And Toto too???
(The "Wicked Witch of the West" must have trained all the Minnesota DMV workers)
Terry
Current laws in Minnesota
- Thread starter silverbear
- Start date
(The "Wicked Witch of the West" must have trained all the Minnesota DMV workers)
Terry
heres what i found:
"Motorized bicycles are registered as
mopeds. A motorized bicycle must meet
the following requirements:
• Electric motor or a liquid-fueledengine with piston displacement of 50 cubic centimeters or less.
• Maximum of two brake horsepower.
• Maximum speed of 30 mph on a flat surface."
"Moped Registration
Mopeds must be registered in Minnesota. A title or proof of sale of the moped is required for registration, along with a photograph. After registration, mopeds are required to have license plates, which have a silver sheeting with blue letters that resemble a motorcycle license. All moped registrations expire in February. The license plate displays the month of expiration sticker and a year validation sticker. A new moped or motorycle license plate will cost $3, and the renewal has a $4.50 service fee. A registration tax is $6 annually for all mopeds."
so - photograph, no problem, but i don't have a title or a proof of sale of my bike, or the bike engine. I also don't have a manufacturers statement of origin. Should I just make something up? Or print out the ebay conformation for the engine?
thoughts?
"Motorized bicycles are registered as
mopeds. A motorized bicycle must meet
the following requirements:
• Electric motor or a liquid-fueledengine with piston displacement of 50 cubic centimeters or less.
• Maximum of two brake horsepower.
• Maximum speed of 30 mph on a flat surface."
"Moped Registration
Mopeds must be registered in Minnesota. A title or proof of sale of the moped is required for registration, along with a photograph. After registration, mopeds are required to have license plates, which have a silver sheeting with blue letters that resemble a motorcycle license. All moped registrations expire in February. The license plate displays the month of expiration sticker and a year validation sticker. A new moped or motorycle license plate will cost $3, and the renewal has a $4.50 service fee. A registration tax is $6 annually for all mopeds."
so - photograph, no problem, but i don't have a title or a proof of sale of my bike, or the bike engine. I also don't have a manufacturers statement of origin. Should I just make something up? Or print out the ebay conformation for the engine?
thoughts?
I hate to say it but you could fake a few reciepts if your good with your pc , you should print out the confirmation from the ebay seller , thats how the state determines its origin , you wont have a title till the state issues it dont let that statement by them confuse ya . most times they will ask a few questions an for your paper work as long as its built safely with comon sence you shouldnt have a prob , oh last thing if you have any of the kit instructions show them as well . I am going to be doing much the same thing again for the wifes trike very soon dont worry you'll get it legal .
Gary
Gary
GOOD NEWS!
I HAVE A LICENSE PLATE!!!!
I went to the inspection site early yesterday morning - armed with what I thought were the correct forms.
After waiting in line for 3 hours, I got the bike (oops, MOPED) inspected.
IT FAILED BECAUSE OF NO V.I.N.
At least THIS guy knew what I needed to do:
Go BACK to the DMV;
Fill out a "STATEMENT OF FACTS" form;
Apply for a TITLE;
Supply 4-view PICTURES;
PAY the tax.
I went back to the DMV - who needed to call their "help desk" (and I use that term very loosely)
The "help desk" guy told her that "Motorized Bicycles" don't get registered/plated.
I showed her the documentation that I printed out from the DMV website that contradicted what she was just told.
She told the guy at the "help desk" what I had - so he had to go talk to his supervisor.
When he came back he said something like: "Golly gee - I guess you do!"
Then she asked what the procedure was for doing that...
He had to go talk to his supervisor again.
It turned out that she had to do EXACTLY WHAT THE INSPECTOR SAID TO DO.
I walked out of there with a plate in my hands.
(even with NO receipts!)
I'll be receiving a letter from the DMV letting me know when I can schedule an appointment to go BACK TO THE INSPECTOR to have HIM weld my new "V.I.N. PLATE" onto my bike (oops, MOPED).
Wotta nightmare!
At least my wife doesn't need to worry about getting pulled over now.
(phew!)
I HAVE A LICENSE PLATE!!!!
I went to the inspection site early yesterday morning - armed with what I thought were the correct forms.
After waiting in line for 3 hours, I got the bike (oops, MOPED) inspected.
IT FAILED BECAUSE OF NO V.I.N.
At least THIS guy knew what I needed to do:
Go BACK to the DMV;
Fill out a "STATEMENT OF FACTS" form;
Apply for a TITLE;
Supply 4-view PICTURES;
PAY the tax.
I went back to the DMV - who needed to call their "help desk" (and I use that term very loosely)
The "help desk" guy told her that "Motorized Bicycles" don't get registered/plated.
I showed her the documentation that I printed out from the DMV website that contradicted what she was just told.
She told the guy at the "help desk" what I had - so he had to go talk to his supervisor.
When he came back he said something like: "Golly gee - I guess you do!"
Then she asked what the procedure was for doing that...
He had to go talk to his supervisor again.
It turned out that she had to do EXACTLY WHAT THE INSPECTOR SAID TO DO.
I walked out of there with a plate in my hands.
(even with NO receipts!)
I'll be receiving a letter from the DMV letting me know when I can schedule an appointment to go BACK TO THE INSPECTOR to have HIM weld my new "V.I.N. PLATE" onto my bike (oops, MOPED).
Wotta nightmare!
At least my wife doesn't need to worry about getting pulled over now.
(phew!)
Hey Bogy ,CONGRATS....I went through the same thing when it came right down to the gov making the rules an "knowing the rules " I was glad I had a copy of them in my hand also . 
Gary
Gary
Thanks!Hey Bogy ,CONGRATS....I went through the same thing when it came right down to the gov making the rules an "knowing the rules " I was glad I had a copy of them in my hand also .
Gary
Maybe we should write up a little "HOW-TO" manual, eh?
None of us should have to go through that sh*t...
Terry
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We're doing it now ,all the guidlines are already here , or do ya mean a more condensed version?
bogyman - awesome!!!
which dmv did you go to? i'd like to go to the same one since they've already done it once, and recently.
you also said that besides the VIN, it passed inspection.
So it sounds like to pass inspection, we'll need: horn, mirror, lights, brake light
on the pdf i linked to below, it says, " A moped must meet the same lighting requirements as a motorcycle, with a headlight, taillight and stop lamp"
On mine I have lights, but they are both regular bicycle lights - is that sufficient to meet the requirments? I had a mirror too, but it rattled so much, it rattled itself off and broke - I'll need to figure out something for that
After they said they don't do motorized bikes, you said, "I showed her the documentation that I printed out from the DMV website that contradicted what she was just told." Is this the documentation you showed the DMV? :
https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/dvs/forms-documents/Documents/MotorcycleManual.pdf
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like this is what we need to do:
Step 1 - go to the DMV
-fill out a statement of facts form
-fill out a title form
-bring 4 pictures (i'm assuming a front, side, other side, rear view?)
Step 2 - get inspected
-horn
-lights
-mirror
Step 3 - insurance
according to that pdf, the minimum we need is liability
which dmv did you go to? i'd like to go to the same one since they've already done it once, and recently.
you also said that besides the VIN, it passed inspection.
So it sounds like to pass inspection, we'll need: horn, mirror, lights, brake light
on the pdf i linked to below, it says, " A moped must meet the same lighting requirements as a motorcycle, with a headlight, taillight and stop lamp"
On mine I have lights, but they are both regular bicycle lights - is that sufficient to meet the requirments? I had a mirror too, but it rattled so much, it rattled itself off and broke - I'll need to figure out something for that
After they said they don't do motorized bikes, you said, "I showed her the documentation that I printed out from the DMV website that contradicted what she was just told." Is this the documentation you showed the DMV? :
https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/dvs/forms-documents/Documents/MotorcycleManual.pdf
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like this is what we need to do:
Step 1 - go to the DMV
-fill out a statement of facts form
-fill out a title form
-bring 4 pictures (i'm assuming a front, side, other side, rear view?)
Step 2 - get inspected
-horn
-lights
-mirror
Step 3 - insurance
according to that pdf, the minimum we need is liability
I think I'll try this at the DMV in Virginia, Mn. first with my Panther and then with the Hiawatha if successful with the first one. I'm assuming in the statement of facts that you would have to state that the engine is 49cc or less. Is that right?
SB
Thanks!
I went to the Blaine DMV - Deputy #156 is now the "resident expert" there (thanks to "yours truely").
Yes, that's the documentation I showed her. (2012 MotorcycleManual)
The "statement of fact" form just states where I bought all the major parts.
They all came from ".com" sites - so that's what I wrote.
(I had long since lost all my receipts)
TIP: She had me cross off all the "seller" and "buyer" text on the THAT form, and write-in "owner".
As far as mirrors go - I found some cheap "Bell" fish-eye mirrors with a plastic goose-neck that I was able to take apart and re-position where I needed them. They're kinda flimsy, but that "feature" keeps them from vibrating - so much, in fact, that I can ACTUALLY SEE BEHIND ME!
My "brake-lights/turn-signals/horn" unit came from an eBay search - of course it's Chinese (brand name of "Jing Yi") - again, pretty flimsy, but it passed the inspection.
The only issue with this unit was I had to lenghthen the brake-light sensor wires to reach the south end of the front brake cable.
They go for around $12 each, so I bought two (for replacment parts).
Now if can just figure out how to get my Sturmy-Archer Dynamo to work, I'll be ripping out all those batteries.
My insurance agent added a "motorized bicycle" to my auto insurance policy, liability only for around $6 a month.
I hope this helps.
Good Luck!
Terry
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I had to actually go to an insurance broker to get mine insured my current ins. co. did not even want to look at it since it was not a "honda, yamaha, or similar " . shoot all the broker did was add a bunch of zeros to the form where the vin went so the computer would recognize it as a valid vin number . I learned that vin numbers even on motorcycles are 17 characters long . an also learned that tenacity pays .
Gary
Gary
Hey Bogyman - You said you went to the Blaine DMV - do you mean that licensing center by target off of 109th?
It looks like these are the forms we need:
https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/dvs/forms-documents/Documents/MV_StatementofFacts.pdf
https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/dvs/fo...V_TitleandRegisterMotorVehicleApplication.pdf
on the statement of facts form, you said that you put owner for buyer and seller. But what did you put for a VIN since it didn't have one yet, and the model and make?
The title form asks for a VIN, make/model too, as well as purchase price?
It looks like these are the forms we need:
https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/dvs/forms-documents/Documents/MV_StatementofFacts.pdf
https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/dvs/fo...V_TitleandRegisterMotorVehicleApplication.pdf
on the statement of facts form, you said that you put owner for buyer and seller. But what did you put for a VIN since it didn't have one yet, and the model and make?
The title form asks for a VIN, make/model too, as well as purchase price?
For VIN put the serial number of your bike, usually found on the bottom bracket shell (tube the crank goes through). Put the make and model of your actual bicycle as well. Purchase price, I am sure, is used for determining how much they tax you. And you only spent $100 on your bike, right?
Yep, that's the one I went to.
and yes, those are the correct forms.
Kudos to AslansMonkey for chiming in on this - saved me lotsa 'splainin!
As far as $ goes, I told them my bike cost $79 and the engine was $300 so that's what I paid the tax on.
I'm just glad to have a plate.
Once you know how their process works, in retrospect, it doesn't seem all that difficult.
Bogyman57
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I have to chime in right here this quote says it all , the prob ususally lies in our an their learning curve .
Gary
2+ "chime points" for you!
And:
Why doesn't this forum have the "THANKS button" feature enabled?
I was just wondering...
Very happy to have found this thread, though it looks as if it has been inactive for a while. I just acquired a "homebuilt" which is going to take some doing before it is street legal--no lights or horn at present (I am trying to figure out a way to charge a small battery from same from the low end of the magneto on the engine). This one is unique--wish I could claim credit for the design but I can't. It was built by a fellow in the Grand Rapids area using a tandem bicycle frame, a Predator engine, and a combined reduction belt/gear system which allows the use of the original five gears on the rear wheel (though at the moment, it stalls above 3rd). Only one seat as part of the belt drive takes up the space where the rear seat used to be.
The guy I bought it from seemed to think I would not be able to register is as a moped/motorized bicycle since he removed the pedals. To my knowledge, Minnesota does not require pedals on a "moped", hence the popularity of 49cc scooters. I have been more concerned about establishing title and registering it, as it is a homebuilt and not even from a kit. It's a bit like an "American" cars--the engine is Chinese, the frame is French, the wheels and handlebars are American and the "transmission"? Who knows? It was built almost entirely of scavenged parts except for the engine, which is new.
Of course, there is no VIN number on it. Is that what I have to get, once I have it fitted with all of the required lights, mirrors, horn, etc.? I dread taking this thing into the DMV office in Virginia. I'm sure they've never seen anything remotely like it before. There are a few folks with kit-built motorized bicycles around, but this thing look like a cross between a threshing machine and a Harley-Davidson drive train turned sideways! It may take some doing to convince them that it actually is a motor vehicle.
Of course, if I took the engine off and put the pedals on, it would be legal in every way and would not require any sort of title or license. Any pointers on how to convince the DMV that the same thing with a legal engine attached to it is indeed a motorized bicycle or equivalent will be most welcome.
Small town and all that....I wouldn't worry about it much but suspect this is going to turn heads and would prefer to avoid any hassles.
The guy I bought it from seemed to think I would not be able to register is as a moped/motorized bicycle since he removed the pedals. To my knowledge, Minnesota does not require pedals on a "moped", hence the popularity of 49cc scooters. I have been more concerned about establishing title and registering it, as it is a homebuilt and not even from a kit. It's a bit like an "American" cars--the engine is Chinese, the frame is French, the wheels and handlebars are American and the "transmission"? Who knows? It was built almost entirely of scavenged parts except for the engine, which is new.
Of course, there is no VIN number on it. Is that what I have to get, once I have it fitted with all of the required lights, mirrors, horn, etc.? I dread taking this thing into the DMV office in Virginia. I'm sure they've never seen anything remotely like it before. There are a few folks with kit-built motorized bicycles around, but this thing look like a cross between a threshing machine and a Harley-Davidson drive train turned sideways! It may take some doing to convince them that it actually is a motor vehicle.
Of course, if I took the engine off and put the pedals on, it would be legal in every way and would not require any sort of title or license. Any pointers on how to convince the DMV that the same thing with a legal engine attached to it is indeed a motorized bicycle or equivalent will be most welcome.
Small town and all that....I wouldn't worry about it much but suspect this is going to turn heads and would prefer to avoid any hassles.
Hello Dave,
Welcome to the forum. I'm from up near Ely and have been fooling with motored bikes for some years now. I wish I could tell you just what is what and tips on how to proceed, but this is all a grey area and more so in the north where motored bicycles are uncommon. I've been lucky so far and have not been stopped. On the other hand I try not to give any reason for being pulled over. I've ridden in Virginia a few times a couple of years ago and passed by cops who just looked. In Ely they either wave or look the other way. I don't think they know what to make of it either and don't much seem to care. It may help that I'm an old fellow and no doubt the dog riding in her sidecar also leaves a feel good kind of impression. If I were hot dogging around on and off sidewalks, zipping through traffic and generally being a dork I'm sure the results might be a lot different. Anyway, welcome to the forum and keep us informed on what you're up to and how it goes with the authorities.
SB
Welcome to the forum. I'm from up near Ely and have been fooling with motored bikes for some years now. I wish I could tell you just what is what and tips on how to proceed, but this is all a grey area and more so in the north where motored bicycles are uncommon. I've been lucky so far and have not been stopped. On the other hand I try not to give any reason for being pulled over. I've ridden in Virginia a few times a couple of years ago and passed by cops who just looked. In Ely they either wave or look the other way. I don't think they know what to make of it either and don't much seem to care. It may help that I'm an old fellow and no doubt the dog riding in her sidecar also leaves a feel good kind of impression. If I were hot dogging around on and off sidewalks, zipping through traffic and generally being a dork I'm sure the results might be a lot different. Anyway, welcome to the forum and keep us informed on what you're up to and how it goes with the authorities.
SB
Thanks--appreciate the welcome. One thing I have noticed, on a back road that I often take in and out of "downtown", is that it is patrolled heavily by Virginia police and the Sheriff's Department. Part of this is no doubt because the Sheriff's Department is just a couple of miles down the road, but it's also along the way to a couple of bars and a liquor store. And they like to stop folks, given any excuse. Some years ago I had an intermittent problem with one of the headlights on my car--it would start flickering for no apparent reason. I would bet that I was stopped one time out of three along that road. Never got more than a friendly warning. They always checked my license and insurance and when all was well, sent me on my way. They were looking for drunk drivers, and when it was obvious that I wasn't one....they weren't interested any more.
I also know that people around this area have few or no qualms about riding ATVs, snowmobiles, etc. on the road--including that same road. And as far as I know, no one bothers them, which suits me just fine as 99% of them aren't bothering anyone and I'm sure those that are probably get caught at it sooner or later.
ATVs and snowmobiles have license numbers on them, which leaves me wondering: what if I am cruising around on a vehicle with no license tag and on being stopped, it is discovered that I don't have insurance? Who knows?
I shall keep everyone posted--there is some "building" to be done on my bike before I would feel comfortable taking it out on the street (lights, mirrors, etc.). Beyond that....I will probably ask at the local DMV and if I'm told I don't need to do anything I won't (and I'll try to get details and carry them with me at all times). One way or another, the first time I pass a cop car I am going to wonder. I have never been stopped while riding a motorcycle (and that's approaching 35 years now, including a certain number of two-wheelers that definitely weren't street legal). Hopefully my luck will hold, but I plan to learn as much as I can to avoid having to rely only on luck.
I also know that people around this area have few or no qualms about riding ATVs, snowmobiles, etc. on the road--including that same road. And as far as I know, no one bothers them, which suits me just fine as 99% of them aren't bothering anyone and I'm sure those that are probably get caught at it sooner or later.
ATVs and snowmobiles have license numbers on them, which leaves me wondering: what if I am cruising around on a vehicle with no license tag and on being stopped, it is discovered that I don't have insurance? Who knows?
I shall keep everyone posted--there is some "building" to be done on my bike before I would feel comfortable taking it out on the street (lights, mirrors, etc.). Beyond that....I will probably ask at the local DMV and if I'm told I don't need to do anything I won't (and I'll try to get details and carry them with me at all times). One way or another, the first time I pass a cop car I am going to wonder. I have never been stopped while riding a motorcycle (and that's approaching 35 years now, including a certain number of two-wheelers that definitely weren't street legal). Hopefully my luck will hold, but I plan to learn as much as I can to avoid having to rely only on luck.
Hello DaveM50,
I'd like to extend a welcome to the forum as well. Silverbear and I get together every summer and build bikes at his place.
My thought is that you are best off to ask the people at the licensing bureau as to what is legal and get it in writing with their name if you can so you can tie the information to someone there.
Ride safely.
Steve.
I'd like to extend a welcome to the forum as well. Silverbear and I get together every summer and build bikes at his place.
My thought is that you are best off to ask the people at the licensing bureau as to what is legal and get it in writing with their name if you can so you can tie the information to someone there.
Ride safely.
Steve.