The Real Deal on California Law.

[bairdco]

i wouldn't worry about it. most cops are cool about our bikes, and if you do get stopped and explain (politely ) that you're just in town for a few days, i doubt anything would happen. at worst, they'd probably just tell you to pedal it.

 

[ww2ol]

I found this thread a few minutes ago and just finished talking to a traffic enforcement supervisor who claimed to be up on these laws. She said if the engine is under 50cc, (make sure the engine is stamped 49cc) without an automatic transmission, (a clutch to engage the engine with the rear wheel does not count as a transmission) the rider is not required to hold a moped / motorcycle endorsement on their license and the bicycle does not need to be registered in the state of California. That said it seems that some officers do not know what the law is and some might issue a traffic citation for being endorsed. All I can say is if you feel better by obtaining the endorsement, registration, etc do whatever you want and wear a helmet.

 

[Venice Motor Bikes]

I found this thread a few minutes ago and just finished talking to a traffic enforcement supervisor who claimed to be up on these laws. She said if the engine is under 50cc, (make sure the engine is stamped 49cc) without an automatic transmission, (a clutch to engage the engine with the rear wheel does not count as a transmission) the rider is not required to hold a moped / motorcycle endorsement on their license and the bicycle does not need to be registered in the state of California. That said it seems that some officers do not know what the law is and some might issue a traffic citation for being endorsed. All I can say is if you feel better by obtaining the endorsement, registration, etc do whatever you want and wear a helmet.

What you've said is true... but there are areas in CA that have their own laws, & require riders to have a license!! (OC & Ventura being the most notable.)

 

[MotorBicycleRacing]

I found this thread a few minutes ago and just finished talking to a traffic enforcement supervisor who claimed to be up on these laws.

She said if the engine is under 50cc, (make sure the engine is stamped 49cc) without an automatic transmission, (a clutch to engage the engine with the rear wheel does not count as a transmission) the rider is not required to hold a moped / motorcycle endorsement on their license and the bicycle does not need to be registered in the state of California.

That said it seems that some officers do not know what the law is and some might issue a traffic citation for being endorsed. All I can say is if you feel better by obtaining the endorsement, registration, etc do whatever you want and wear a helmet.

She said wrong as usual and such vague 3rd person claims like yours are misinformed.
Can you give me a link to the CVCs that you quote?

I can back up everything I quote below.

there is nothing in the CVC about under 50cc.
It says 2 hp or less on the licence plate application.
and all street legal gas powered vehicles in CA require a drivers license
including GoPeds and motorized bicycles or mopeds which require a M2
minimum.

traffic enforcement supervisors know nothing about motorized bicycle
Laws and many officers don't know these laws too.

What area do you ride a motorized bike in?

 

[MotorBicycleRacing]

What you've said is true... but there are areas in CA that have their own laws, & require riders to have a license!! (OC & Ventura being the most notable.)

That's funny...
OC is a large County.

 

[ww2ol]

Spoke with her again and she cited VC 406(a)

Section 406(a) VC refers to a moped or motorized bicycle as any two or three wheeled device having fully operative pedals for propulsion by human power, or having no pedals if powered solely by electrical energy, has an automatic transmission, and a motor which produces less than 2 gross brake horsepower and is capable of propelling the device at a maximum speed of not more than 30 miles per hour on level ground.

She said that a clutch to engage the engine with the rear wheel does not count as a transmission automatic or manual and therefore the bike does not fall under 406(a) VC. I'm just the messenger.

 

[Venice Motor Bikes]

That's funny...
OC is a large County.

I was trying to make it simpler for him to understand...

 

[bairdco]

i just typed up a bunch of crap, that i've typed up many times before, then my roomate's cat pulled the plug on my laptop.

i guess he's heard it all before, too.

but to sum up the crap i already typed, it doesn't matter what anyone says when the cop that actually knows the laws (the laws that i posted links to many times) busts you. you can try to tell them what some other cops said, what your mom's ex-boyfriend the CHP told you, or what the homeless guy outside of the liquor store who's thoughts are monitored by the CIA told you.

the laws are written down, available to anyone, and aren't open to interpretation, they're not suggestions, they're not based on hearsay, rumors, and don't have hidden loopholes.

the cop who actually knows them doesn't care what anyone else told you, and the judge you see to try and fight the ticket will listen to the cop (who'll quote the law chapter and verse ) and you'll end up paying 5 times what a DOT helmet costs, 20 times what a license plate costs, 8 times more than what an M1-2 endorsement costs, plus some extra just for wasting the court's time. and hopefully you won't have to pay for impound fees. they're probably not too much, maybe less than 100 bucks a day, so who cares, right? it's only money, time and missed work, and court is so much fun, ain't it?

 

[MotorBicycleRacing]

VC 406(a)
She said that a clutch to engage the engine with the rear wheel does not count as a transmission automatic or manual and therefore the bike does not fall under 406(a) VC. I'm just the messenger.

Hi ww2ol
In real life all gas motorized bikes fall under 406a no matter how they
transfer power to the rear wheel and that twisting of the CVC has been bought up before.
If your bike does not fall under 406a you are really screwed because then
it is illegal to even ride on the streets like a pit bike.
that would mean fines and impounding your bike.

We have been doing this for a while, know the laws and how and where they
are enforced.
Do you have a motorized bike and in what area of CA do you ride and live?

Do you have a drivers license?
If you are in OC or LA come to one of our rides. There is one this Sat
in OC.

The Willow Springs race is just 30 days away, are you coming?

 

[ww2ol]

Truth is that many police officers do not know the law. I stopped by DMV and got my M2 endorsement and mailed off my DMV REG 230 form this morning.

 

[MotorBicycleRacing]

Truth is that many police officers do not know the law. I stopped by DMV and got my M2 endorsement and mailed off my DMV REG 230 form this morning.

Yes, Most cops, DMV drones, etc do not know the fairly obscure
motorized bicycle laws in CA.

Good for you getting legal as it's nice to be able to ride anywhere
without looking over your shoulder.

Here is a recent post from a new San Diego member.
you really don't need turn signals as hand signals are still OK
Do need at least a left side mirror.

I got pulled over last week by the motorcycle cop and stated
no Headlight
no taillight,
no turn signals,
no moped plate,
no Dot Approved helmet (was wearing a bike helmet),
no M2 license.
Threaten to impound my bike.
Not a good way to be welcomed into the sport. But he let me peddle it home.

 

[mdono]

I'm currently working my first MB build in Palm Springs. I sent a REG 230 form to DMV and made an appointment at for my M2. I forgot to ask if I needed to bring the MB for a driving skills test and was unable to speak to a human after making several phone calls : ). Anyone know?

PS: Very helpful thread!

 

[MotorBicycleRacing]

I'm currently working my first MB build in the Palm Springs area. I sent a REG 230 form to DMV and made an appointment at for my M2. I forgot to ask if I needed to bring the MB for a driving skills test and was unable to speak to a human after making several phone calls : ). Anyone know?

PS: Very helpful thread!

DMV = 800-777-0133
If you keep hitting 0 , DMV will give you a call back option.
It really works, no more waiting on hold.

DMV will give you a temp M2 after passing the written test.
It used to be good for a year. Please ask the DMV if that is
correct and post back here.
Temp M2 can not drive at night, carry passenger.

After you pass the written test you can make an appointment
for the skills test. Probably be a few weeks at the earliest.
If you take the Motorcycle Safety Course you do not have
to take the skills test at the DMV.
If you are under 21 it is a little different....

DMV won't let you take the skills test on a Motorized Bicycle
because you don't have insurance. You would need the plate and
registration card too.
I would love to try to do it though and see what chaos ensues. lol
but I already have an M1

I would advise to get a M1 instead of a M2 but have been told that
an M1 is harder to get now???

PS: Are you coming to Willow Springs on June 18th?

 

[mdono]

Thanks for the Info BiMoPed. Do I need insurance for a MB? I didn't think about that. I'm not sure what to do about the skills test as I haven't owned a motorcycle since the mid 1970's. As I remember the M1 was not difficult to obtain. Just a written followed by a very simple skills test. Of course things may have changed a bit since then.

 

[bairdco]

you don't need insurance.

i want to do the same thing bimoped said...

bring my licensed bike with it's mirror, horn, plate, headlight, taillight, brakelight, and my DOT helmet down to the DMV and demand to take my skills test on a 100% legal motorized bicycle.

i bet that's go over real well with those poor DMV employees...

 

[Venice Motor Bikes]

I've asked myself that question many times... If the police say we need a license to ride a motorized bicycle?, why can't we take the test on one???

 

[bairdco]

exactly. by their own definition, i'm not riding a motorcycle, so why would i need to take a test on one? i mean, i can't ride a motorcycle in the bike lane with no insurance, right?

 

[MotorBicycleRacing]

exactly. by their own definition, i'm not riding a motorcycle, so why would i need to take a test on one? i mean, i can't ride a motorcycle in the bike lane with no insurance, right?

You know what they say about sleeping dogs, right?
Be careful what you wish for cause having no insurance on
motorized bikes is a very good thing.

Stir it up and get the DMV and CA VC to require insurance and
you will be infamous.
No insurance may equal no plate. The fact that there is no yearly
sticker proves that insurance is not required now.

 

[HackMATTr]

I was wondering about the license issue. All I have is a class C license and don't have the money to take the class for the motorcycle license. Also don't want to take the written test again. =/

I'm just going to send for the license plate, add a brake light, and follow the rules of the road. I have never been pulled over ever.

 

[showcaller]

I read all these posts and the more I read them the better I feel about registering my 26" beach cruiser with a 49 cc china girl and getting my M1 license. Those who interpret the law as not needing anything other than a helmet might be right, but when you are pulled over by some cop who demands to see your M2 or M1 license, and registration for the state of California he is the law at that moment and can make life difficult for you. I don't know about the rest of you but I would just as soon not have to deal with court dates even if I am right. Am I paranoid? Maybe, but I don't care. Except for a horn and turn signals (which I am betting even the biggest jerk/cop would at most give me a ticket where I have ten days to comply.) I am more than fine being legal.

I did the $250.00 weekend CHP sanctioned motorcycle class. When you pass you don't have to take the skills test at the DMV. The other cool thing about getting the license through them is if I want to buy a motorcycle I can buy any size I want whereas if I take the test at the DMV on anything less than 300 cc the license is only good for bikes up to 300 cc. I know that with this group, this might be a moot point. More importantly though when you take the weekend class they teach you how to think the way a motorcyclist should which applies more to us than just the rules of the rode riding a (non motorized) bike. The course is well worth it. As far as registering the bike, that has been gone over again and again, but it is worth mentioning that in California it is only a one time $19.00 fee. Well worth it.

Finally, at the risk of beating a dead horse... We ARE moving targets for police - at least in California. The state is 40 billion in the hole and they are looking for ways to extract any money possible out of our wallets. If that means you don't have registration - Bingo! My wife is a therapist, her clients include police officers. If you don't think there isn't pressure on them to write tickets, you are dreaming.