Anybody test NuVinci N360 with more than a 1/3 HP motor?

miked826

miked826

New Member
The NuVinci N360 is officially rated at a maximum of 1/3 HP yanking on it.
Anybody gone higher than to to see if it explodes, bursts into flames or what? LOL
 
MotorBicycleRacing said:
nashamoto!!!!
did you think that was a left hand twist throttle?
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Yeah I saw him shifting something. I mean has anybody tested a stock NuVinci N360, long term, other than NuVinci Inc?

Call me crazy or an alarmist, but there has to be a good reason why it's only rated for 1/3 HP on the NuVinci's N360 Warranty.
 
miked826 said:
Yeah I saw him shifting something. I mean has anybody tested a stock NuVinci N360, long term, other than NuVinci Inc?

Call me crazy or an alarmist, but there has to be a good reason why it's only rated for 1/3 HP on the NuVinci's N360 Warranty.
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Not sure what model NuVinci Nashmoto has been thrashing for many races over years on his sadly retired 3 to 4 hp 50cc Honda GXH shifter race bike.
That NuVinci was the one that came on the Cadillac bike they were blowing out for $300 years ago.
 
MotorBicycleRacing said:
Not sure what model NuVinci Nashmoto has been thrashing for many races over years on his sadly retired 3 to 4 hp 50cc Honda GXH shifter race bike.
That NuVinci was the one that came on the Cadillac bike they were blowing out for $300 years ago.
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The NuVinci N360 is filled with a juice and that juice explodes out of it's case if over torqued. It's a special proprietary juice that makes it do what it does and it needs to be kept inside for the N360 casing for it to work. The actual planetary parts inside are built like tank though.
 
onejerkuwant said:
Yes , First it stripped the splines out of the sprocket then it stripped the cog and all the juice came out.
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So the failure first happened from outside the N360 casing then going inward?

Damn. Well the Special Sauce that goes in it is only $100 a quart. LOL
 
MotorBicycleRacing said:
That NuVinci was the one that came on the Cadillac bike they were blowing out for $300 years ago.
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Incorrect, the Caddy's came with the older N170S hubs but yep, $300 for the caddy with the Nuvinci and rear disc brake, I scored 5 of them which boiled down to buying the back wheel and getting the bike for free ;-}

Caddy3.gif


Caddy1.gif


My shop helper bought one as well and of the 4 that got gas, 2 of them failed.
No explosions, no spewing fluid, they just failed to engage.

I don't know about the 360 other than it is much smaller than the N170 and with more than a 48cc your odds of failure go way up like this one, it only lasted a couple of months if memory serves.

Dust.gif


I also built a NuVinci DEV kit build (programmable shifter) and it failed as well.
I can't complain about that though as NuVinci gave me the DEV kit to test for free.

NV12-11-R.jpg


I documented it on their web site and They said the NuVinci's don't like the pulsing of a gas engine but love electrics.

ElectricCadillac.gif


Fail or not I don't like 'em, my wrist would get tired from all the constant shifting so I just stick with a 3-speed internal that weigh much less, far easier to operate, and I have yet to see one fail yet.
 
Somebody copy that NuVinci already and reinforce it for use with up to a 10 HP engine! Improvements in existing patents don't infringe that patent.

I wish I had the machine tools and whatever else that would be needed to do it, but i don't. Sigh.
 
miked826 said:
Somebody copy that NuVinci already and reinforce it for use with up to a 10 HP engine! Improvements in existing patents don't infringe that patent.
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Do you even know how a NuVinci internal shifter works?

I encourage all of you to see how it actually works with this good animated video from Fallbrook Tech, the designers and makers of it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=cuedbYOxQi4

Besides the clever design of the rotating balls it's the proprietary tranny fluid made only for and sold to NuVinci directly, I know, I checked a couple years back when I was playing with them and wanted to see if I could just 'change the tranny fluid' in my hub and there is no access to do it or even check the level and I figure that was done on purpose much like Apple does.

Send it to us and we'll fix it with a complementary reaming.

Also note the only mention of any non-human power for N360 is electric and even then they urge very low power electric because again as mentioned they don't like the pulsing of a gas engine.

I wish I had the machine tools and whatever else that would be needed to do it, but i don't. Sigh.
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You can start with PHD's in fluid dynamics, chemical composition for the 'magic fluid', and engineering.
Then throw several million at the machines to build your design.

If you want to build something MikeD, make a 3-speed internal coaster brake hub with a big drive sprocket on the left so you could have here 3 speeds on a direct drive bike and forego a jackshaft ;-}
 
To understand how a CVT works this is an OK video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=SQLeKdZWGI4

This is how torque converters work for like that GTC I just sold, but it is all direct contact friction unlike the NuVinci and as mentioned again not for high power machines but what most any gas powered golf cart uses.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=kdqt84_3t-k

The NuVinci doesn't use fluid to ease metal to metal gear shifts, it replaces the gears, but in CVT the story is the same even in cars, they need the exact right fluid.
http://www.twincities.com/ci_22415387/watchdog-transmission-fluid-change-ends-up-costing-4

In this case, NuVince's special stuff can't be found because it has no belts and pulleys like this stuff is meant for.
http://www.valvoline.com/products/brands/valvoline/automatic-transmission-fluid/136

Just on one last note about the number of gears you need with a gas engine, just 3.

Not 7, not 8, not 9, and certainly not an infinite number when even a lowly stock 48cc or 500W electric that will run you direct drive at a fixed ratio needs will definitely benefit from more than enough with just 3 gear ratios:

1: being a full pedal spin compared to the rear wheels spin regardless of sprocket sizes from the 1:1 ratio.

1: .66 underdrive
1: 1 direct drive.
1: 33 or better overdrive.

All that said one question that should be answered is if Fallbrook would be willing to explore a hub that could be powered by a drive chain from both sides.

To me what is worth exploring is a 3-speed hub you could power from both sides.

They would be fine on a pedal only bike with some added expense to those that won't motorize, but provided threads were on it to allow a collar to mount a sprocket you could bypass all the jackshaft stuff and get a direct drive with 3 gears.

Take out the need for a coaster brake and it seems possible.


A daunting task if you have ever looked at any bicycle internal hub, everything is input one side, output the other, no either side to middle actual hub/wheel drive.
 
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KCvale said:
Do you even know how a NuVinci internal shifter works?

I encourage all of you to see how it actually works with this good animated video from Fallbrook Tech, the designers and makers of it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=cuedbYOxQi4

Besides the clever design of the rotating balls it's the proprietary tranny fluid made only for and sold to NuVinci directly, I know, I checked a couple years back when I was playing with them and wanted to see if I could just 'change the tranny fluid' in my hub and there is no access to do it or even check the level and I figure that was done on purpose much like Apple does.

Send it to us and we'll fix it with a complementary reaming.

Also note the only mention of any non-human power for N360 is electric and even then they urge very low power electric because again as mentioned they don't like the pulsing of a gas engine.

You can start with PHD's in fluid dynamics, chemical composition for the 'magic fluid', and engineering.
Then throw several million at the machines to build your design.

If you want to build something MikeD, make a 3-speed internal coaster brake hub with a big drive sprocket on the left so you could have here 3 speeds on a direct drive bike and forego a jackshaft ;-}
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I've already know how it works. All I want you to tell me is why it doesnt work with a gas motor of more than "1/3 HP" and how to correct and reinforce it to withstand torque above 250 Watts. 250 Watts is a pathetically
small amount of watts. LOL
 
miked826 said:
I've already know how it works. All I want you to tell me is why it doesnt work with a gas motor of more than "1/3 HP" and how to correct and reinforce it to withstand torque above 250 Watts. 250 Watts is a pathetically
small amount of watts. LOL
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Simple, formulate a fluid that will change states from liquid to solid and be effective as actual gears under real loads for along time which is how it works.

How you 'make it go again' since few parts actually make contact is change the fluid and as mentioned I have no clue how that is done or fix the 2 I have.

Well, there is another way I used a lot, I learned to operate it by what the hub liked.
It's OK with subtle ratio's under small power, just never try to turn the ratio up under pressure (engine torque) at WOT.

The pulsing of a gas engine can be dampened some with 'cush coupling' and I went into that in depth in this topic http://kcsbikes.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=305 a couple years ago about them.

I never tried it as new things to try came along but I still think that cush coupling is just the thing to attach to the end of say 4-strokes 4G tranny and via a carrier bearing on the other side of engine mount platform you make a jackshafted 4-stroke and eliminate a gear and a chain but you know how it goes...

Lots of ideas but limited time and funds ;-}
 
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KCvale said:
Simple, formulate a fluid that will change states from liquid to solid and be effective as actual gears under real loads for along time which is how it works.

How you 'make it go again' since few parts actually make contact is change the fluid and as mentioned I have no clue how that is done or fix the 2 I have.
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Which explains the $400/gallon for that secret fluid inside that thing. The Rohloff is able to handle that torque but man what a price that thing is.
 
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