Cantilever's vs V brake's

[HDCowboy]

So what the scoop now on Cantilever's vs V brake's? Back in the late 90's (yeah I'm old) when I was into mountain biking cantilever's were the way to go! Those damn cheap V brake bikes wouldn't even stop you on a hard downhill and all the bad ass mountain bikes had cantilevers on them. Seems all the threads here are either about disc brakes or V brakes.

I new to motorized bicycles and in the middle of my 1st build, I've already got a disc brake on my front wheel and was thinking about going with either a cantilever or v brake in the rear to avoid the hassle and clearance issues of having to set up a disc brake right next to the motor sprocket. Waiting on UPS to deliver my rear wheel today (should be here anytime now) and my next step on my build is going to be figuring out what kind of brakes I want to use on it. What do you guys feel is best and what do yall use??

Thanks for any help....HD

UPDATE: Now that I think about it, the funky brakes that came on the cheap bikes back in them days weren't V brakes at all! They were more rounded U shaped brakes like these that I guess are now are refereed to as caliper brakes. But I still remember the mountain bikes using cantilevers.

 

[young grease monkey]

Cantilever is still the best rim brake, I had a 90s specialized that could do stoppies with them! plus they stay in adjustment longer, just totally superior. Only thing is you gotta have the frame lugs for them

 

[HDCowboy]

Yeah I went with the Skyhawk GT2-A frame and its got the lugs on it for the brakes......

http://motorbicycling.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=70950&d=1403380349

I picked up a set of V brakes at the bicycle shop earlier today without doing my homework and not really realizing what I was buying, luckily I didn't even open the package. I will have to take them back tomorrow and get some cantilevers.

Thanks.....HD

 

[HDCowboy]

Hmmmm..........went to another shop and bought a set of cantilevers and mounted them this evening but I was kinda missing a bracket to support the end of my cable on the bike, they worked but the cable didnt really have the springy feel that I liked and my the way I had to route the cable looked funky. So just for the heck of it I went ahead and opened up the package with the V brakes in them and tried mounting them instead and to my surprise they felt great, think I might just stick with them & keep the cantilevers for spare parts if I ever need them.

 

[frank66]

cantilever brakes vs vbrakes? vbrake for sure.

 

[KCvale]

cantilever brakes vs vbrakes? vbrake for sure.

Don't confuse Cantilever V-brakes with C-brakes, real cantilever brakes have V brake bosses, a C brake is has one center mount where the fender mount is and a single unit.

Anything with bosses for 2 separate brake arms is better than a typical C-brake, but even a C is still better than no brake at all.

The side pull V's are a bit harder to get adjusted than the center pull V's, but there is nothing that can come loose like the mental plate that connects the 2 cables on a center pull that disables the brakes completely.

 

[mapbike]

I like V brakes best also and I have one old MTN bike with the canti lever brakes that is OK.

some of my bikes are just set up for the Caliper Brakes which do a good job if they're good quality C Brake units and you use good quality shoes on them.

I just ordered this set for one of my bikes just a few minutes ago, these are good ones and at a good price.

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&id=271595017629&alt=web

KC is dead on right, a front and rear C brake is way better than none at all and will do a much better job than an old wore out K-Stop coaster hub only like comes on a lot of the big box store bikes.

 

[KCvale]

Yep, just a dual pull and a pair of C's and the coaster brake is an emergency brake.
<$40.
Your first real wreck will cost you more than that, and that's if you don't get hurt too bad.

 

[mapbike]

Yep, just a dual pull and a pair of C's and the coaster brake is an emergency brake.
<$40.
Your first real wreck will cost you more than that, and that's if you don't get hurt too bad.

Amen.... to that KC

I bought one of those dual cables that will allow front and rear brake to be applied from a standard single lever, I haven't tried it yet and am just wondering if you have any experience with them.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/dual-brake-...Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2c746bee14

 

[KCvale]

Amen.... to that KC

I bought one of those dual cables that will allow front and rear brake to be applied from a standard single lever, I haven't tried it yet and am just wondering if you have any experience with them.

Ya, I have seen that type, I don't like them, you have to adjust pull individually.

I like the self adjusting 'teeter totter' dual pulls Sick Bike Parts has for $12, it keeps equal force on each brake even if they are out of a adjustment.

It even works for different pull length brakes like a disc and V.

 

[mapbike]

Personally I wouldn't want pull to be the same on front and rear brakes, and the dual cable I have only has one adjustment that adjust both cables so if both brake wear evenly that one adjustment will adjust each of them equally.

looks to me like the Dual pull lever would be the one that would require both cables to be adjusted since it uses a cable on the lever for each brake so as the shoes wear down both cables will need to be adjusted to compensate for that wear.

Personally, I would want the rear brake to engage much harder and quicker than the front, going straight on pavement when braking would work ok either way, but get on some loose gravel while making a turn and hit the front brake and you're going down,

Looks like either set up will work with correct adjustment at the brakes, I just thought I'd ask if you had actually used the single lever-Dual pull Cable set up KC, but it sounds like you haven't since you think it has two different adjustments and it actually only has one that will affect both brakes at the same time.

Thanks for the reply though and ride safe.

 

[KCvale]

Looks like either set up will work with correct adjustment at the brakes, I just thought I'd ask if you had actually used the single lever-Dual pull Cable set up KC

I have seen and replaced a couple different kinds, yours looked like the kind where both cable ends hook right to the arm, one has a longer pull than the other.

Another was one cable to a funky plate and clamps to have a single cable pull 2 via a center pull V brake cable.

As far as each brake of course you adjust at the wheel or with the adjustments on the brake lever itself.
TIP, I make a point to put the front brake on the front brake lever connection so I don't have follow the cable to see what brake it is for ;-}

 

[mapbike]

I have seen and replaced a couple different kinds, yours looked like the kind where both cable ends hook right to the arm, one has a longer pull than the other.

Another was one cable to a funky plate and clamps to have a single cable pull 2 via a center pull V brake cable.

As far as each brake of course you adjust at the wheel or with the adjustments on the brake lever itself.
TIP, I make a point to put the front brake on the front brake lever connection so I don't have follow the cable to see what brake it is for ;-}

Oh yeah I have seen that one that goes to the "funky plate" I've got an old Mongoose bmx bike in the junk pile that had that set up, never understood the reason for it myself, cables actually ran through bar stem and bar also, kinda cool looking I guess but just more stuff to go wrong in my opinion...

Yeah there may be more than one type of these out there, I may give this one a try just to see if its worth a hoot or not, I took a chance on it for $10 just thinking it might be a useable set up but I could be very wrong about that, thanks for the advice and comments here KC, if it does work out Ok I'll let it be known, but if its a hunk of junk I'll comment on that also...LOL

Thanks again sir.

map

 

[boxcar]

V brakes have more leverage = more stopping power = more rim wear.. But are the best brakes when it comes to clinchers.
I have and will continue to run Caliper brakes on my road bike. ( peddler )
As map sed, buy quality components when it comes to brakes.....
Nothing beats disks though.
I have decided to run nothing but discs on all my future gas bike builds...

Now to the levers:
I like the dual pull levers over the cable converters for many reasons.
The dual pull allows you to adjust your brake bios a cable converter does not.
If you brake a cable or a cable slips in the binder on a cable converted bike you are in trouble.
On a dual pull not so much......

 

[mapbike]

No dual pulls for me on a motorized bike.... a wreck looking for a place to happen, water on the road or loose gravel while making a turn and suddenly you need to slow down a bit, you grab the lever, the front tire skids, bike jets right out from under you and......HE DOWN...!!!

No Thank You... But hey to each there own I personally wont ever have a dual pull brake on anything I own, there is a good reason motorcycles don't have them, to me its just simple common sense, but we all know that is in short supply these days ain't it....LOL!

Dry pavement and always braking in a straight line and most likely you be fine with a dual pull, but a need to slow quickly while making a turn and you'll find out real quick what I bad idea the dual pull lever was.

anyone who doubts this, get on your bike, get up to 15mph, find an are where there is some loose dirt or gravel on the road, start into a medium leaning turn and then reach up and hit the front brake and then let me know how it turned out....LOL

 

[KCvale]

No dual pulls for me on a motorized bike.... a wreck looking for a place to happen, water on the road or loose gravel while making a turn and suddenly you need to slow down a bit, you grab the lever, the front tire skids, bike jets right out from under you and......HE DOWN...!!!

Umm, gotta differ with ya here bud...

With a self adjusting dual pull the brake pulling force is 50/50.
In short, one wheel don't lock up unless you have some serious brake pad or brake cable issues.

It is far more likely that having both a clutch and brake on the left side is going to crash you, heck, just look at the wipe-out posts, none have to do with a dual pull brake but plenty about the guys that 'grabbed the wrong lever'.

And how do you pull both a clutch lever and 2 brake levers at the same when coming to stop?

My contention and build standard for everything is nothing but 2 rotary controls and 2 lever controls to operate the machine.
One of each on each side.

Throttle and brakes on the right.
Clutch and any needed rotary gear shifter on the left.

4-strokes are cool, no clutch so independent brake levers, but 2 levers for one hand is just awkward and silly no matter how you spin it and dual pull is no safety hazard.

..well let's just say the 75 or so I have used have never caused anyone any problem in 5 years.

Of course there may be a way to make the back brake work with your foot like a motorcycle does and why they don't have 3 levers or a dual-pull...
Good luck with that, motorcycles have fixed foot pegs.

A suicide clutch is an option, not a good one unless you can operate it with your foot but an option.

Just my 2¢ about how important I feel handlebars should be.
Besides gravity, your hands on the handlebars are only thing keeping you on the bike.

Shocks, seat, tires, all that is important for comfort but nothing more than what you need to hold on to with both hands with at least your thumb around at all times and not wear your hands out.

I like BMX foam grips for the grip comfort, you can fit them over a throttle barrel, it beats the heck out of those hard plastic grips for like $3, we won't even test ride with stock grips.

OK, so 3¢... hehehe ;-}

 

[boxcar]

I live in Oregon Map. I ride the rain nearly every week. Never have I had the front end wash out on my Gas bike. Not once.
Not to flat here either . Un-like Texas.
If you want to talk accident waiting to happen , lets talk about running left and right hand brakes along with a clutch. Then try a sudden stop.
Or better yet a coaster brake .... trying to stop an over weight bike from 3 times the design speed...........
Bios set up is everything.........

 

[mapbike]

Well first off we can all agree to disagree on the subject and Im fine with that, but make a turn on loose dirt or gravel with to much brake on the front wheel and it will slide out, been there done that.

Hills have nothing to do with the subject as far as I know but on that subject I live in central Texas which is hill country and its far from flat here, Panhandle and west Texas is flat, central, east and south Texas is very hilly country.

On a three lever setup, I have rear brake lever on right side, front brake lever and clutch on the left, when I need to stop I apply rear brake first and as I start to slow down I lock clutch lever back with my left hand and apply front brake as needed, not complicated at all and I can do it quickly if needed.

With a coaster set up, clutch on left, front brake on right, a Shimano coaster works great along with a V brake on the front for as quick a stop as you want, another very simple to use system in my opinion.

I guess some people are more comfortable doing multiple things at one time with their hands and fingers than others but I stand firm on a common sense opinion that controling both brakes with a single lever on a two wheeled vehicle has more potential for an accident than if the brakes can be operated independently.

If you ever rode dirt bikes much or any Motorcycle for that matter the reason for not having front and rear brakes linked together is clear as crystal.

Im not gonna argue the point in a negative way here fellas and of course I say use whatever you want on a bike, its your bike and your hide....lol

My opinion here isnt that Im trying to be right about it, its about safety and if you run a dual pull lever and like it Im glad for you and hope you never have to brake hard while in a turn on loose dirt or in an area where there is gravel on the pavement, because if you do and are at any rate of speed at all you will go down with just a little bit to much front brake, its all purdy simple about what happens when a front tire skids while you're in a turn no matter if it has two wheels, three wheels or even four wheels.

Not wanting to be offensive at all here guys, we can all still get along even though we dont agree on this subject I hope.

Peace, Map

 

[Trey]

I stand firm on a common sense opinion that controling both brakes with a single lever on a two wheeled vehicle has more potential for an accident than if the brakes can be operated independently.
Peace, Map

I use a single brake lever, and I consider your point constantly. It's one of the many reasons I ride slow.

 

[boxcar]

You don't get my point Map . last week I left my home at sea level. 26 miles later I was at 4000 ft. Not talking central Texas hills here.
And it is wet here. So lots and lots of down hill stops.... on wet streets with tons of gravel..... It's a logging town.
Ill get back to this in a while. Watching a good movie with my honey.....