisdavid]

Ya, how fast does that go?

 

[Pablo]

Well let me ask you this are you going to sell just the jackshaft kit? I really what to try it on this schwinn FF crank.
Terry

That's a real possibility. Sure, why not. We did a lot of research today and we changed my bike over. We have a few NEW issues to work out but nothing major. But the thing may be - is the Schwinn FF a two gear deal?

 

[Pablo]

Ya, how fast does that go?

Good question. On my bike it went like a raped ape with a turbocharged afterburner. But the low end was not quite right - we need to figure out the the next matching driven left sprocket....more ordering....

Ghost0 has photos and will be heading for home......

We had a good hill ride and a lunch. Lots of fun wrenching. Board meeting adjourned.

More later.........

 

[jezusjonz]

Yes its a two ring crank...and its not going any other way than with a jackshaft. I built this tonight well I started at noon today and just stopped a few minutes ago. But this is going to be my test bed. Dont ask me why I build em to hurt my back but I have this one bike I want to build and I just cant get it right. I might have to go to a straight bar at first to be more upright.
But heres my schwinn with the front freewheeling crank. Im only going to run the 48cc motor that I have waiting for the testing.

 

[paul]

nice. i look foward to seeing after you ad the bicycle motor!

 

[jezusjonz]

I dont know after getting some sleep and looking at it now....I might need to rethink it a bit...just not happy with the looks of it and again not comfortable to ride. Ever since I started enjoying bikes again and motors on them I wish I had one for what ever I felt like that day. Cruising in town riding a dirt path or hitting the highway and taking a long ride. I was trying to have a bike set up for each of these that all I would have to do is take the motor off one and put it on the other and go that way I didnt have a bundle wrapped up in motors gears and all the parts needed. I think with this set up that Ghost and Pablo have made puts me that much closer to enjoying my plan. Now, it went from having to have everything else from the original kit for each bike to basically a throttle and clutch lever and tank and the crank. But I think that anything that we can do to keep it as close to just what the bike came with will reduce our failure points and give us more enjoyment and less frustration.
Kinda like that hydrogen car they came up with I think they call it skateboard that you can change the bodies off of for what ever you need at that moment. Van truck sports car...thats what I would like to do with this setup.

 

[Bean Oil]

Pablo, Ghost: You guys are too much! That is bitchin'!!!

I was at work and talking with another guy two weeks ago about doing something very similar... a jackshaft setup to my motored Schwinn cruiser so I could try a Shimano Nexus 7-speed hub I have. But it was just talk and it was about using some sort of sprag bearing. A freewheel makes perfect sense... Nice to see it become a reality!

 

[Pablo]

But the low end was not quite right - we need to figure out the the next matching driven left sprocket....more ordering....

I forgot to add - even with the set-up on my bike being a bit too much toward the high end....I can indeed take off quite easy with the clutch and a little throttle - fun ahahahha!

OTOH - get used to starting it with leg power! It seems a bit odd, but really not a huge issue once you realize a hill doesn't help you start.

As for production "issues":

1) As noted the ratios turned out to be a bit different than we expected. On the negative side, one of the gears is not made in a higher # of teeth! We thought we were stuck - well we were. The bike goes fine, and some guys will really like it for flatland speed. But it doesn't have the low end gearing to allow the little beast to spin, and on the high end the top two gears are just HIGH. However, one of us two board members had the idea to get a smaller custom gear for bike chain upper driving gear. Yahoo - it can be done - I ordered the gear and it shipped today. The proprietary steps I will need to do next.....I need to see how the top end will be. On the positive side - if this new gear works, then we will sell the kit with the lower gear and offer the larger gear and a purchasable option later. It's a bit expensive for us to have both at first, but we'll see.

2) The actual installation went fairly quick. The new rear engine mount design is slick!! I mean GHOST0 SICK! You gotta know how to work on bikes - the crank stuff is not that hard, but experience is required. We will supply the new longer crank, crank arms, etc. You'll need a Park crank puller tool. We can suggest the tool#. It works really easy, and isn't too expensive. It would be nice to have a retainer nut tool as well, but not required.

3) Every bike and engine are different, so it requires your noggin. You will need to do some minor filing on your engine flanges and case to keep the side plates all aligned and such.

4) Yes - you need to take the engine out. It's worth it. We supply all the parts and hardware.....but you will need a chain breaker and some of the normal tools.

5) I started working on the installation manual with the photos. Need more photos!

 

[jezusjonz]

Well when ever you get the jackshaft kit ready to go let me know I'm in NEED for SPEED ok really I just like the whole concept compared to what we are doing now. I'll take it in any piece part that you want to sell.
Terry
ok next post will be a begging post....!

 

[Pablo]

Here it is on my bike:

 

[paul]

looking good paul! i can't wait to here more and get one when they are ready for the public!

 

[jezusjonz]

Me too ....(wiping the drool from my mouth)....the suns up and the new motor
(without a jackshaft kit)is just sitting on the bench crying to be put on and ran. The bike (without a jackshaft kit) is wanting them stupid little rubber thingys that stick out all over that scream NEW BIKE NEW BIKE wore off. And my butts not numb anymore from riding(without a jackshaft kit) it is numb from waiting.... ok well it used to work in the movies way back when...geezz I need help (jackshaft kit)

 

[Egor]

Pablo - Is that freewheel you are using for the crank sprocket something you made? Also you could use a larger jackshaft sprocket from the engine, there should be enough room near the wheel if you get out there, that would lower the gear ratios. This is looking good, and it would be nice to be able to cruse with lower engine speed. Have fun, Dave