New Group: Turning & Burning Group! Members Who Weld & Own A Welder

GoldenMotor.com

Crazy Horse

Dealer
Feb 20, 2009
1,153
4
36
USA
How many members know how to weld and have a welder at home that is used for their custom bicycle builds?

Tell us what you've got, and what you've done!

Can you or would you help another member in your area, if they need something welded, if they paid you for your consumables?

Whats a consumable?

Welding Consumables are as follows:

1-Stick Electrode
2-MIG Wire
3-Cored Wire (Flux-Cored Wire)
4-Stainless Steel Electrodes
5-Oxy-Acetylene Gas Welding & Brazing

Stick Electrode
A short stick of welding filler metal consisting of a core of bare electrode covered by chemical or metallic materials that provide shielding of the welding arc against the surrounding air. It also completes the electrical circuit, thereby creating the arc. (Also known as SMAW, or Stick Metal Arc Welding.)


MIG Wire
Like a stick electrode, MIG wire completes the electrical circuit creating the arc, but it is continually fed through a welding gun from a spool or drum. MIG wire is a solid, non-coated wire and receives shielding from a mixture of gases. (Process is also known as GMAW, or Gas Metal Arc Welding.)

Cored Wire (Flux-Cored Wire)
Cored wire is similar to MIG wire in that it is spooled filler metal for continuous welding. However, Cored wire is not solid, but contains flux internally (chemical & metallic materials) that provides shielding. Gas is often not required for shielding. (Process is also known as FCAW, or Flux-Cored Arc Welding.)

Submerged Arc
A bare metal wire is used in conjunction with a separate flux. Flux is a granular composition of chemical and metallic materials that shields the arc. The actual point of metal fusion, and the arc, is submerged within the flux. (Process is also known as SAW, or Submerged Arc Welding.)


Stainless Steel Electrodes
Stainless steel electrodes and wire are used for welding applications where corrosion resistance is required. Stainless steel consumables are designed to match the composition of stainless steel base metals.

Hardfacing
A stick of electrode or cored wire that is designed not to fuse two pieces of metal together, but to add a layer of surface metal to a work-piece in order to reduce wear. An example of this is the shovel on an excavator.

Oxy-Acetylene Gas Welding & Brazing
Custom building bicycles and human-powered machines with oxy-acetylene welding/ brazing (also known as "gas welding").
There are two kinds of welding equipment, gas, and electric. Electric welding is faster to set up, happens faster, and warps large metal pieces less. However, gas ("oxy-acetylene") welding or "brazing" is more versatile. Since both kinds of welding equipment are expensive, you might be able to afford only one - so go with gas, and you'll be able to accomplish more. You can weld almost any kind of metal with gas, plus you can braze (stronger than welding steel), and cut metals.

One of the strongest ways to attach steel bicycle frame tubing is gas brazing. This is a process similar to soldering, or using hot glue, but with a golden colored metal called brass. Brass is not as strong as steel, and so is not used for knives, or bicycle frame tubing, but is a metal that's very much strong enough to attach steel tubes together. Brass melts at a much lower temperature (1600 Fahrenheit - 870 Celsius) than steel (2300 Fahrenheit - 1260 Celsius). As you approach a metal's melting point, the metal crystallizes, and it's alloys can separate. So, if you can stay well below the metal's melting point, you'll end up with a stronger attachment.

Two types of Gas Brazing

'Slip,' 'flow' or lugged' brazing is the most common style. In this technique, frame tubes are joined with sockets called lugs. A large area, encompassing the lug and tubes are heated until brass will melt. Brass rod is placed against the edge of the lug, and melts. Capillary action causes the brass to flow into the lug, filling the gaps between the frame tubes and the inner walls of the lug. Slip brazing is very much like soldering copper plumbing pipes. This is a very strong method of attachment. The drawbacks are:

* Lugs are required. ie Lugs are: Lugged Headtube, Lugged Bottom Bracket, or even Lugged Triangle / Lugged Chainstay Dropouts. If you search for Vintage Bicycle Frames or Vintage Motorcycle Frames, you'll find that most of the vintage frame components were Cast Steel Lugged Components with Sockets, which accepted steel tubing into the Lugs to be brazed (Gas Welded).


* Precise fitting is required in order to create gaps of the proper width for the brass to flow.

* Cleanliness is very important, because dirt or residuals of oil of any type can cause places where the brass will not flow.

* It is difficult to see the difference between a well executed slip braze, and one that is not strong.

* Practice and experience are required for reliable slip brazing.

* If too much brass is added, it pools at the edges of the lugs, requiring reheating or careful grinding to clean up.

To be continued...

C.H.
 

Mike B

New Member
Mar 23, 2011
2,256
7
0
Central CA
Have an oxy-acetylene rig. Only use it for brazing. Have used it on my bike for exhaust system fabrication. Not willing to braze anything for anybody for any amount of cash.

Don't want the liability. Have no formal training and wouldn't know a good joint from a bad one.
 

2door

Moderator
Staff member
Sep 15, 2008
16,302
175
63
Littleton, Colorado
I like TIG. I have a Miller high frequency machine that I prefer over my Hobart MIG. The wire feed is quick and easy to use but for show quality welds and strength I'll use the TIG. (incidentally, the tungstons are considered a consumable) I use stainless filler rod exclusively because of the cleanliness.

I also have oxy-acetylene that I use for heating metal for bending and cutting. I never weld with it but I have used it for high temperature brazing such as silver soldering steel to copper or brass. I also have a pure acetylene rig with a Turbo Torch, good for soft soldering, plumbing work.

I have a stick machine but I haven't used it for so long I'm not sure I could remember how to strike an arc with it. Messy, smoky and ugly welds until you chip off the slag.

I've never tried to build my own frames but I do brackets, build custom exhaust systems and try to keep the fact that I have welders from my neighbors. If they know, they'll be asking for favors. They don't seem to understand that consumables cost money.

Tom
 

thegnu

New Member
Sep 15, 2011
982
1
0
freedom pa
yep... own a welder and make my own bikes.....


I would help out anyone who could get what they need done to me or build what they want to their spec. an ship to them .
I have a L-TEC/ ESAB MIGMASTER 250 with spoolgun for aluminum,an a oxy acetlyne outfit , one thing I wont do is aluminum bike frames its to skecthy welding aluminum in automotive grades an its usually heavier .
one thing I wish I had was a good jig to really control a bikes frame dimensions , but a machinst buddy an I are workin on that .
 

Buzzard

Member
Jul 9, 2008
264
5
18
Lincoln, NE
I've just about done it all at one time or another. From shield welding on oil field pipe to braising up brass radiator tanks. my new endevor now is TIG welding. They have a beautiful Miller set up at work that I've been practicing with. As long as I buy the conxumables I use. It took some time getting used to the foot switch but I've got it under control now. This week I installed a bobber motorcycle seat on my Stiletto. Had to weld on the swing mount and fabricate parts across the back tube to install the shock absorbers. The Stiletto does not have a "Y" frame like a motorcycle.. They also have a plasma cutter that'll be handy for cutting out small pieces. I still have my MIG welder but I hardly ever use it and I don't fabricate for anybody else.
buzzard
 

2door

Moderator
Staff member
Sep 15, 2008
16,302
175
63
Littleton, Colorado
Plasma cutters are great, but be prepared to buy a BIG air compressor to run one. They take a lot of air to work well. Super neat machine though. Beats hacking parts out with a cutting torch.
Tom
 

Crazy Horse

Dealer
Feb 20, 2009
1,153
4
36
USA
Don't forget to actually create the group!


I nominate you Aleman, please do the have the honor's of creating our group, if you don't mind.

All those in favor of Aleman creating this group, say hey yeah!

Peace C.H.
 

thegnu

New Member
Sep 15, 2011
982
1
0
freedom pa
Plasma cutters are great, but be prepared to buy a BIG air compressor to run one. They take a lot of air to work well. Super neat machine though. Beats hacking parts out with a cutting torch.
Tom
or worse than that an air hammer or sawzall.
 

GearNut

Active Member
Aug 19, 2009
5,104
11
38
San Diego, Kaliforgnia
Plasma cutters are great, but be prepared to buy a BIG air compressor to run one. They take a lot of air to work well.
Tom
That's exactly why I sold mine.
They have plasma setups out now a days that look like a medium sized suitcase.
All inclusive too. Just plug it into a 120 outlet and cut away.

After doing a web search for one I was shocked to see that WallyWorld even sells them now! :eek:
Walmart.com: Thermal Dynamics 15 Amp AirCut 15C Portable Air Plasma Cutter, 120 Volt, 1 Phase, 60 Hz With Built-In Air Compressor, 19 1/2' Work Cable, TCH-10 Torch With 70 Head, 8 1/2' Power Cable And Plug And 20: Tools
 

GearNut

Active Member
Aug 19, 2009
5,104
11
38
San Diego, Kaliforgnia
Oops! I suppose should say what I have and what I have done.
Have:
Lincoln cracker box.
Astro gas only MIG (re labeled and sold by Snap-On).

Gave away my old Forney cracker box.
Sold my Chinese acetylene torch.
Sold my Matco plasma torch.

What I have done:
Took a welding class, 2 semesters in 11th grade.
Learned how not to acetylene weld. Teacher was a jerk. I learned what I was doing wrong yeaaars later with the help of a good friend.
Learned how to stick weld and MIG weld pretty good though. Stayed away from the teacher and read welding books instead. Used the school's equipment and expendables to practice what I read about. At least I got good grades for my efforts.

Have welded many odd projects ranging from swords made from old leaf springs to trailers, go karts, custom exhaust systems, Jeeps, Volkswagens, and many motorcycles.
None were paying jobs, mostly just having fun helping junk live a longer life.
 

rohmell

Active Member
Jun 2, 2010
1,531
6
38
New York
I have:
Forney AT-100 inverter welder with a TIG torch added.
HFT 99871 90A Flux Wire Welder.
HFT 98870 120 Amp Arc Welder.
 

camlifter

Active Member
May 4, 2009
1,033
16
36
acme labs marion ohio
i have about every fab tool there is. mig, tig, stick and gas welders. as for plasma cutters i don't know how i lived without one for so long. it's my favorite tool. also have english wheel, forming anvils, tons of hammers and shears, metal brake and planishing hammer.
my air compressor does 175 psi and 21 cfm. sand blaster and powder coating equipment.
just built a blast furrnace and am experimentig with casting.
also have a bridgeport mill and smithy lathe. i have built frames and fab almost everything myself.
 

thegnu

New Member
Sep 15, 2011
982
1
0
freedom pa
WOW.. an I thought I had a lot of fab tools !
you know with the knowledge an skills I have found on this forum as a whole ,if we could theoreticaly "gell" in one area .....guys we coould be the next american bike builders company ..... just think about how harley an ducatti started .
 

The_Aleman

Active Member
Jul 31, 2008
2,653
4
38
el People's Republik de Kalifornistan
CH: if you really want me to create the Social Group and come up with a catchy name and slogan, I can do it.

But I will transfer ownership of the group to you or a member you appoint to be figurehead of it. Let me know.

Association of Arc?
Brotherhood of Brazing?
Critical Current?
Deniers of Defects?
Flux Fusion?
World of Welding?
Zeitgeist of Zot?

lol...I like Zeitgeist of Zot
 

Goat Herder

Gutter Rider
Apr 28, 2008
6,237
20
38
N.M.
Years ago in the body shop I worked in as soon as a grinder got fired up early in the morning. We would say ''Smells Like Bacon''

Got a nice 220 Lincoln wire feed mig. I modified it with switches and a optional after market same brand spool gun for aluminum. After researching the wiring schematic found out the spool gun was the same voltage as the stock built in motor but my said welder there was no quick connect kit's available any where for a spool gun. I fixed that!

Put in aluminum billet electrical sockets to plug in the spool gun or go back to the stock set up. It will weld aluminum good but not thin stuff. Got's Oxy Acetylene kit, and the map gas kit goodies.

Last an excellent array of grinders tap set drill press rotary files etc. Specialty tools from my mechanics back ground, commercial R.V. work and body man background. Lots of fab work. My used drill press has some crude milling capability after some basic adjustable plat form mods too.

It also helps I can get in touch with an old machinist buddy..
 
Last edited:

camlifter

Active Member
May 4, 2009
1,033
16
36
acme labs marion ohio
if your mig welding sounds like bacon cooking, your doing it right.
it's nice to have all the tools, but you can do a lot with just a cheap wire welder, grinder and a saws all. so don't let a lack of tools discourage you.