Pulled Over in Grant Florida
- Thread starter TeddyB
- Start date
Well as you can see since i`am writing this i was NOT sentenced to jail today! the bad news is Motorized bicycles ARE considered motor vehicles!!!!! it was decided by a 6 person impartial jury! as it turned out i got my jury after all because it was to late for the prosecution to change venue! But My defense was disabled significantly as most of my evidence i wanted to present (specifically the notarized letter from the Dmv) that states bicycles remain bicycles even after the kit is installed was not allowed by the judge! We did our best but ultimately the law has one!
No Appeals! the jury has decided and i have been sentenced with 49 hrs community service and court cost totaling $450.00 you cannot appeal a misdemeanor in Florida that caries NO jail time if found guilty ! we are screwed and the only way to fix this is get the laws changed!
What were you found guiltily of EXACTLY?
And what statutes did they use as prosecution?
And why wouldn't the judge allow for the DMV document to be included...
If I was your lawyer, I would have put up a HUGE stink about that..
That was the biggest part of your defense. To not allow it in as evidence, doesn't seem right...
The judge HAD to know that you were going to use it... If the prosecution was made aware of the document and told the judge about it (which I'm not sure they're legally allowed to do) and he knew that if he didn't allow it in you would definitely lose, I would say that sounds a bit illegal..
Can ya give us more details?
And what statutes did they use as prosecution?
And why wouldn't the judge allow for the DMV document to be included...
If I was your lawyer, I would have put up a HUGE stink about that..
That was the biggest part of your defense. To not allow it in as evidence, doesn't seem right...
The judge HAD to know that you were going to use it... If the prosecution was made aware of the document and told the judge about it (which I'm not sure they're legally allowed to do) and he knew that if he didn't allow it in you would definitely lose, I would say that sounds a bit illegal..
Can ya give us more details?
to begin with the statute 316, although the document was notarized it was deemed to be insufficient because it is not known who wrote it! as i said before the prosecution objected to several issues even some of my comments when on the stand! you want to talk about fair? did you know in Florida it is legal for the prosecutor to have two closing arguments whereas the defense is only allowed one? tell me about fair again!
Maybe I'm not stating it correctly? Or you're being evasive, whether you realize it or not..
What were the statutes, you were accused of breaking and ultimately found guilty of?
Stating "316" is EXTREMELY vague as that encompasses about 1,400+ statutes.
What were the statute numbers exactly?
What were the statutes, you were accused of breaking and ultimately found guilty of?
Stating "316" is EXTREMELY vague as that encompasses about 1,400+ statutes.
What were the statute numbers exactly?
miked826
New Member
Re: Going to court next week" 4/26/12
If it was a "Motor Vehicle" it would have to comply with DOT and NHTSA standards as such, and neither agency recognize a motorized bicycle as a "Motor Vehicle". Not once in any Fed statute are any bicycles, with motor smaller than 5HP, referred to as a "Motor Vehicle". Fed laws hold supremacy over state laws. States can make up and enforce any laws they want regarding them as long as they don't refer to them as a "Motor Vehicle".
Federal law
"In the United States, federal law governing ICE motorized bicycles is subject to interpretative rulings by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) at the U.S. Department of Transportation. Under current NHTSA rules, a "motor-driven cycle" (a definition that includes a two-wheel vehicle such as a bicycle with an add-on ICE engine of five brake horsepower or less and a speed capability of more than 20 miles per hour lacks both a Vehicle Identification Number (VIN) and standard onroad safety equipment such as mirrors, turn signal lamps, side marker lamps, and stop lamps), then the vehicle shall not be considered a "motor vehicle" as defined by DOT/NHTSA regulations, but instead is defined as an off-road vehicle (since the lack of a VIN and on-road equipment indicates that a vehicle was not manufactured primarily for use on public roads.) Such off-road vehicles are considered to be neither motor vehicles nor motorcycles, as those terms are defined under federal law.
Under present-day NHTSA rules, the final decision as to whether such federally defined off-road vehicles may be legally operated on public roads is determined by the laws of the state in which the vehicle is being operated."
If it was a "Motor Vehicle" it would have to comply with DOT and NHTSA standards as such, and neither agency recognize a motorized bicycle as a "Motor Vehicle". Not once in any Fed statute are any bicycles, with motor smaller than 5HP, referred to as a "Motor Vehicle". Fed laws hold supremacy over state laws. States can make up and enforce any laws they want regarding them as long as they don't refer to them as a "Motor Vehicle".
Federal law
"In the United States, federal law governing ICE motorized bicycles is subject to interpretative rulings by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) at the U.S. Department of Transportation. Under current NHTSA rules, a "motor-driven cycle" (a definition that includes a two-wheel vehicle such as a bicycle with an add-on ICE engine of five brake horsepower or less and a speed capability of more than 20 miles per hour lacks both a Vehicle Identification Number (VIN) and standard onroad safety equipment such as mirrors, turn signal lamps, side marker lamps, and stop lamps), then the vehicle shall not be considered a "motor vehicle" as defined by DOT/NHTSA regulations, but instead is defined as an off-road vehicle (since the lack of a VIN and on-road equipment indicates that a vehicle was not manufactured primarily for use on public roads.) Such off-road vehicles are considered to be neither motor vehicles nor motorcycles, as those terms are defined under federal law.
Under present-day NHTSA rules, the final decision as to whether such federally defined off-road vehicles may be legally operated on public roads is determined by the laws of the state in which the vehicle is being operated."
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miked826
New Member
APPEAL THAT VERDICT! State Laws can not supersede Federal Laws.
Article VI, Clause 2 of the United States Constitution, known as the Supremacy Clause, establishes the U.S. Constitution, federal statutes, and U.S. Treaties as "the supreme law of the land." The text provides that these are the highest form of law in the U.S. legal system, and mandates that all state judges must follow federal law when a conflict arises between federal law and either the state constitution or state law of any state.
Did they at least say what the ruling was based on (state or federal law)? This is a travesty of justice, plain and simple. LOL
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miked826
New Member
I'm sorry I didn't see this post sooner. DOT/NHTSA Laws rule over Florida as well, no matter what that misinformed jury thinks. LOL
miked826
New Member
You don't need no stinkin' attorney. All you need is a laptop or smartphone that's connected to the internet. I took my quotes straight from NHTSA's website. LOL
It's so clearly stated on their website that even a Florida Judge could understand it.
miked826
New Member
You obviously didn't read his post, so I'll quote it again for you. LOL
"Well as you can see since i`am writing this i was NOT sentenced to jail today! the bad news is Motorized bicycles ARE considered motor vehicles!!!!! it was decided by a 6 person impartial jury! as it turned out i got my jury after all because it was to late for the prosecution to change venue! But My defense was disabled significantly as most of my evidence i wanted to present (specifically the notarized letter from the Dmv) that states bicycles remain bicycles even after the kit is installed was not allowed by the judge! We did our best but ultimately the law has one!"
State don't have the authority to make that ruling only the Feds do.
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What you missed was that it continued on to say.. Such a vehicle is considered OFF-ROAD by federal law, BUT can be decided by EACH state as to the legality of use on PUBLIC Roads.