Another Friction Drive, Last One I Swear!!

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cannonball2

cannonball2

Well-Known Member
Oct 28, 2010
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Colonial Coast USA.
Even Im begining to think I might be needing to check myself in some where for a little shock therapy. I realized I can ride an MB for 10 days and not ride the same one-sad! Oh well enough self examination. This is my latest bike, it came from the Police auction lot. Started as a Schwinn Ditch, I call it by a similar name. Any way it was in sad shape, the cool deep V wheels with the disc brake were trashed, so I pieced it together with what was on the other bikes. Had a NIB Lifan that Wayne Z nearly had me convinced to do an inframe with. Problem was I never liked the bike that was set up to do it on. Also I am big fan of big bore (100cc) 4 stroke direct drive bikes. The Lifans have proven to be perfect, or nearly so you do have to put gas in them. Any way this bike is very light and fairly fast for a 4stroke direct, 33mph on GPS with a 2.25" roller. Ran out of horse mat finally and used oak in the cheap and easy roller format. GREAT roller. I thought it might have to break-in. Bit like a bulldog from the get go. Has Deacons scissor lift clutch, works like a charm with very little effort. This bike is a sweet heart, very smooth, quiet, cruises nicely at 28mph, and is very simple to ride. Will probably replace my trusty Mongoose/Lifan that has about a zillion miles on it(sniff).
 

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wayne z

wayne z

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Dec 5, 2010
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Hey, Great build. I have a red Mongoose build very similar to that bike. I might hafta try a rack mount. Can you bump start that thing?

This solves the only problem with my in-frame mount, there is no easy way to disengage the roller from the tire.
 
cannonball2

cannonball2

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Oct 28, 2010
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Colonial Coast USA.
Thanks Wayne! I havent tried a bump start, my guess is probably not. The Lifans have a lot of starting compression, more so than the HF engines. The HF seems to have more relief in its compression release. I will give it a shot to see. The scissors clutch is great, very light pull on the clutch handle when properly built. A china girl locking clutch handle would be great. I use a M/C clutch handle with a pin to hold it disengaged for starting or pedaling. No drag of course. The bike is not as unbalanced as it might look, being a direct drive the engine is about as low as it can be mounted at the wheel. Am really liking the oak rollers. I have made several sizes. They can be easily carried in the bikes bag. I can change one out in under a minute. If the terrain demands, a ratio change is a snap.
 
cannonball2

cannonball2

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Oct 28, 2010
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It is bolted by the crankshaft bolt. The 5/8 clutch collar is free to slide down the crank. Tightening the bolt compresses the drove roller into the rubber pad against the washers at the end of the crank, driving by what else--friction. I have never has a roller slip. It tries to tighten when in use.
 
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5-7HEAVEN

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Aug 2, 2008
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Scissors-lift! Now ya got me thinking about friction drive again. I spent years dabbling with friction drive, then moved on to a shift kit.:-||
 
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bandito

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May 22, 2009
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colorado
Could you post some more detailed pics of the pivot point, and the cable set up for raising and lowering the motor. Great build!
 
cannonball2

cannonball2

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Oct 28, 2010
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Here are a few pics of the finished bike. This has turned out to be a very nice bike. I believe it was a fairly high $$ bike new, and this shows in the riding. The scissors clutch is the ultimate in simplicity. The pics should tell the story. If not Im glad to answer any questions
 

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5-7HEAVEN

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2008
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5-7HEAVEN said:
Scissors-lift! Now ya got me thinking about friction drive again. I spent years dabbling with friction drive, then moved on to a shift kit.:-||
Click to expand...
JMO, this lever will make weedwhacker and chainsaw friction drive systems MUCH MUCH easier and versatile.

You should patent this. dance1
 
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happyvalley

New Member
Jul 24, 2008
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You do clever work CB, always thinking.
Yes, I remember Deacon doing this and Kerf also did a nice version a few years back. I use a commercial version from DE and it works very well. It's really the best answer to a completely freewheeling FD operable from the seat and IMO could arguably make for a reasonable defense of helper assisted HPVs.

dbackDE43in1 (2).jpg
 
cannonball2

cannonball2

Well-Known Member
Oct 28, 2010
3,682
223
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Colonial Coast USA.
Yeah, properly done the lift pretty well mimics a motorcycle clutch. A good quality locking handle in the locked position makes a totally dragless bike to pedal. A motorcycle clutch lever is also a good choice as it has a much larger adjustment range on the cable and larger adjuster wheels. I use these with a locking pin. The better adjustment allows me to adjust down force quickly from the handle bar. In the flats I tighten the cable to unload the tire, but can quickly give a few turns of increased down force if a major hill climb should be necessary.

Other than the wet issue(which I have an emergency answer for) an FD it is the perferred drive system for me due to simplicity and reliability. I dont think much of being 40mi away from home on one, though I have had no recent issues with it, my shifter bike would be another matter.
 
jose Pinto

jose Pinto

Member
Aug 29, 2010
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cannonball2 said:
Even Im begining to think I might be needing to check myself in some where for a little shock therapy. I realized I can ride an MB for 10 days and not ride the same one-sad! Oh well enough self examination. This is my latest bike, it came from the Police auction lot. Started as a Schwinn Ditch, I call it by a similar name. Any way it was in sad shape, the cool deep V wheels with the disc brake were trashed, so I pieced it together with what was on the other bikes. Had a NIB Lifan that Wayne Z nearly had me convinced to do an inframe with. Problem was I never liked the bike that was set up to do it on. Also I am big fan of big bore (100cc) 4 stroke direct drive bikes. The Lifans have proven to be perfect, or nearly so you do have to put gas in them. Any way this bike is very light and fairly fast for a 4stroke direct, 33mph on GPS with a 2.25" roller. Ran out of horse mat finally and used oak in the cheap and easy roller format. GREAT roller. I thought it might have to break-in. Bit like a bulldog from the get go. Has Deacons scissor lift clutch, works like a charm with very little effort. This bike is a sweet heart, very smooth, quiet, cruises nicely at 28mph, and is very simple to ride. Will probably replace my trusty Mongoose/Lifan that has about a zillion miles on it(sniff).
Click to expand...
Hello, Friend has a big project there. but I want to ask some questions:
how does your friend do when you need to stop emergency? raises the engine with throttle? or when braking with the rear brake makes it two functions? I know that the starter motor has, but also connects the engine pedal?
congratulations on the project, very simple and practical. the front wheel is not booting up?
 
cannonball2

cannonball2

Well-Known Member
Oct 28, 2010
3,682
223
63
Colonial Coast USA.
jose Pinto said:
Hello, Friend has a big project there. but I want to ask some questions:
how does your friend do when you need to stop emergency? raises the engine with throttle? or when braking with the rear brake makes it two functions? I know that the starter motor has, but also connects the engine pedal?
congratulations on the project, very simple and practical. the front wheel is not booting up?
Click to expand...
Thanks for the kind comment. The engine is raised with a clutch handle like a motorcycle. It has normal brake handles, and a motorcycle twist throttle. You ride it just like a motorcycle. I brake with both brakes front and rear, and clutch/raise the engine right before I come to a complete stop. In an emergency stop it would just use the brakes killing the engine in the process. If you are asking if it wheel stands, no it doesnt.
 
Psycledeliac

Psycledeliac

New Member
Oct 16, 2011
56
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0
Flint Michigan USA
Hi Cannonball.

I am diggin' the idea of the motorcycle clutch lever!

Where did you get it and how much was the cost? I need about two inches of cable travel for my design to work, do you think it'll go that far?

Right now I'm tryin to make the cheapest flimsiest bicycle lever ever work, and it won't go more than an inch.

BTW beautiful, well designed bike! :D
 
cannonball2

cannonball2

Well-Known Member
Oct 28, 2010
3,682
223
63
Colonial Coast USA.
Thanks for the comment on the bike. I checked my bikes with the M/C levers(3) looks like the longest pull is slightly less than 1.5" on the cable. Ebay is a good source, and they come in all price ranges. The cheapest one I bought cost around $15, a cast unit. Watch out for the stamped steel ones. You may have to work out some sort of mechnical set up to multiply travel, I dont think a common hand lever will have your required travel
 
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