My First Motorbike Project

[lowracer]

Gera,
Yeah I used a razor blade & took my time to get it all off without scratching up the aluminum, making sure to not let any paper scraps into the engine.
-Lowracer-

 

[gera229]

So finally had some time to mount the engine on. Looks like the exhaust did not need much modifications. Just a 50 degree bend and it fit right on.

The engine mount was made by heating and bending steel brackets.
The engine is mounted in the other picture, and the picture was taken with the bike upside down to show the bolts.

 

[5-7HEAVEN]

Props to you! That's very ingenious, how you made your bolt-on motor mounts.

What size sprockets will you be using? Is that gearbox 3:1 or 2.19:1?
Are you bolting your sprocket to the spokes, or clamshell adaptor?
What gear ratio are you shooting for?
Please wear long pants while riding. Expansion pipes give MEAN-looking blisters on thighs.
Ask me how I know this.

 

[gera229]

I know about this heat issue too lol. My father helped me build the engine mount because I'm not so experience with heating with the torch and bending steel correctly and accurately so that it has the correct angles.

3:1 gearbox
72 rear.
Have 11 front and 14 front.
I can get something like 16:1 or 19.5:1 I think. I forgot the exact ratios.
I am worrying the chain might touch the frame that holds the wheels.

And the carburetor sits almost perfectly leveled. (I leveled the bottom of the carb by putting a level flat at the bottom of the black float bowl casing.)

 

[lowracer]

Gera,
Lookin good.
Will the cranks clear? or will you need to go either wider bottom bracket or with knee saver pedal extensions.
-Lowracer-

 

[5-7HEAVEN]

I know about this heat issue too lol. My father helped me build the engine mount because I'm not so experience with heating with the torch and bending steel correctly and accurately so that it has the correct angles.

3:1 gearbox
72 rear.
Have 11 front and 14 front.
I can get something like 16:1 or 19.5:1 I think. I forgot the exact ratios.
I am worrying the chain might touch the frame that holds the wheels.

And the carburetor sits almost perfectly leveled. (I leveled the bottom of the carb by putting a level flat at the bottom of the black float bowl casing.)

You will have 19.64:1 w/11t sprocket, and 15.43:1 w/14t sprocket. Are you running 8mm T8F chain and sprockets?

There are several ways to keep the chain away from the frame. One is to slot your motor mounts (side-to-side) for adjustments. Another way is to space the rear sprocket inward or outward. Another is to center your engine, then use jackshafts with 1:1(for now) sprocket ratios for perfect alignment. Some builders have also "clearanced" the interfering point with grinder, torch or hammer; others have cut that point out and "C-framed" the repairing welding point.

You could also use a chain tensioner or front derailler to guide the chain away from the frame or tire.

I believe the OCC Chopper(I think) hub is specially designed to position your engine chain further outward.

Or you could turn your engine 180 degrees, install a 5:1 gearbox and use a shift kit. Orrrr, leave the engine in its position, install a jackshaft and a shift kit.

I'm glad your dad's helping you. It gives me and others of mind.

 

[gera229]

@Lowracer, what wider bottom bracket?
I can pedal just fine with my right leg touching the exhaust a little bit, but it does not touch it if the right pedal is in front.

@5-7 Heaven,
Yes I have the right size chain and sprocket.

I do not plan on adding a shift kit or a jackshaft kit (out of money).

Also how would Jackshaft 1:1 align it? Is it going to make the chain reach the wheel on the right side instead of the left side?

I'm thinking a chain tensioner would be the way to go (especially since I have extra chain, so if I add a tensioner I can add a little more chain so it won't be too tight.

Also, my chain is about a 1/4 inch off on both sides so it isn't perfectly straight, but is that a small difference for such a large chain? Will the chain fly out of the sprockets?

How is the OCC Chopper hub going position the engine chain further outward? Does it widen the rear wheel frames of the bike too?

 

[5-7HEAVEN]

@Lowracer, what wider bottom bracket?
I can pedal just fine with my right leg touching the exhaust a little bit, but it does not touch it if the right pedal is in front.

@5-7 Heaven,
Yes I have the right size chain and sprocket.

I do not plan on adding a shift kit or a jackshaft kit (out of money).

Also how would Jackshaft 1:1 align it? Is it going to make the chain reach the wheel on the right side instead of the left side?

I'm thinking a chain tensioner would be the way to go (especially since I have extra chain, so if I add a tensioner I can add a little more chain so it won't be too tight.

Also, my chain is about a 1/4 inch off on both sides so it isn't perfectly straight, but is that a small difference for such a large chain? Will the chain fly out of the sprockets?

How is the OCC Chopper hub going position the engine chain further outward? Does it widen the rear wheel frames of the bike too?

Both jackshaft sprockets would be on the left side, side-by-side. You would have gearbox-to-jackshaft chain on the inside, then jackshaft-to-wheel sprocket chain on the outside. That would move this second chain outward. The farther the jackshaft sprockets are from each other, the further outward the chain would move outward.

The OCCC hub was made to clear the rear fender and extra-wide rear tire. Some builders on this forum have used this hub.

If you want perfect alignment, there are tools that would indicate alignment between both sprockets. I've seen them on the web, forgot where.

Have you installed the engine chain yet? Just do it, turn the wheel by hand, and see what's not clearing.

SBP sells extra wide cranks and pedals. Check out their link.

 

[gera229]

I don't think a jackshaft will be the best addition for me. I really don't want to mess up the way it looks lol.

This is because the engine sprocket is more "outside" than the rear wheel sprocket.

So the engine sprocket needs to be moved toward the right side to have perfect alignment.

I will figure it out if I would need to move the engine 1/4 inch to the right side. Maybe the chain won't fly out with the current settings.

 

[lowracer]

Gera,
Wasnt sure if you had clearance...The pipe gets real hot & the wider you can get your legs onto the pedals the better. Here is a pic of a $15 item that moves the pedals out a bit...Also you can wrap the pipe w/ header wrap tape to keep from being scalded.
-Lowracer-

 

[5-7HEAVEN]

I don't think a jackshaft will be the best addition for me. I really don't want to mess up the way it looks lol.

This is because the engine sprocket is more "outside" than the rear wheel sprocket.

So the engine sprocket needs to be moved toward the right side to have perfect alignment.

I will figure it out if I would need to move the engine 1/4 inch to the right side. Maybe the chain won't fly out with the current settings.

I would run it as is, and see what happens. A quarter-inch isn't much. You could space out the rear sprocket an eighth-inch if you run it as is and the chain throws. Or you could install a tensioner or a derailleur.

Lots of options, but run it as is first.

 

[Cagiva4ever]

I'm just curious.

I did the pull start test and saw sparks yes.

But my father said it should spark while turning the flywheel by hand so I wanted to know if you had the same results as me. Maybe not for these engines should it spark by turning it by hand?

My multi meter readings were in Ohms in 3 different spots and readings were consistent:
0.4
1.6
2.0

And I wanted to make sure I had a good Coil by asking you if you had the same results. That way I can be sure those are the correct readings.

hi !

i have had "AL" marked/manufacturer Ht-coil/cdi Combo that failed in 15mins from new. it had never run in a wet conditions or soaked in water or simular. it was the poor quality1 without the silicone on the Ht-cable fittment (These dont like water or moisture that gets in as there is no silicone..BUT i think the part Quality is also bad.


now i have a lot better quality silicon sealed "XG" marked/manufacturer Ht-coil/Cdi combo that has done so far 850km. i still have the original bad chinese Ht-cable on it but with champion Plug.


i dont know how many Rev's does Cag need to Produce sparg BUT i would expect at least 500rpm (as most 2T mopeds etc need 500~850 rpm or so to Produce sparg). 2t's are not like OLD non-cdi 4T Briggs&Strattons that can be hand wiggled to produce sparg (youtube vid...)

Thx for those Multimeter results and photos, etc photos that you have posted here at this topic of yours.

im intrested to hear what markings do you have on your Ht-Coil/Cdi combo.

btw. i have my Cag engine running backwards, ive "mirrored my Ignition", to suit my Application..
http://motorbicycling.com/f36/front-mounted-minimoto-engine-16978-4.html

ive done ridden so far 850km with it. about 750km from it with 1 single same Race Clutch which is still like new..

Std 3-shoe Spring snapping problem that i had: http://motorbicycling.com/f4/pocket-bike-engine-project-31377-10.html


what comes to the BBK cylinder assy, i think i have same or very simular as yours (not in use yet) Mine: http://s721.photobucket.com/albums/... ja purkuosat-/?action=view&current=kitti.jpg

with the short Vertical Groove above exhaust port hole at middle. ive had 3 of these kits going through my hands inspections b4 re-shipping, 1 i bought for my own use.


i have 1 of those Reduction GearBoxes also that you have, cant remember mine Brand atm (ill check) . Mine is cannibalized1 without the internal chain. its 1 row chain and my Box has internal ratio 3,22. bought it from fleamarket for approx 3usd.

im intrested to hear your future experience with it with Gearings that you might go through or have in use if not experimenting various settings.

bye
m

 

[gera229]

I'm glad you found my readings useful.

What Race Clutch did you use and how much did you get it for? (Is it 2 or 3 pads?)

Do you still have the Spring snapping problem?

You got the gearbox for 3USD? That's such a killer deal. What do you mean by cannibalized? Does it use belt or chain inside of it?

 

[Cagiva4ever]

hi !

i linked the race Clutch to the topic that i linked earlyer. inc the photo and seller and price.

i dont use the STD 3-shoe clutch anymore, so yes Spring snapping problem still exists but "more durable springs" are apparently available.

the "cannibalized" 3,22 internal Ratio reduction box i bought from fleemarket, it was stripped for spares > hence missing the 1-row chain. Very new condition looking box overall in&out.

i use the "Petrol Scooter, kickboard" 5:1 box(es) with Grease packing (Grease packing nipple fittment) on my current 26" hybrid. (no photos or vids of it at web, yet)

bye
m

 

[gera229]

What speeds and acceleration are you getting?

I also have a race clutch as a spare, is it really much better?

 

[5-7HEAVEN]

The OEM clutch for the GP460 engine will fit on the pocket bike engine w/ the tapered shaft. Its springs are rated for 8000rpm engagement, but ones for lower rpm engagement are available.

 

[gera229]

5-7 Heaven Chinese specs are not always accurate lol.
The pocket bike engine does not go over 9-10k rpm based on pocketbikeforum, unless it is modded.

 

[lowracer]

9-10K rpm's?
My pocketbike engine has hit 11,000 rpm under load as I received it from the seller (Stage 2 head kit). Got a tach on there to verify.
-lowracer-

 

[5-7HEAVEN]

5-7 Heaven Chinese specs are not always accurate lol.

LOL, this stock 460 engine peaks hp @ 11,000rpm. It is not a pocket bike engine, but its clutch can interchange with a pb engine.

 

[gera229]

Lowracer, that's what I read. More RPMs is good too. I plan on finishing my bike on thanksgiving break. Possibly by Monday.

5-7 Heaven, I know, but I was saying at 8,000 RPM engagement for an engine that can only do 10-11k RPM just does not seem to do. Especially that for cruising it will be loud.