will it burn...

Discussion in 'Motorized Bicycle General Discussion' started by deacon, Jan 17, 2008.

  1. deacon

    deacon minor bike philosopher

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Messages:
    8,119
    Likes Received:
    0
    I can remember putting kerosene in my dad's two stroke lawn mower back when I was a kid the FIRST time. So I'm pretty sure these engines won't run on kerosene but how about ethanol or french fry oil.

    Just kidding about the french fries. Anything other than gasoline that will burn in the Chi Nee Caddy
     
    #1 deacon, Jan 17, 2008
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2008
  2. Pablo

    Pablo Master Bike Builder & Forum Sponsor

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2007
    Messages:
    3,652
    Likes Received:
    0
    There really isn't anything fundamentally different in the combustion cycle of these 2 cycle engines that will allow them to burn biofuels any differently than your average car engine. We could probably go down a bit in octane, or burn up to a ~20%/~80% alcohol/gas (various alcohols), you could add some toluene or xylene, a tiny amount of acetone - BUT BE WARNED I HAVE NO IDEA HOW THE ELASTOMERICS (HOSES, O-RINGS, GASKETS, ETC) WILL HOLD UP.
     
  3. deacon

    deacon minor bike philosopher

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Messages:
    8,119
    Likes Received:
    0
    I can see a whole new industry here... custom fuels for the chinee caddy. I run the new vodka gas cooking oil mix lol Talk about a natural high.
     
  4. MotorbikeMike

    MotorbikeMike Dealer

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2007
    Messages:
    476
    Likes Received:
    1
    Hi, you guys are gonna fool around and burn these things up? The critical thing here is good quality 2-stroke type oil in the mix to lube the ball bearings, and the bronze bushings.

    These engines do not last all that long anyways, and to add alcohol (which burns hot and dry) is to send your little engine to Judge Roy Bean (the hanging Judge).

    Mix well, ride easy, and save up for better engines as they develop would be my advise.


    Mike
     
  5. Norman

    Norman LORD VADER Moderator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2008
    Messages:
    2,605
    Likes Received:
    1
    Go ahead and tip the Nitro jug I love the smell of burning Nitro and the noise!(^)(c)
    You can use methanol alcohol but it will need a major rejetting and special oil for the mix(castor oil or syn.) and they ain't cheap and your mileage will go down the toilet an alcohol is very rough on the aluminum parts the stuff likes munch on the aliminum and rough on seals.:confused:
    Cooking oil? Kerosine? all cost more per gallon than gas at least where I live but if you've gotta try it. I'd like to hear the results I could be wrong and it wouldn't be the first time.:D
    Norman
     
  6. Pablo

    Pablo Master Bike Builder & Forum Sponsor

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2007
    Messages:
    3,652
    Likes Received:
    0
    We are speaking fairly hypothetically. Indeed it goes without saying....run a high lubricity pre-mix when messing around....at your own risk of course. When I used to run toluene or xylene/alcohol mix in my turbo car even then I would add some 2-stroke oil in my 4-stroke car! Simply as a UCL. Worked great.

    If down the road I put any forbidden substance in my premix, it probably will be toluene or xylene as a octane booster. Just for fun.
     
  7. deacon

    deacon minor bike philosopher

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Messages:
    8,119
    Likes Received:
    0
    I was thinking used french fry oil instead of 2stroke oil.. Just kidding guys.
     
  8. Norman

    Norman LORD VADER Moderator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2008
    Messages:
    2,605
    Likes Received:
    1
    I've read a little bit on these engines and even looked into importing and selling them. I read somewhere on these engines that in China they didn't use a specific 2-stroke oil but an off the shelf auto oil for the premix and I've used 30wt auto oil in 2-strokes when I was a kid never heard of a 2-stroke oil then but I'm sure there was.
    I know farmers used to run kerosene in their gas tractors as my dads international tractor Manuel had a section on how to start it on gas then once warmed up switching over to kerosene but his tractor wasn't set up to do that.
    Last time I priced kerosene around $4.00 something per gallon in Nov.2007 I went to the airport and got jet fuel instead $20.00 for 6 gallons better price. I use the stuff in a portable heater in the garage. I'm lucky in that our airport is more laid back and everyone knows each other the way airports used to be before 911.
    You might have something on the used french fry oil. a guy named Jimmy Glenn wrote a book on building alcohol burning Briggs for kart racing and he tried peanut oil as a lube and worked with good results but the price is as bad a the racing oil we used at around $15.00 a gallon so you might really have a good idea but if you burn up the engine that will ruin your day.
    the wally world oil is cheap and works good for me but if a guy doesn't experiment no one will ever know you have to willing to suffer the out come.
    Norman
     
  9. deacon

    deacon minor bike philosopher

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Messages:
    8,119
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yeah and my arteries would thank me for putting it in the bike instead of in my body.
     
  10. MotorbikeMike

    MotorbikeMike Dealer

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2007
    Messages:
    476
    Likes Received:
    1
    Hi Norman, these engines have been Illegal to Import since Dec. 31 2005. 99 percent of what is being sold is SMUGGLED. Some time, maybe soon, the EPA will clamp down on all this Illegal activity.

    I have NOT imported since the ban, Mine are legal, and I know of about 50 more.

    I refused to be a criminal just to sell on ebay.

    Mike
     
  11. Pablo

    Pablo Master Bike Builder & Forum Sponsor

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2007
    Messages:
    3,652
    Likes Received:
    0

    I had NO idea these engines are illegal. These kits are actually smuggled in? They are illegal for all uses? Please explain this "ban" or give me a link. I am very interested in this.
     
  12. deacon

    deacon minor bike philosopher

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Messages:
    8,119
    Likes Received:
    0
    Frankly I'm hoping they come out with better cheaper batteries. If they do, I guarantee you I'm back to elec bikes. I prefer them 100 percent over the gasoline, but as long as there is no reliable long range alternative I guess I stay with gasoline.

    It's kinda like our government, ain't working real good, just better than all the other alternatives.

    Since you no longer import them mike, what was the markup on those kits? I really am curious to know what the cost was to the seller. Actually more interested in what chinese stuff sells for since they are taking over most markets they get into.
     
    #12 deacon, Jan 17, 2008
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2008
  13. MotorbikeMike

    MotorbikeMike Dealer

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2007
    Messages:
    476
    Likes Received:
    1
    Hi Pablo and gang!

    The EPA OUTLAWED the Importation of these engines in 2005, none to be imported after that time. Specific people have chosen to ignore that fact, some buying parts and Illegally assembling them here, others printed false labels on thier boxes and pallets (Lies!), still others import in plain boxes apparently untill they get caught?

    Legal to, own, ride, resell and repair.

    Illegal to Import, build from parts, build from sub-assemblies.
    And yes this means Illegal to ship from Canada, Mexico, or where-ever! When I found out the ban was set I became a Whizzer dealer and that was summer of '05.

    Additionally, you can thank your friendly Japanese Engine Manufacterers who bought and paid for this ban with thier own money! It took them over 3 years to pay off, conive, and bribe thier way into getting Chinese 2-strokes shut off, while they remain able to import 1 "dirty" 2-stroke for every "clean" 4-stroke they ship here.

    Mike
     
  14. Norman

    Norman LORD VADER Moderator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2008
    Messages:
    2,605
    Likes Received:
    1
    Mike
    I'm wondering too what the engines real cost is. I've heard its around $20.00 for everything in china and that's for the H/T engine in general I wasn't given the cost vs size. I also understand the more bought the less the cost. Do some of these sellers buy a large shipping container full?! Man that would be a bunch. Still I really like these little engines and would love to see them being made and the equipment used to make them. Sort of stroll through a factory.:) If anybody's got pictures I'd like to see them on how they are made and the real cost.
    Norman
     
  15. deacon

    deacon minor bike philosopher

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Messages:
    8,119
    Likes Received:
    0
    I ran a photo studio for years. A picture I had made for 2bucks sold for up to 30 bucks so I know mark up going mfg to retail is huge. I'm not going to be shocked or begrudge you your profit margins. The cost of purchase of the product wholesale is not anywhere near what it cost to sell it. I expect most of us realize that. Like Norman I'm just curious.

    I still have my business licenses I guess I could apply for a distributorship and find out. Frankly I have no desire to sell anything anymore. Nor do I plan to buy ten engines for my own use. I'm just curious.
     
  16. northernlights

    northernlights New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    .cs..cs.Ethanol even just e10 will tear up these carbs if at all possible Recreation Fuel with no ethanol is the best thing for the fuel systems on these chineese engines it may be a little more money but if you want your carb to last and not have to worry if your not a daily driver. If it were me and i wasnt rideing but once a week i would drain my carb at the end of every ride im a certified small engine mechanic and would not suggest anything that i havent already done!
     
  17. Nehmo

    Nehmo Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2011
    Messages:
    188
    Likes Received:
    0
    Which engines in particular? And you mean into the US, correct?
     
  18. ProDigit

    ProDigit New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2013
    Messages:
    137
    Likes Received:
    0
    If not the least, these engines are supposed to run Bio fuels just fine!
    You'd only need to have very clean bio fuels, and making them only makes sense if you're a corn or cane farmer who uses the field's leftovers to create fuel.
    Otherwise it'd make more sense eating that corn!
     
  19. northernlights

    northernlights New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Alchol bio fuels may work i would still b concerned with the fuel system but bio veggie oil is ment for diesel engines only and alchol burns colder than gas so you qill need a hotter plug
    .cs.
     
  20. maniac57

    maniac57 Old, Fat, and still faster than you

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2011
    Messages:
    4,486
    Likes Received:
    3
    There IS a BIG difference in biofuel engines. They are DIESEL engines with much higher compression then a china girl. Alcohol MADE from bio sources is what I assume you are talking about. Much different animal than a biofuel engine.
    You can convert two strokes for alcohol use, but not biodiesel as far as I know.
    Even if you could, why would you want to?
     
    #20 maniac57, Apr 5, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2013

Share This Page