So what engine chain do you run?

[MacZulu]

Just wondering if there are many people running chains lighter duty than the 415, I have a kmc 415 hd and it's too big. it rubs the engine through its rotation in the sprocket housing, so I'm running a 415 right now.

I'm pretty sure I've read one guy who builds for business said he uses a 410, the z410 kmc I think. I like the security of the 415, but man is it a pain to deal with. and I think it adds more drag when just pedaling. Right now I'm still tuning the motor, but when she's running well I'll start everything else.

I'm going to replace my 2 rightside chains from z410s to k710s, I read a member recommend it, so I read up on them and decided to try them. I know they are tough to break an don't have half links. I could use a 410 half link, but then whats the point of changing chains if I do that. there are stronger kmc chains, but the k710 is $14 CAD (that's almost free USD) and that's seems good value.

I'm considering going to the k710 on the leftside too, they have a strength rating higher than the 415 apparently. although I have read pedal bike people complain about stretch, so I'll see how they do on the rightside first. and I also doubt the pitch is right for the engine sprocket.

Anybody running lighter chains? any life experience you'd like to pass along?

 

[Venice Motor Bikes]

The stock 415 kit chain is more than strong enough for these little engines & should provide the proper clearance.
The trick to making sure they don't break is making sure the rear sprocket is lined up with the front engine sprocket (& that it's also mounted on the wheel as perfect as possible).

I have been using a 410H (BMX chain) on my race bikes for several years without any issues, but the sprockets need to be milled thinner to fit in the chain & also have to be mounted extra perfect to avoid issues.

 

[MacZulu]

VMB I just want to get away from the 415 because it such a pain to break and rejoin, I don't use master links which keeps the chain stronger but makes chain adjustments a pia. Even with my heavy duty chain breaker I still need to use my small vice grips to keep the outer plate from bending as I force the pin out.

This is not a priority for me, but when it's running well I will start tweaking all the things I dont like or think can be improved on the bike. Chains, cable clean up, paint work stuff like that.

So if I want to run a different chain left side I will probably have to mod my engine sprocket so the chain fits well

 

[Venice Motor Bikes]

This is the chain tool I've been using for years to break #415 chains... https://www.ebay.com/itm/Park-Tool-...=item2151650ac8:g:OAYAAOSwiOZcRmKK:rk:20:pf:0

 

[Venice Motor Bikes]

Here's a chain chart that might help you....

 

[MacZulu]

thanks for the info man, I might think about getting that Park tool and keeping the 415.

I have one of these, https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/-25-to-60-roller-chain-breaker/A-p8039311e

but the 415 is a little too wide to fit the whole chain width in the tool. So I get clamped on the near outer plate not the far one, that's why I use the mini vice grips.

the chart says the 415 tensile strength is 1600, that must be kg right?

I was reading through this kmc chain guide
http://kmcchain.us/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/ChainGuide.pdf

it says th k710 is 1300 kg, and they have a k910 that is 1500. so the 415 is stronger, which makes sense looking at it construction in comparison. I guess I'm hoping to make the pedaling smoother, feels clunky right now. my second k710 arrived today so I will swap out the right side chains soon, then I can see how well it holds up.

I kinda think I need to go over each chain tension again, starting on the left. looking up the park tool you suggest I found it at chain reaction cycles as a Park 3.2 for $36 CAD, just a newer version I guess. I think that tool might be a better idea than a new chain, I have lots of 415 to use as well.

thanks for your help VMB, I appeciate it.

 

[MacZulu]

Ok, I went and checked out my chain breaker again. I think with a file I can get it to fit the 415. It looks like there is enough material to remove to get them to fit. So I'll see if I get them to work for me first.

 

[Greg58]

I have a chain breaker in my tools on my bike in case of a breakdown, here at home I use a bench grinder or 4 1/2 hand held grinder to grind the pins down. I did that for years on large chains, some were #100.

 

[Greg58]

A hand held grinder is a great tool to have, you can get a entry level grinder from harbor freight for $10 when they have a sale.

 

[MacZulu]

Hey Greg, I plan on using my dremel to remove the mushroomed pin end on my k710 to break it easier. I do have a 4 1/2" grinder, a very handy tool for the bike work.

Tonight I will try deal with all three chains

 

[Greg58]

Its fairly easy, I grind the pins down till I start hitting the side plate of the chain, a little twisting and it comes apart.

 

[Nashville Kat]

MacZulu- What you probably want is a 415 INDUSTRIAL/TRIKE chain. I've used only this for years-
They can sometimes be hard to find but usually a search will come up with them- I think KMC has one. The cost is not usually much different when stocks are normal.

same pitch as with a regular or heavy duty 415, but they have smaller side plates- they don't derail- I tried a 410 once and narrow motor sprock built for one- and it came off so fast I decided I didn't want to take the chance and never looked back.

The 415 Industrial / Trike chains weigh literally HALF as much somehow and they roll just incredibly more easy- you'll notice the pedal difference first and then know your motor must be feeling it too.

 

[Nashville Kat]

https://www.bikewagon.com/kmc-3-16-...MIvc3UrJiD4AIViozICh1S1AVLEAQYASABEgJSW_D_BwE
Check these photos against the other 415 chains and you can see the plates are much sleeker- but be careful- they call them all "Heavy Duty" but "Industrial / Trike 415 " is almost a different chain completely
I haven't put a motor chain on or off for years but what I think I mostly dis was use a cheap clunky Boygoesfast chain tool to break the chain- BUT DO NOT PUSH TJE PIN ALL THE WAY THTOUGH- you've got to use small turns to make sure the pin stays in the other side. Then to reassemble - usually channel locks will squeeze it most of the way back through and you need a small pin breaker or a punch to finish driving it.

 

[Nashville Kat]

end Did I put a thinner bike chain tool pin in the other to drive it the last 1/16" ?- can't recall, but something like that.

 

[MacZulu]

thanks for the new info Nashville, I hadn't seen that chain in my reseach. After searching for it myself I could only find one other vendor, mbrebel.com. I wonder if that 415 has better halflinks? I hate the cotter pin links for the 415s.

I know what you mean about not puching the pin all the way out, I've done that a couple of times with the 415. I used my small C vice grips with tiny incremental pressure clicks to rest the pin to the point I could use my tool and little vice grips to get it back together. now I end up taking the chain out of the tool early a few times to check before I finally clear the pin from the inside and the chain breaks but pin is solid in the outer plate

that lighter duty 415 does look like a good leftside option

 

[Nashville Kat]

I think half link for 415 Industrial Trike may indeed be a problem to find. I know what you mean about the cotter pin half link, but I have found standard 415 half links w/o the cotter.

Still I've never used them. I don't run any tensioners- a decision arrived at before the newer spring loaded things- but always set the Motor chain first with no half links and then match the pedal chain. Smaller rear motor sprocks always have better frame clearances than larger ones- the bike below has a 34 alloy sprock disk brake drillings directly bolted to drilled flat sided large flange hub with titanium bolts.

(not familiar with the 710- ? chain you mentioned in the O.P.) Still another option is using a derailleur
($10 "Judax:" or some name like that is the best functional secret for that price- works great! )
anyway that tensions the pedal side to the set motor chain- also small and light sprung chain tensioners out the past couple of years- about 10 to 15 dollars, if you care to run single freewheels.

I don't put a lot of miles on the bikes these days, but there is a drawback with matching chains in that the motor chain will stretch faster than the pedal chains- not a functional problem except in terms of matching tension, so this has to be adjusted once in a great while.

As I'm no longer pushing the bikes up to a second floor apartment I'd probably be tempted to us a derailleur again, and a 5 or even 3- for lightness cog.

 

[xXNightRiderXx]

If you're doing a 79cc pred build, you will want a 420 chain, or an expensive 415. The cheap ones that come with the kit can't hold up to the HP. Ever since I swapped the initial two chains out with 420 motorcycle chains, I haven't had an issue. I also use a KMC Z-link to drive the chainring, and a KMC x-link chain to drive the cassette. These chains are actually stretch resistant, and I use those two for exactly the system they were designed for. a 410 single speed chain for the chainring (the Z-link) and an 8 speed chain for the cassette (the x-link).