The Epic an electric tri car.

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indian22

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Dec 31, 2014
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So much simpler than that Steve. If tube is squared up and work surface is level & if fit up of fins to tube aren't too loose or too tight. gravity does all the work. spacers are whatever scrap plate is lying around that's also the correct thickness and flat, just laid loosen the plate. I used three separate.25" thick aluminum 1" wide by 4" long. Just laid in loose around the tube. They are only in for the three tacks and then removed for the short stitch welds, keep each stich short and you will see no warp,unless you try to weld the complete circumference in one pass. Then stitch the tacks on the fin bottom, only three one inch tacks are plenty for strength. Then clean up the spatter and repeat on the next fin. Remember your working from top cylinder down, welds are out of sight when the completed cylinder is flipped to the upright position; get the first fin right and the rest just tag along. Clamp the first fin to the work surface with two C clamps and get the tube centered and hold it down with a few pounds of weight on top while tacking, then remove it the weight from the tube & complete the three , on inch stitch's. Not much heat so little chance of warp. Use too much heat and you get warp, not matter what else you do.

The first fin is used as a clamp surface for the C clamps, but the clamps must be moved outside of the fin diameter to make room for the next fin, so clamping is done by using a couple of "thin" strips of steel to overlap the fin enough to securely hold for the rest of the welding process on the complete cylinder.

It took twice as long to explain this than it does to actually do it Welding is not like machining or cabinet making. fitting is important, but fine tolerances actual hamper the strength of a good wire or stick welds. Most jobs a 1/16" fit up allows great penetration on 10 gauge flat sheet to tube 1/32" on 14 ga. thinner material closer to butt up. Lot's of nuances for pro's but not needed here.

All the fit up is done prior to welding, none occurs during welding, Position,weld, clean up and space ...repeat till complete. Once the first fin is complete position is achieved my placing the three spacers, around the tube with one end sticking out far enough to grasp for easy removal after the tacking is completed. That's all there is to positioning the plates, quick & easy and nothing to think about except making a good weld which will never happen if you are worrying about fit up during actual welding.

Hope this helps Steve. With a TIG or MIG this is a 10 minute job per cylinder with flux core or stick, cleanup as you go could add 30 minutes or more to the task time and is more about cleanup than welding.

Rick C.

Good fabricators and pipe fitters make the welder and the project.
 

indian22

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Dec 31, 2014
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Steve I favor the look of the 7" case single over the 6" and you still have room for a center of head spark plug location & motor mounts.

V-twin is tight for center plugs, type of head you select determines a lot, including fin diameter. I'd think you could eliminate one fin and 3/4" off the tube height with the V and 5" diameter fins. Still using 3" diameter tube. V--twin looks rad in this frame!

Scale down of the V is a possibility as well, but still the head kinda' dictates how much.

I really like the two bar curve with either the single or twin & you need a bar relatively close for a top motor mount. If you take the bottom bar out you're left with a lot of open space. Moving the bottom bar up is better than elimination altogether & stronger as well.

Rick C.
 

fasteddy

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Feb 13, 2009
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Hi Rick,
I did a very quick drawing of where the fins would be on the cylinders and came to the same conclusion that it would look good if I had to trim as much as an inch off the cylinder(s). I will need to find another cylinder head if I go with a V twin. I did see some but it's the old "Doesn't ship to Canada."

The chap I bought the magneto didn't either until I asked him if he would. I'll give them a try. I have one head from the spare Jacobsen motor in the Indian tri car. I'm basing the engine size on it. It's 4-5/8" across so it should sit on a 5" fin well.

I'd made up my mind to go with the 7" crankcase myself. Only an 1" difference but I think it's noticeable and doesn't make sense to go with the 6" one.

Thank you for the advise.

Steve.
 

indian22

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Dec 31, 2014
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Yeah Steve having one head in hand, cut's the task in half at least. You might ask about for cast off, warped, stripped threads, as is , no guarantee required.... It takes the onus off the seller if it's just a paper weight he's providing!

What engine design type do you favor for your tri-car? Side valve engines are the easiest because of the huge number of heads produced for them & two stoke heads as well. The F head takes a lot more frame for a V or single & even then an engine offset is required. OHV are really tall, but all are possible with a large enough frame or scaled down to eighty percent of full scale.

I'm beginning to think living in Canada would warp my good natured independence. Of course I'm restricted to home life for an indefinite period of time, but I've still access to parts and stuff from other countries....I think.

Rick C.
 

fasteddy

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Feb 13, 2009
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Just a flat head engine, Rick. I'm just planning on a nice looking engine without any historical significance. The Indian tri car has dissuaded me doing that again.

You get used to living in Canada. Many American sellers have heard of Canada but all they know is it's up there somewhere and they don't want to deal with the customs. Post office has you fill out a simple form about what it is and how much it's worth and who you are and where it's going.

PayPal is accommodating and eBay will allow you to change where it can be bought from.

Other shippers make it even easier but soak us hard on this end for the pleasure of them doing it.

We are finally hearing what I said when this virus started that we may be in for a two year ride. Just look at what happened with the 1918-1919 Spanish flu epidemic and this won't be any different other than the medical knowledge is much more advanced.

There is an old Jewish curse that says. 'May you live in interesting times". We are indeed.

Steve.
 

Tom from Rubicon

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Apr 4, 2016
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There is an old Jewish curse that says. 'May you live in interesting times".
Steve,
Are you a anti Semite? Or is it a Canuck common expression, as a matter of course?
I thought it was Persian, but lo and behold.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_you_live_in_interesting_times
Chinese doing it to the hilt.

I think your choice of the 7" dia. crankcase is excellent.
Tom
 

fasteddy

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Feb 13, 2009
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British Columbia Canada
Hi Tom,
The first time I heard that was from a friend of my dads who was Jewish. Only survivor of his family who laughed at him when he advised them to move to England, Canada or the U.S. when Hitler came into power. He moved to the U.K. and survived to fight Hitler.

Interesting man with interesting stories. He told me how to say it in Yiddish. If you were Jewish interesting times meant that there was another Pogrom aimed at you. Interesting times indeed.

Steve.
 

fasteddy

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Feb 13, 2009
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Tom, if Bike Camp happens this summer and if your interested ask me about Uncle Harry. He had interesting memories about being an interrogator for the army and about the two French Resistance fighters he travelled with.

Steve.
 
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fasteddy

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Feb 13, 2009
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Here are some photos to give an Idea of what it will look like. I ordered two slant plug heads for a china girl engine from a supplier here in Canada. Shipped already.
Price was $13.00 each or $9.25 U.S. and no customs to deal with.

I bought them here. http://www.motorizedbicycle.ca/

Steve.
 

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indian22

Well-Known Member
Dec 31, 2014
4,734
7,740
113
Oklahoma
Here are some photos to give an Idea of what it will look like. I ordered two slant plug heads for a china girl engine from a supplier here in Canada. Shipped already.
Price was $13.00 each or $9.25 U.S. and no customs to deal with.

I bought them here. http://www.motorizedbicycle.ca/

Steve.
I see you're committed to V-twin & yeah that tank has a great shape. Slant heads will give you a little extra space as well and the flat head valve train also saves space. High exhaust ports also save space.

I think you've a really nice design in mind.

Rick C.