66c enough for mountenous terrain?

GoldenMotor.com

Rocky_Motor

New Member
Nov 14, 2011
367
0
0
Fort Collins & Boulder
Ah.. I didn't even realize that the rear disc was in the way of the sprocket. I may just mount the engine on my current bike... Even though it has a ton of issues and is to small for me. I don't think I could do it the way you did since I want to use such a large sprocket and it doesn't look like it'll fit..
 

F_Rod81

Dealer
Jan 1, 2011
1,031
2
0
Denver, CO
If you run a 44T or a 48T and shim the sprocket right then you'll be fine with clearance around the rear rotor (sprocket goes between rotor and spokes). You may need an offset intake, or make or buy a shorter intake with that particular bike, but that is a good idea of where to start with a bike. Maybe not a GT Mt. bike because of the way the seat tube, top tube, and rear down tubes intersect.
 

Rocky_Motor

New Member
Nov 14, 2011
367
0
0
Fort Collins & Boulder
I was actually thinking 56tooth... :) Unless 48 would be better for steep inclines and speed up them. You don' think the motor would fit stock in that frame? It's pretty large I think. My current bike measures 10.5inches up so it may be even worse for that. I just thought that that bike on craigslist was a good deal and it looked real nice with those disc brakes and all. (I've never had disc brakes)

I'll look into bikes that don't have disc brakes though. They just seem really appealing.

So I think what I really would like to know, is what kit should I buy? I don't know the difference between the Grubee skyhawk GT5 (has the crappy carb in that kit I hear though) Or if I should get the Black Jet 80/66cc standard angle fire. Are there better 2 stroke engines I should buy out there? I like that black one because it is.. black.. and that it has 66cc instead of the 49cc.
 
Last edited:

F_Rod81

Dealer
Jan 1, 2011
1,031
2
0
Denver, CO
There not much differences from kit to kit. The thing to look for is a reputable vendor, one that has good customer service and accepts paypal (just incase). Some people get lemons some people get gems, it just depends on the china-man that built that particular engine that day. I recommend you stay in the 40's with your sprocket choice. I do a lot of mixed riding, off-road trails, traffic, city paths, ect. I have a 34T sprocket and I can blast up hills without pedaling, it just depends on performance parts and tuning abilities. Once you get your kit and everything set up and used to riding it I guarantee that your going to want more. In addition, with the larger sprocket the RPMS will be higher all the time; causing potential for electrical issues and/or a shorter engine life.

Just remember, these are not dirt bike engines. I have a poster child friend that built a bike for the same reason you are going after and it fried CDI's and magnetos like crazy. He spent more time looking at the mail box then he did riding, eventually the piston and connecting rod shattered cause of all the vibrations from off road riding. He still hasn't learned after a year, he has gone through 3 kits; now he needs a rear wheel cause he busted 9 spokes from off-roading on our last D.A.R.. I have no intention of discouragement, just a fair warning for what you could face. A suggestion that I could offer is go with an SBP shift kit . This kit will let you use your gears for driving and you'll have both low-end torque and top-speed ability.

Good example of SBP shift kit
 
Last edited:

Rocky_Motor

New Member
Nov 14, 2011
367
0
0
Fort Collins & Boulder
That's definately some valuable information. That makes sense about making it essentially a dirt bike. Dirt bike engines get the crap beat out of them and a chinese motor like this probably can't take it. Like you said, if (more like when) I get hooked on motorized bicycles I can most certainly upgrade. In fact I've already been looking at predator 4 stroke engines. 99cc or 212cc. Or the 125cc Lifan motor.. All look great. Of course, I would like to start with one of these two stroke motors to get familiar with it all and move from there. The trails I plan on going on shouldn't be anything like a dirt bike would handle. While steep and rocky I don't think I'll be flying over jumps.

I found bikeberry.com From vendor reviews it looks like it is a better site that pistonbikes.com Apparently piston is good for some and bad for others, while berry has generally positive reviews. The only problem is that all his Grubee engines are out of stock. Although to be honest I can't see a difference between the "flying horse" and the grubee/skyhawks. But like I've been told, it's all internal. So I sent them an email asking if they'll have anything in stock sometime soon.

I wonder if I can mount the motor to my rear rack on my current bike. I Think the biggest obstacle there is getting the motor to be secure and not wobble around. With no welding tools that could be an interesting task.
 

2door

Moderator
Staff member
Sep 15, 2008
16,302
175
63
Littleton, Colorado
Mounting a standard in-frame 2 stroke on the rack is not a job for someone without the fabrication skills or tools necessary. It can and has been done however. Just keep in mind the job requires some work.

There are 2 and 4 stroke rack mount kits available, both friction and chain drive. They might be a consideration for you. You'll loose your cargo carrying space but that's what backpacks are for. The rack mounts are easily installed with a minimum of tools and considered reliable by those who use them.

Tom
 

happyvalley

New Member
Jul 24, 2008
784
1
0
upper Pioneer Valley
Just remember, these are not dirt bike engines. I have a poster child friend that built a bike for the same reason you are going after and it fried CDI's and magnetos like crazy. He spent more time looking at the mail box then he did riding, eventually the piston and connecting rod shattered cause of all the vibrations from off road riding. He still hasn't learned after a year, he has gone through 3 kits; now he needs a rear wheel cause he busted 9 spokes from off-roading on our last D.A.R..
Good practical advice. With the expense your friend went through with 3 kits wheels, parts, etc for that kind of off road use, he'd probably be better off getting a small enduro motorcycle to begin with.
 

Rocky_Motor

New Member
Nov 14, 2011
367
0
0
Fort Collins & Boulder
I've found I don't want to go the friction drive route. Idk what it is about it, just doesn't seem as efficient I guess. This would be so much easier if I just had a bigger bike.. I'm still looking for a good one to pop up around 100 bucks. Just has to have front suspension, big enough, and look good ;)

I'd love to go the 4 stroke route but the kits are rather expensive.. Not sure why. If I did, I would buy the 99cc predator engine, some kind of manual clutch that I can operate by a brake lever, and would assume all I need is the sprocket and chain after that. And ways to mount it of course.. I could use U bolts to keep it on there for sure, but that wouldn't stop it from rattling around I think. Before getting to far into that, I still feel it would be better if I started with a 2 stroke and worked from there.

I'll find a suitable bike for around 100 bucks, a kit for 200, for a total of 300. + extras like a different sprocket or that awesome 2 in 1 clutch+brake lever on berrybike. Would be nice if they emailed me back about when those motors will be on stock though.

For the life of me I can't figure out why their Grubee skyhawk 66cc is the same price as their 49cc... Maybe find a speed carb to go on it.. I really like the sounds of the highest end Grubee model. Superrat-66 apparently. But it's out of stalk.. D:

http://denver.craigslist.org/bik/2664075687.html
Looks good to me! Wish it wasn't an hour away.
 
Last edited:

mdlee1958

Member
Feb 22, 2009
204
1
18
Fort Collins, Colorado
Rocky, Hi,I live here in Fort Funk and have built several HT bikes both shifter and non-shift. If you pm me I'll give you my phone number and maybe give you a hand getting started.
mdlee1958
 

BarelyAWake

New Member
Jul 21, 2009
7,194
21
0
Maine
I unno, that 2010 GT Avalanche looks to be a decent bike and @ $200 less than retail the price is about right. I wouldn't buy one new for $500 (as that's good low starting price for a real quality used bike), but this, lightly used for 3 is ok.

All of the components are "hi end" generic, serviceable & better than most for the money, but not known for longevity. Suntour shocks for example usually only have a season or two before they're spent (those may be slightly better) and rebuilding them can exceed their value...

...but, I do think this bike is a near perfect platform for the first time builder on a budget, to see what yer getting into & experimenting (down tube is a lil odd, but workable) - it looks it might have double wall rims if just 14g spokes, the frame looks stout and well designed & while the components may not be the best money can buy - it's got exactly what I'd want in a beater trail bike & it'd be easy enough to upgrade later as the need arises. For example, swapping out calipers for quality can be quick & cheap (new Avid BB5 take offs can be had for $20 if you ask around, $40 new w/rotor) - unless you need mounts and hubs & wheels relaced... or a new wheelset too as ya might as well etc., etc. ;)

Even the disk brakes are a bonus - while V brakes work well (unless wet/frozen), the wear rate can be obnoxious for both pad & rim, particularly when you combine the speed & weight of a MB with the mud, dirt & grime of trails. The rear disk isn't a problem as I see it - you can bolt a sprocket in it's place to bypass the problems with the kit "rag joint" (adding rear V brakes ofc) or the cost of an aftermarket sprocket adapter & I really think a disk's mount about the best way to add an engine drive sprocket, can't beat it's strength & that's something to consider if you're geared really low & trail beating.

...but in all honesty, I think you really do need gears to any remotely serious off roading and jackshaft/shiftkit would let you keep the rear disk as well. The 66 has the power w/o a doubt, it's just a matter of making it usable.

I trail ride a lot on a very basic aluminum mountain bike, motorized with a Chinese in-frame 66cc - I beat on it all winter too, the worse the weather the better. It's defo not a dirtbike by any means, but the 66cc as more than enough oomph to do what it needs to. Unfortunately, it's got a kit 44t rag joint sprocket and that's it's biggest problem as a trail bike, geared too high any technical sections of the trail require an awkward dance of throttle/clutch/pedals & gears to get through it... I've ofc thought about regearing it low - but low enough for trails would make it almost unusable for street... so I tend to ride it on the trails like, well, a mountain bike lol - pedaling the tough bits and motoring the straights.

So long as ya remember the golden rule - that anything you off road is essentially disposable, that damage is just part of the game as trees & ditches don't care how much the components cost, I do think an in-frame shifter build on a bike like that a good first build for your interests for a comparatively low investment, quite low for what you're getting w/o a jackshaft/shiftkit if ya decide to go the bolt-on sprocket route *shrug* you could ofc have two I s'pose, swapping them out (high for week commute/low for weekend trail play) is a bit of a pain, but still pretty easy if it's bolted to the disk hub... dunno, I've never bothered tho I've a spare wheel lol

 
Last edited:

Rocky_Motor

New Member
Nov 14, 2011
367
0
0
Fort Collins & Boulder
I like those pictures! Looks rough and rugged. A tough machine

That's exactly what i was thinking. While I have yet to figure out how the jackshaft works, I'll look into it tomorrow. (it's 3am.. darned government class)
I'm glad you share the same interest in the use of your bike. I'm not quite sure what you're referring to when a sprocket adapter and using the disc mount.. Sounds useful though.
I do plan on using the bike I make all through winter. It's how I get to class. I use it every day so far, but an engine would be very nice from my dorms to campus. From there I would pedal. Hopefully it doesn't add to much resistance. I'm not worried about the weight.
As much as I would love to get a shift kit I just can't spend the extra 200 bucks yet.

What I am thinking I want to do is take my current bike, and according the bikeberry's diagram the engine should fit within a half inch or so. (11" from bottom of bottom tube to bottom of top tube) and build that. Even thuogh the bike is beat up and to small for me, I think starting there would be great to see how I like it and if I want to go to the next step and put a fair amount of money into a new bike. I'm only in college and don't have a terribly lot of money. I do though.. I did landscaping all summer and still have it saved up, just haven't found anything to spend it on. Maybe it will be this :)

You guys might actually like the bike I build if I use my current one. I have a custom boombox built out of a toolbox on my rear rack :D I plan on making it wirelessly bluetooth too! Soon as I fix the amplifier in it. And if I ever decide on using a new bike I'm sure I can take most every part and apply it to the new bike instead of buying something new. For the time being..
 

BarelyAWake

New Member
Jul 21, 2009
7,194
21
0
Maine
A "sprocket adapter" is an aftermarket item offered by a couple of vendors, far superior to the "rag joint" kit method (sandwiching 1/2 your spokes between the sprocket, some used tires cut into rings and a coupla backing plates, damage prone & impossible to get truly centered) an aftermarket sprocket adapter is an aluminum mount that goes through the spokes to clamp to the hub itself... but my personal fave for that app is the disk brake hub w/the rotor removed and a sprocket (aftermarket, mount holes need to line up) bolted in it's place - inexpensive, simple & rugged w/o slippage worries.

For truly overwhelming detail on this, far more info that you'd ever care to read - give our "google custom search" a whirl ;)

BTW, I should mention somethin' you may well know - although I do love 'em, all the Chinese in-frame kits are a roll of the dice... they may work awesome for thousands of miles, they might blow up next week *shrug* for $200 or less for an entire kit, it's to be expected. They are however an excellent introduction to motorized bicycling, simple beginner level engine maintenance, modification & fabrication - jus' don't expect a Honda and you'll have a blast lol

You guys might actually like the bike I build if I use my current one. I have a custom boombox built out of a toolbox on my rear rack I plan on making it wirelessly bluetooth too! Soon as I fix the amplifier in it. And if I ever decide on using a new bike I'm sure I can take most every part and apply it to the new bike instead of buying something new. For the time being..
defo! Whatever ya end up building, remember to take lotsa pics & share with us yer adventures - cobbin' stuff together & seein' what happens is after all at least 1/2 the fun of these things ;)
 
Last edited:

Rocky_Motor

New Member
Nov 14, 2011
367
0
0
Fort Collins & Boulder
I did a search, makes more sense now. I see why that would be very important in higher torque scenarios. Buying that 2010 bike would be great but I honestly just don't think I should put 300 bucks on just the bike down yet. Not during the winter atleast. I suppose that's the best time to buy though.
There are these pineapple sprockets.. I think they still put the strain on the spokes though. http://www.bikeberry.com/pineapple-sprocket-mounts.html

I am hoping that the kit I get will last a few seasons atleast.. Enough to not deter me from the hobby. My eventual goal is to mount either a 99cc predator engine or the 125cc lifan *drule* on a bike. Preferably in-frame.

I'm think I'm going to get this kit: Black Fire Flying Horse 66cc/80cc Bicycle Engine Kits EPA BikeBerry.com
And maybe this bike...Schwinn 19" Mountain Bike... He said he'd let it go for 85 but I kindu want to see if it will fit in my current bike first

I'll be sure to take pictures. I'm looking forward to the first build :D
 
Last edited: