Old Guys Simplex moto-peddle bike

[indian22]

I'll be using folding pedals on not only the Simplex and my Harley tribute but also other bikes even those without kick start lever interference. These things are great, even though they don't look like classic diamond blocks or Schwinn bow ties. They store better & are less apt to trip and old fool in the garage. Fold up the pedal when walking beside the bike with no interference or when in the saddle backing out of tight spaces, like my bike storage area. Motorized bikes with wide pedal levers can get the most benefit from these. I'm really pleased with this inexspensive accessory.
Rick C.

 

[PeteMcP]

Those folding pedals look great Rick. Not a product I'd heard of, so I appreciate the heads-up.
Not only do they offer the benefits you mention, but I'm guessing they'll also help avoid a spill should a pedal ever contact the road when making a turn.
For exactly that reason, I may look at using them on my latest No.3 build. Even with the super-short 95mm long crank arms I'm using, the low position of the bottom bracket on this build means the pedals will be very low-slung.

 

[indian22]

No problems Pete. The pedals I purchased auto lock in the pedal use position & the trigger lock is the hole located in the middle of the pedal flat. Pulling the lock is very easy affair, but the pedal will fold in either direction. Other brands are available & one of those might fold only in one direction, but this one would have to be modified to suit your purpose of folding on impact, like a common cycle peg, which had been my plan of fabricating a folding pedal before finding these.

Both my Harley & Simplex builds use sub 100 mm pedal levers & are 3.5" & 4" frame to ground clearance, even so I rotate my inside pedal to the top on all deep curves & turns. The rest of the time I ride with both pedals flat (1/4 stroke position) & with even weight on the pedals, much as one would while riding a horse. This is the same as is practiced by accomplished cyclists & becomes second nature quite quickly even quicker if one survives a nasty spill due to hanging a lever. I'm probably preaching to the choir Pete tho it might save a couple of cyclists who are quite certain their riding technique needs no improvement, but are open to a safer riding experience.

Rick C.

 

[indian22]

The 2 quills came in, identical one's for the handlebars and another to be chopped off & inserted upside down through the fork steer tube, from the top of the steer tube & allowed to drop to the bottom of the tube to stabilize the leaf pack with a 3/8" bolt run up from the bottom of the spring pack & locking the quill & spring pack in place. This bottom quill first has the upper half of it's length cut off (the handle bar clamp section) & it's prevented from pulling out of the tube by the weld bead connection of the tube and the fork plate. The length cut off this bottom quill will be just enough to allow full insertion of the upper quill which will hold the handle bars securely in place.
The forces placed on this quill connection won't be great, but the lateral support provided is important as is the elimination of any tendency for the spring pack to "rock" under load. A square U bolt holding the spring pack up against the heavy steel plate of the fork will be the primary connection to hold the fork in place during the downward spring deflection & the moment of maximum load on the suspension.

I should have photos later to help clear up my detailed description. Rick C.

 

[indian22]

Quill bolt and U-bolt really secure the spring stack to the fork steer tube & the 1/4" thick fork plate. Curtis and Rick S. inspired me to get started on the Simplex leaf & girder fork. Thanks to both you guys along with Harold B. & Wret whose completed leaf forks added so much to their great builds. I've some more to do on my fork, but getting started is often the hard part...building is fun! Rick C.

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[indian22]

Until final fit and finish this is it for the Simplex girder leaf fork. I'll be back at work today on the hand shift lever. Following that a 30 tooth sprocket change from the current 54 t and coaster to disc brake conversion. Rick C.

 

[PeteMcP]

Really liking what you did with this leaf sprung fork Rick. Elevated those standard CNOL rigid girder forks to a whole new level. You're inspiring me to have a crack at fabbing a set for a future build. If/when I do, the only thing I'd be tempted to do differently would be to use rod ends instead of hex adjusters. Same as those I used on my Aero Cycle Car's truss rods up front on the chassis. See pic. Yours is a more 'period' looking solution no doubt. I'm presently using M6 rod ends and sleeved threaded rod to fabricate the shifter linkage on my current build.
Question: are those cast 'Simplex' rockers something that's still available, or ones you've raided from your trusty - and no doubt bounteous - old parts bin?

 

[Bob53]

Rick, you don't think outside the. You threw the box away and did it Rick's way. Another fine example of outstanding fab skills. Bob

 

[sportscarpat]

Hi Rick,
Man, lots of good stuff going on here. The forks are looking good and folding pedals would help me to park bikes closer in my shop. Simplex rockers sure are a nice part from a time when cast steel parts were made in the states when needed. To bad they are not available in quantity today. I saw those electric bike hubs a few pages back. Any additional info on those. Maybe you mentioned it already but I didn't catch it.
Pat

 

[indian22]

Really liking what you did with this leaf sprung fork Rick. Elevated those standard CNOL rigid girder forks to a whole new level. You're inspiring me to have a crack at fabbing a set for a future build. If/when I do, the only thing I'd be tempted to do differently would be to use rod ends instead of hex adjusters. Same as those I used on my Aero Cycle Car's truss rods up front on the chassis. See pic. Yours is a more 'period' looking solution no doubt. I'm presently using M6 rod ends and sleeved threaded rod to fabricate the shifter linkage on my current build.
Question: are those cast 'Simplex' rockers something that's still available, or ones you've raided from your trusty - and no doubt bounteous - old parts bin?

View attachment 97841

Pete every time I see your Aero I want one & that Guzzi motor all done up & framed perfectly by your great suspension and coach work I'm inspired! Thanks for your comments and the input on the rod ends is great. I had the hex adjusters in hand for the first mock up & they may or may not be on the final fit. As for your shift linkage rod ends should be perfect for your linkage. I opted for Heims (wrong twist) on my right hand lever shift conversion for the Simplex & just received several Heims in both left and right thread. I tend to piece ideas together with what is lying about, before I lose train of thought & once dimensions, geometry & proof of concept are actualized; I'm set to fabricate my bits & pieces plus order in the proper fasteners & hardware necessary to actually complete a functional mechanism. This is also the point where I actually attempt to integrate & harmonize with the whole...sometimes all this actually works.

The girder forks are substantial or I would not have attempted to use them as a base for my Simplex leaf fork project. They also have the period correct look I was after. You might recall I ordered a set for my Grubbe China girl and almost immediately ordered another set for the leaf fork base. I may never build another leaf fork. I've built 9 bikes (the V twin will be my tenth) over the last 5 years & have yet to use the same fork design (with the exception of the dual spring Sunlite which this fork replaces on the Simplex), fuel tank or frame in any of the ten bikes. 6 frames are steel and 4 constructed with aluminum. Four different engine designs are used to power these bikes & these motors are evenly divided between 2 stroke & 4 cycle. I really like to change thing up, while staying in the style of the early classics. I don't copy but I borrow a lot.

Pete those cast Simplex rockers, were generously gifted me for this specific project & appear to be new old stock, but that's my guess. If they are currently being recast & I get a lead I will share this information. They are pretty awesome & I used a set of these (on a Simplex dual spring fork) for my Harley Davidson, Keystone frame "Peashooter" build. I'll p.m you. the name and phone number of a Simplex vendor who might have a pair in stock. This is a hobby to me and am always glad to help interested parties get together to make a deal that works for them both.

Yes my parts bins are copious as is my scrap collection...lots of mistakes!! Rick C.

 

[indian22]

Hi Rick,
Man, lots of good stuff going on here. The forks are looking good and folding pedals would help me to park bikes closer in my shop. Simplex rockers sure are a nice part from a time when cast steel parts were made in the states when needed. To bad they are not available in quantity today. I saw those electric bike hubs a few pages back. Any additional info on those. Maybe you mentioned it already but I didn't catch it.
Pat

Thanks Pat I'm still just having fun. It was my good fortune to find the folding pedals & my pleasure to pass the info along. The rockers were a gift for this project & don't appear to have ever been used & they just reek of nostalgia.

The 17" wheels were new old stock left over from the demise of the Volochi electric bike company. I bought 3 sets at the tail end of last year on an Ebay listing. I double checked a moment ago & the seller had no current products listed. I started to buy all five sets on a best offer, but decided I'd check later and didn't. The company went under in 2003 so were only around for a couple of years but their electric scooter (no pedals) got some good reviews. They were DOT rated & the rims are stamped, fronts are twin rotor ready, rear hub is drilled for a single rotor. 10mm front through axle & 12mm rear I recall. nice size sealed bearings, 2.1 rim width. I mounted with moped speed rated 2.25" & 2.5" with no problem, but wider? I'm not certain, but I'd like to try a 2.75" on one. I didn't gauge the spokes but I'd think at least 11 or maybe 10 ga. The guy I bought them from said they ran 2.5" on the electrics with no problems. With a 2.5" mounted they stand about 24". I used two 8" tire spoons and they mounted easily enough

The front hub is wide & with the disc (I'm using only one rotor so a double may require additional space) the forks need about 5.5" between the drops. My V twin frame is set up that way in the rear also & I've allowed 5.5" between the drops as well. Rick C.

 

[indian22]

Rick, you don't think outside the. You threw the box away and did it Rick's way. Another fine example of outstanding fab skills. Bob

Bob welcome to the forum and thank you for your kind praise. I do have a certain way that I approach a build & definite expectations that I'm building toward & I'd like to take all the credit for any of the things I do right, but truth is I actually doubt I've ever had a completely original thought when it comes to fabrication, but I've been blessed for almost 71 years by those who did and I've attempted to learn and actualize along the way. I came late to this forum and in that 4 years or so I've continually learned from those who kindly contribute showing & explaining the how and the why of their moto-cycling designs. So Bob as you compliment me I in turn acknowledge my debt to others. Rick C.

 

[fasteddy]

Fantastic use of those forks, Rick. Set up perfectly. It will be interesting to see how many leaves you need to have them riding properly. That style of fork suits early bike so well.

I used to have a small foundry cast parts for me and I wonder if there are any left today that would cast the rockers. I would think that with the Simplex restorers and anyone wanting to make a springer front end there would be a niche market for them. They certainly are rugged and would withstand a lot of wear.

Steve.

 

[indian22]

Thanks Steve. The Simplex dual spring fork, cast rockers on my Harley Peashooter get a lot of positive comment. So many small foundry's have folded tent here in the states, but I wonder if any hobbyists or even clubs are actively looking for income producing projects? At any rate the rockers are from a different age. Rick C.

 

[PeteMcP]

Rick,
Just a thought.... Here in the UK, part of my model train kit manufacturing business (side-lined to the back burner 18 months ago so I can devote most all my time to caring for my wife Jen's dementia) involved me making patterns for parts which I subsequently had cast in brass or nickel silver. I'm in contact with several small foundries producing investment castings, along with a couple of other foundries who work in the heritage steam railway world and specialize in one-off and short-run green sand castings in iron alloys or aluminium. Wouldn't be a problem for me to source repro Simplex rockers. Copyright issues aside, all I'd need to get the ball rolling would be a set of master castings.
Pics show an NGG16 Beyer Garratt locomotive I assembled from one of my photo-etched brass kits - adorned with a myriad of lost wax brass castings produced from my master patterns. These are the kind of brass castings I am able to produce. Happy to look at sourcing larger castings such as those Simplex rockers. Think it's worth a shot...?

View attachment 97848

 

[indian22]

Rick,
Just a thought.... Here in the UK, part of my model train kit manufacturing business (side-lined to the back burner 18 months ago so I can devote most all my time to caring for my wife Jen's dementia) involved me making patterns for parts which I subsequently had cast in brass or nickel silver. I'm in contact with several small foundries producing investment castings, along with a couple of other foundries who work in the heritage steam railway world and specialize in one-off and short-run green sand castings in iron alloys or aluminium. Wouldn't be a problem for me to source repro Simplex rockers. Copyright issues aside, all I'd need to get the ball rolling would be a set of master castings.
Pics show an NGG16 Beyer Garratt locomotive I assembled from one of my photo-etched brass kits - adorned with a myriad of lost wax brass castings produced from my master patterns. These are the kind of brass castings I am able to produce. Happy to look at sourcing larger castings such as those Simplex rockers. Think it's worth a shot...?

View attachment 97844 View attachment 97846 View attachment 97848 View attachment 97849 View attachment 97850 View attachment 97851

Dang Pete that's great work, love old trains. 'll kick this around & see if interest is there and this is an open invitation to any forum members that might have interest in cast parts, to respond to Pete's offer to look into sourcing. You certainly won't be stepping on my toes in doing so! Rick C.

 

[indian22]

I finished the cobbled up version of the hand lever shift today and took the Simplex out for a brief test ride & "learned things". It functioned & the basic design is kinda close, but needs some work. Shift lever length and throw are way off & the motor is a bit in the way to utilize the remedy I'd like to apply. A curved lever may be in order. The linkage on the selector shaft side of things is fine however, just needs tidying a bit. Rick C.

 

[indian22]

I'm still in the process of learning things about the shift mech. After first making sure all was mechanically solid, aligned & free to rotate I turned my attention to the lengths of the two levers on the left side. It seems I'll need a tad more leverage to rotate the gear selector shaft dependably & with minimum effort from the hand lever. Which would seem reasonable given the lengths of both the foot employed and the original lever which previously facilitated gear selection.Ran up against the clock, so back to it today. It's all a process. Rick C.

 

[indian22]

Something I mentioned previously was lengthening, strengthening & enclosing the original girder fork drop outs, but this is necessary for complete suspension cycling as well as my safety/ of mind. So I've that to do as well.

I've also decided to continue the use of my adjustable & shock absorbed ahead stem handle bar quill to mount the Sportsman flyer board track style handlebars...that whole setup just works so well already on the Simplex that I see no really good reason to abandon it & having the bars mounted a few inches forward feels less cramped too.

One of my reasons for changing to the girder leaf fork setup on the Simplex was not only to add to the strength of the bike in order to run a sidecar, but also to improve handling with the sidecar mounted or running solo. The Simplex is currently setup with a steering stabilizer connected between fork & frame and while this works well with the Sunlite dual spring fork it does limit the turning radius of the bike. This isn't a big problem riding solo but with a car attached it's not going to work; as I'll not be able to lean the rig. Parking would be a nightmare, so I'm hoping the leaf fork will be a compromise and work reasonably well both solo and as a rig. While the trailing link design is good solo with the leaf it is is less well thought of as a sidecar fork configuration, but the majority of criticism seems reserved for touring speed handling with a car. I plan on parade speed with the car so I feel it will work well once I'm shut of the steering stabilizer limiting turn radius. Rick C..

 

[PeteMcP]

Rick,
Followed-up your tip regarding the folding pedals and treated my latest build to a set. There were loads of eBay sellers in the UK offering them. Don't know how I hadn't come across them before now. Excellent product. Thanks for the heads-up.