The Russian engines D-4,D-5,D-6,D-8. History.

[happycheapskate]

I really like the moped seat that you put on the rear rack! Clever!

Real mopeds have couch seats. I think someone sells them for bicycles too, but I've never seen anyone actually put a puff seat on a rack.

Hi my name is alain and i live in Cuba and i have a motor D8 in perfect conditions see my pics.

 

[happycheapskate]

I imagine it would be more than enough compared to walking or pedalling in the cold, wet, blustering Russian winter air! Does it run better in cold weather?

My friend had the opportunity to ride the Russian motor the other day, I've been a little too busy.

He said it is extremely smooth and quite but gutless. He said he would rather have the Chinese 48cc.

 

[Dave31]

The Russian motor is smooth, quiet, looks freaking cool but lacks the performance of the Chinese engine in my opinion. The Russian I believe is around 45cc, and you really notice the difference between the Chinese 50cc.

If I was gonna race in the Death Race...I'd want the Chinese. If I was gonna make a trip cross country....I'd want the Russian motor.

 

[Egor]

Fair - I like the Russian version also. Try opening the points as much as you can, you will get to a point that it wont run but the wider you go the more it increases the ignition timing. The other thing is that (carb), I suspect it is very small and the intake runner is small also. That is a rotary valve engine, so the fuel air mix is passed through the crank end shaft. I saw in the videos that in the performance mods were to add an intake into the crankcase with a reed valve. If it is very quiet I suspect the exhaust is also has a small opening, the second way to throttle a two stroke engine. I don't think the cc's take that much away if it is tuned up proper, the most power out of a 49cc two stroke is over 20hp. I would love to play with one of those engines. Have fun, Dave

The Russian motor is smooth, quiet, looks freaking cool but lacks the performance of the Chinese engine in my opinion. The Russian I believe is around 45cc, and you really notice the difference between the Chinese 50cc.

If I was gonna race in the Death Race...I'd want the Chinese. If I was gonna make a trip cross country....I'd want the Russian motor.

 

[Extinction]

Here's my example for a tuned up russian engine.

Reed valve intake into the crankcase with bigger carb, ported cylinder (made a boost port as well), chrome coated upper piston ring, modified conrod big end (to improve lubrication and cooling, bearing and rod itself are original), crank trued-balanced, increased compression ratio, C3 crank bearings, ignition is from an old chainsaw (quite hard to get the timing right, might replace it with something better adjustable) and of course a tuned pipe.

The motor is used on a sidecar, so thinking of converting it to liquid cooling. And I think the porting&pipe still need some attention.

 

[Scotchmo]

I found this link with some cool video and lots of Russian engines.

Photo400 How to - Best Of Riga Mopeds 1 2009

Photo400 How to - zelta moped

 

[Dan]

That is awesome Scotchmo. How are (in the first vid) they getting that kind of power out of 45cc? Amazing. The short section about turning em into gardening equipment, lol. Kinda the reverse of what some of us do.

 

[buzbikebklyn1]

I wonder if these are still made?
Check out the threaded exhaust spigot!
Points and condenser 12 volt ignition/magneto?
*****IN!
The lineage of the "china girl 66" obvious.
The instruction manual in Russian is a hoot!
Seriously now, how much more could shipping from Russia cost as compared to china?
I'm digging these up.
BBB

 

[sbech]

Nice Riga motorized bicycle, Spike1401!

It is made in Soviet Union, by factory "Sarkanā Zvaigzne" ("Red Star" in translation) in Riga city. Engine (made by Leningrad factory "Red October", leading helicopter engine factory, in addition to motorcycle engine producing ).

Exact name of model - Riga-13. Riga - name of model type, "13" - exact model.
There was no such a model as "Riga Diana", it is a pity, but your motorized bicycle has completely fake number plate, shield with that info about "Diana" is absolutely sure self-made, original was replaced.
Original one looks appr. like this:

Good news are - you have almost complete set, just few extras are not present. Very good state, few used one.
One of the most successful Riga factory models, as I think. People in USSR loved it, Riga-13 like this, because of of low price and great endurance in comparison with standard bicycles. A sack of potatoes, heavier then rider, could be easily moved with motorized bicycle like this one.
Example:

These cans are full of plums, for making home wine...


Riga-13 in full set, just form factory pack:

You have a little bit later year setup, approximately - starting from 1983, up to 1995.

 

[sbech]

Genuine Riga motorized bicycle, 1958

Riga bicycle, still without engine, renewed by me

Genuine D4 from late 1950-ties set:
http://www.tsiklitall.org/galerii/albums/D4/

 

[sbech]

Magneto contact ignition is "weak link" of this engine.

Factory in Russia stopped to produce them some years ago. These engines, especially "late" models, such as D6 an D8, can be easily bought "second hand" in Russia and post-Soviet, but hardly could be shipped - things such as ebay are not common in Russia. Price for "second hand" engine in Russia - twice as smaller, then for Chinese kit. Price for "not used", or "few used" D8 engine - almost like for new Chinese kit.

If very interested - you could try to make personal contacts to sellers.

 

[sbech]

A bit later, (then D4) d-engine model D5, appr.1969, mounted on my contemporary bicycle:

 

[sbech]

A little bit more about this so-called "D-engine" history.

Russian by origin, but living in Ukraine (USSR that time) person, photographer by profession, self-educated engineer Philipp Pribiloy (Филипп Прибылой) invented this engine in mid-1950-ties.

He lived in Kharkov, where one of biggest USSR bicycle factory was located.

He made his first engines literarry in garage, with primitive machinery, ignition coil taken, possibly, from destroyed German military equipment (heavy battles near Kharkov happen during WWII), and main aluminum parts made by himself in tins, cannkins. Some people say, that main radius of aluminum engine parts are compatible with that time tin sizes...

He brought his engine to Kharkov bicycle factory, and factory tried to produce them, in small amounts, with exactly the same idea - making engine kits for bicycles.

Early D4 engine carburetor had quite strange construction:

It is written in early literature, that first carburetors could be normally managed only by inventor himself... God knows, where did he found the prototype for his first carburetor, which part of German tank it was...

But Kharkov bicycle factory could not produce these engines in big amounts, so producing was moved to Leningrad (St.Petersburg now) to aircraft factory, which was much more familiar with aluminum alloys.

First there were produced just kits for installing on bicycles, then - the same engine took for light mopeds, like this Riga-13.

One of the most interesting by design, and picturesque motorized bicycles with D-engine is "Gauja" model:

D4 engine:
weight - 9 kg
45 cc
1,0 hp max RPM 4000
1,5 liters per 100 km.
Allows low-quality gasoline.

 

[GearNut]

Thank you VERY much, sbech! I really appreciate all the information that you have shared with us. It is too bad that these engine kits were not readily imported to the States and abroad to other countries. They appear to be better built than the cheap Chinese kits that we have now, at least better designed.
I would love to own one.
Is it really true that they are no longer being produced?

 

[Dan]

Big time, Thank you Sbech. Really fascinating. Thanks to you, we know more about the history of those engines then the ones we have available here in the U.S.

I looked into the shipping costs of the Russian pump engines that some of the bike engines are now produced for. If I remember correctly, was around $300 USD. Some day, would like to look into getting some shipped here. They are so cool looking!

Again, thanks for taking the time to share the history and great pictures!

 

[sbech]

First.
During USSR times a quite big amount of these engines were produced. Far more, than people needed. Also I by myself remember how it looked - all free places in factory, including roofs and grass, filled with non-sold motorized bicycles. Result of planned economy, moving to communism...

People that time thought, that these engines are not really worthy. Remainings of that attitude can be felt untin now. People wonder - why "Chinese make such a old and unworthy construction?" I think - it is one of reasons, why factory stopped producing them.

Even until now these engines (D8) are not rare, for example, here are offerings in Riga city, Latvia:
SS.lv Mop?di - R?ga - P?rdod, Cenas, Foto, Att?li

Second.
Russia - a little... different, than USA, Australia nad Canada. Until now very rare a man from Russia can buy items on ebay - even if he has unlimited Internet access, English knowledge and a valid credit card - not all the companies ship to Russia. Chinese kits even in Moscow are sold by local Russian companies, individuals almost cannot buy them from abroad. In opposite direction - shipping from Russia - situation is even worse, as I can see.

Third.
It is absolutely sure for everyone, who had used both Chinese and Russina engines - Chinese has more HP and better ignition, so, as one person here said, is better for races.
But Russian engine is much, MUCH more durable. If with Chinese kits it is normal - to disassemble new one and check, Russian engine never, NEVER (well, almost) has mechanical problems, such as self-disassemble or detail crashing, if normally used. It just worns out, worns out, slowly and forseenable. Steel, material quality is much better. And - it is made with intention to be repaired, not just replaced, as Chinese one. There are 3 repair sizes of pistons, and cylinder is made from inside of cast iron, so it could be repaired easily also.

In 80-ties it was normal - to feed D8 with black used oil after oil change in car engine, and use worst avalilable in Russia gasoline for it... And they went fine, as we thought...

And - older ones was made more accurate. D4 is better made, than D8, in spite it has worse construction (thin intake valve, 9 mm canal from carburetor for example)

Well, you are welcome to ask anything about them more

 

[happycheapskate]

Thanks very much for the historical review! I have the chinese engine kit and I live in Texas USA. The car drivers are rude to bicyclists, even if going 30mph in correct direction (hahaha). The Chinese engine is fast, but truly needs to be bathed in oil to survive hard running. The last one I had was destroyed when the piston ring seized or failed and shattered the piston. The clutch acted like a brake as the heavy bicycle kept rolling a little bit and I drove off the road soon as possible.

I can see how these could run on 87 octane gasoline and used motor oil (hopefully you filtered it), esp if the bike was driven in a cold climate and not run full speed constantly.

I liked hearing about how the prototypes were supposedly made from broken war machinery. I am against communism for certain, but I admire many of the soviet era Russians for their toughness and ability to create things from very little, or to prolong the use of things in unusual ways.

 

[sbech]

I live in Texas USA.

Wow! Sounds fascinating - Texas also has such a people, interested in mtorized bicycles!

The car drivers are rude to bicyclists, even if going 30mph in correct direction (hahaha).

Honestly, I am afraid of driving in Riga city old motorbicycle, too intense traffic, too weak brakes (1961)... But in rural areas - niice! There are few of us (modern 50 cc scooters are much more common) so we can evn usurp pedestrian areas and bicycle tracks...

I can see how these could run on 87 octane gasoline and used motor oil (hopefully you filtered it), esp if the bike was driven in a cold climate and not run full speed constantly.

Haha! Most common gasoline for mopeds in USSR was 72 octane, but D4 engine was fit for 66...
Oil - yes, a little filtered.
Conditions - yes, not hot, and not on full speed, you are right.

 

[sbech]

going 30mph

Quite a lot!
My D4 "oldies" went not faster as 23 mph...

But in Russian city Saratov lives George "Wagner", he had made a motorized bicycle on standard Chinese frame set, with mounted D6 engine, tuned, of course. Wagner found, that D6 is more appropriate also for tuning, then Chinese engine.

He named this bicycle "Black Raven", "Чёрный Ворон", name taken from old Russian song, about people fallen in battle: YouTube - "?????? ?????" " a black raven ".

Here is it:

 

[sbech]

Black Raven has self-made electronic ignition:

and tuned... actually, almost everything inside engine, for example:

and it goes max.65,9 kph (40,9 mph):

48 cc
100 kg (220 lbs) rider
no wind
no ups, no downs.
65,9 kph - max speed, 62 - normal.

I think, it is the fastest non-racing motorized bicycle with such type 48 cc engine.

Racers in Latvia and Estonia have even more power out of these engines, but all they are racing machines, and... goes fast, but not for long time. Wagner has long-term working engine.