Old Guys Simplex moto-peddle bike
- Thread starter indian22
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Like most of my projects Harold the Simplex sidecar is a thought in process affair with nothing visible till there is. A design is forming for the leaning sidecar; as I learn more about previous hack concepts. I find my approach enjoyable, but to those following along it's like watching paint dry or encouraging the kettle to boil...just a rather boring wait. I do appreciate the interest of those who are following this the last part of the rather lengthy Old Guy's Simplex/ Harley Peashooter thread.
I will begin a new thread for the straight bar 2 stroke build as it develops and post a few photos, basically just a kit build using varied components I've on hand, plus the aluminum Schwinn knockoff...pretty basic. Rick C.
Check this video out, start at the 1:10 mark. It shows how he connected his side car to his bicycle.
There is another that does it similar, but instead of the straight rod on one side he made his in a U shape that hooked up to both sides of the bicycle. It looked a lot more structurally sound than the single rod attachment. Sorry, but I lost the link to that one. But I think it was on a rat rod bicycle forum.
There is another that does it similar, but instead of the straight rod on one side he made his in a U shape that hooked up to both sides of the bicycle. It looked a lot more structurally sound than the single rod attachment. Sorry, but I lost the link to that one. But I think it was on a rat rod bicycle forum.
Thanks Dog catcher for your interest and input for the side car. I'm pulling information from lots of sources and it all helps. Connection fixtures & location are especially varied & critical. My sidecar will be adult size and full bodied therefore pretty heavy. The Simplex motor bike weighs about 160 lbs. & has between 10 and 12 hp, depends on who writes the specs, and with the 56 tooth final sprocket and 5 speed integrated transmission and wet clutch; it certainly should haul two people and the car at a leisurely pace around town. I'm hoping to keep the sidecar weight under 75 lbs., but won't sacrifice safety for weight.
I also want the rig to complement the lines and style of the Simplex Copper Gator, long and low, so that they match up well at rest & on the roadways; reflecting a 1930's feel. I've not found any information or photo confirmation of Simplex ever offering a sidecar option nor seen an after market mounting of a sidecar to a Simplex bike, though Simplex trucks were available. If anyone has photographs of a Simplex sidecar combination I'd appreciate them being posted or a link provided on this thread. I'm a fan of motorcycle history and the impressive and varied designs incorporated by the early manufacturers so it's only natural that I'd like to see more of these especially as relates to the projects of this thread. Rick C.
I also want the rig to complement the lines and style of the Simplex Copper Gator, long and low, so that they match up well at rest & on the roadways; reflecting a 1930's feel. I've not found any information or photo confirmation of Simplex ever offering a sidecar option nor seen an after market mounting of a sidecar to a Simplex bike, though Simplex trucks were available. If anyone has photographs of a Simplex sidecar combination I'd appreciate them being posted or a link provided on this thread. I'm a fan of motorcycle history and the impressive and varied designs incorporated by the early manufacturers so it's only natural that I'd like to see more of these especially as relates to the projects of this thread. Rick C.
https://www.google.com/#q=simplex+sidecars
Several photos of Simplex cycles with sidecars ranging from shop built to accessory vendor on this link
Several photos of Simplex cycles with sidecars ranging from shop built to accessory vendor on this link
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Very interesting side car. I like the style that lifts up myself and it wouldn't be hard to get out of. It does have somewhat of an early style to it as well. Looking forward to seeing what you come up with Rick.
Steve.
Steve.
Curtis both Steve and you are among those who appreciate the sidecar & the almost limitless stylistic opportunity's they've presented designers over many decades. Add to that the appropriate coupling of bike to car & a "safe" yet functional under carriage and you probably understand why I'm proceeding at a snail's pace before putting steel on the floor. That plus I'm spread thin at the moment, but no complaints...Rick C.
Yep! do it right from the start, less to redo after. LOL Trouble with all the pictures you see to many you would like to do, would have to build a bunch of bikes. And so many game plans, just have to chose the one that is best for you and do it. It will be fun to see your final plan...........................Curt
The mistake I made with mine when I built it was it was far to heavy. If I were to do it again it would be with a light tubing frame and a minimal wood frame just to give it shape covered with 1/4" luan and a layer or two of fibreglass or stitch and glue like they make boats and do away with a wood frame.
It could also be covered with spandex and resin. The spandex is put on first and then wet out with resin. Sanded and painted it makes a nice finished surface.
Steve.
It could also be covered with spandex and resin. The spandex is put on first and then wet out with resin. Sanded and painted it makes a nice finished surface.
Steve.
Such a unique and beautiful car it is Steve! Weight is definitely a consideration for powering and handling characteristics of a sidecar. Thanks for suggesting good options for keeping weight down & simplified body shaping materials. Rick C.
Thank's Rick. Originally I had planned the bike to be able to tilt. On the second run up and down the street as I was turning into our drive way the weight of the sidecar pulled the bike off balance since I was making a sharp right hand turn and I went head first into the sidecar while sitting on the bike.
We have a 4'+ ditch in front of the house and I knew I was heading for it and I was able to complete the turn while applying the front brake and wound up on the front yard. My brother could have been some help if he hadn't been frantically clutching at the front fender of his car crippled with laughter. It certainly wasn't a lot of help as he pulled me out of the sidecar while constantly mentioning camera and YouTube but having my head stuffed into the front of the sidecar muffled a lot. Mostly my screaming. Strong Christian neighbours both sides of the house and they would not have approved.
The first thing I did after regaining what ever dignity I could muster was to get my copy of Early Motorcycles, Construction, Operation, Repairs and see how sidecars were anchored to the motorcycles. The bike is now firmly anchored to the sidecar with 3/4" bar that was braced.
Steve.
We have a 4'+ ditch in front of the house and I knew I was heading for it and I was able to complete the turn while applying the front brake and wound up on the front yard. My brother could have been some help if he hadn't been frantically clutching at the front fender of his car crippled with laughter. It certainly wasn't a lot of help as he pulled me out of the sidecar while constantly mentioning camera and YouTube but having my head stuffed into the front of the sidecar muffled a lot. Mostly my screaming. Strong Christian neighbours both sides of the house and they would not have approved.
The first thing I did after regaining what ever dignity I could muster was to get my copy of Early Motorcycles, Construction, Operation, Repairs and see how sidecars were anchored to the motorcycles. The bike is now firmly anchored to the sidecar with 3/4" bar that was braced.
Steve.
It's situations like you described Steve that keep me digging for a more through understanding of the design dynamics involved in the marriage of hack to bike, especially with the two points of articulation involved in the leaning wheel sidecar layout. I know it's been done by many others, but have no idea what the completed value was like to ride on the street, the satisfaction or terror quotient. Ludwig mentioned that the steering sidecars were banned (which design is quite different from just tilting the car wheel) but quite a few cars with that layout were constructed and raced, which fact tells me there was benefit in racing but offset by safety issues. At any rate I'm proceeding with caution & the concept of being able to easily convert to a traditional rigid design sidecar if testing shows the leaning wheel to be an unacceptable danger. Either way I still see a sidecar attached to the Simplex Copper Gator in the future & the Old Guy smiling in the saddle as he's envied by all who witness his rig at play on the roadways & byways of Indian Territory.I think I'll call it the "Alligator Gar car", Lol! Rick C.
It's good to see a rush of activity on the forum. Wret posted he's planning to ride in a parade and I also am planning a parade ride on one of my bikes this weekend. Hope to post some photos of the event. Building is fun but what's the point if we don't get out and ride? Rick C.
Curtis these memories inspire me to ride daily year round, dangerous weather conditions being the only thing that keeps me off two wheels. Riding is the best part.
I've identified the kayak make, model & length that I want to use for by sidecar body shell, but am waiting on end of boating season to find a Winter bargain. Also I'll have more room in the shop to store the rig while I work on it during our slack season. Rick C.
I've identified the kayak make, model & length that I want to use for by sidecar body shell, but am waiting on end of boating season to find a Winter bargain. Also I'll have more room in the shop to store the rig while I work on it during our slack season. Rick C.
Old guy is at it again with the side car Simplex. Still going forward, but events have modified my plans just a bit. I traded for a brand new Predator V-Twin 22 hp engine last night, which I'm assured by my demented small engine fanatic can be reliably built out to 30 plus hp and use the 3 D manual clutch on a jack shaft for single speed power transfer. Plenty of torque to pull the extra weight.
Starting with a bare Simplex frame stretched 6" and eliminating the kick start lever and pedal bracket, removes some big problems that faced me in converting the Copper Gator Simplex to a side car rig. Compromises that I really didn't care to make. Electric start eliminates the need for a kick starter and the necessary upgrading of wheels, tires & brakes to DOT approved ratings does away with the need for pedal functions as well. Frame can then be expressly modified for strength & side car mounting hard points added at the proper locations not just where space allows.
Another option I suppose would be to dismantle the Copper Gator Simplex & install the V-twin & modify the already stretched and tremendously overbuilt DOM frame for sidecar attachment. I really like the CG 125 5 speed engine & the way the Copper gator feels, but I also have a modified version (more power) of the same engine in the Harley Peashooter. Just finding a solid Simplex Servi-Cycle frame in good condition is not really the problem, but rebuilding it to match the strength of the one I built is. It would actually be not only better, but also easier & somewhat less expensive just to build a Simplex frame from scratch...which is really what I ended up doing on the last Simplex frame. I used the original steering head & seat spring & the rest was built in my shop. I'll think on this awhile...
Not in a hurry here but I would like to finish both bike and sidecar before next winter, but Spring would be better. I'm not getting any younger! Rick C.
Starting with a bare Simplex frame stretched 6" and eliminating the kick start lever and pedal bracket, removes some big problems that faced me in converting the Copper Gator Simplex to a side car rig. Compromises that I really didn't care to make. Electric start eliminates the need for a kick starter and the necessary upgrading of wheels, tires & brakes to DOT approved ratings does away with the need for pedal functions as well. Frame can then be expressly modified for strength & side car mounting hard points added at the proper locations not just where space allows.
Another option I suppose would be to dismantle the Copper Gator Simplex & install the V-twin & modify the already stretched and tremendously overbuilt DOM frame for sidecar attachment. I really like the CG 125 5 speed engine & the way the Copper gator feels, but I also have a modified version (more power) of the same engine in the Harley Peashooter. Just finding a solid Simplex Servi-Cycle frame in good condition is not really the problem, but rebuilding it to match the strength of the one I built is. It would actually be not only better, but also easier & somewhat less expensive just to build a Simplex frame from scratch...which is really what I ended up doing on the last Simplex frame. I used the original steering head & seat spring & the rest was built in my shop. I'll think on this awhile...
Not in a hurry here but I would like to finish both bike and sidecar before next winter, but Spring would be better. I'm not getting any younger! Rick C.
If it were me I would make a new frame to fit what I needed. Taking the Copper Gator apart seems counter productive to me and doesn't really solve any problems like a new custom designed frame would. Thirty plus hp and electric start would be ideal.
Steve.
Steve.
