more 4 stroke talk....
- Thread starter HIEFY
- Start date
Kiwegapawa
New Member
I will be checking out what you telling me about what's being worked out now in the go-cart world. As I have already been leaping back and forth through our closely associated industries. And what I have been looking at through the point of a worm drive is indeed going to get very expensive.
But in the point of the worm drives alot has changed since way back when you were playing with your slotcars. Or maybe not
. Those points of the spur gears in cars have changed and they are making them alot smaller. If you go through DocStoc.asterpix.com a google industry search engine. You will find all the different patients for those points in manufactures creating these transmissions. Listed off the top are those building for Kawasaki, plus many more. This which lead me to the specifics in Grainger.com who has Forward - Reverse and Neutral. I did finally find that which leads up as far a 7 gears. And in Automatic if that is what you wish. One carrying as many as three clutches in one. Many of what I have found are indeed building to suite.
Plus, there is one Trike built here that I believe is built with one of these worm drives already. This of Most insane Trike ever....... -Scotto But Scotto won't be sitting down with his neighbor ( a machinist I believe Scotto said.) till tomarrow. This where Scotto will be noting back to the forum on Friday.
In as far as trading up to the next larger Pedator. No thank you. I don't see why I can't do what I want, with the one I have. It would be the place of tossing the basis I've already decided to work from and with. And Yea the metal flake red is nice, Prolly won't be this color before I am done. I ordered black, they called me with a run out of that color. I had been already thinking the possibilities of structual modification. There in, the bigger possibility of a custom paint job. So when Bicycle Designer's called me to tell me about the run out of the black, and said they had this red, I said no problem, send it to me.
In as far as the frames concerned. I'm waiting to hear back from them now. As I have a structural question of them of the frame. This in making the named tank of the frame, a real tank. But I need to know more about how deep these points of frame enter into the tank. Also if there are any opening points from the tank into the other point of Frame. This beside the blow hole point at the fulcrum of the tank ( point of the "V" ). Only been a couple days since I left a message, so it will prolly be a bit yet till I hear back from them.
Oh yea, Your point of a lock-up, ever seen a chain lock-up? I have. Believe the only drive system that wouldn't totally lock-up due to a mechanical problem, is a friction drive. And even with that, I believe the only that'll protect you with even that, is if you could actually grow wings as you fly over the handle bars. As it prolly will still come to a stop over some type of binding, we all shudder to think about.
But in the point of the worm drives alot has changed since way back when you were playing with your slotcars. Or maybe not
Plus, there is one Trike built here that I believe is built with one of these worm drives already. This of Most insane Trike ever....... -Scotto But Scotto won't be sitting down with his neighbor ( a machinist I believe Scotto said.) till tomarrow. This where Scotto will be noting back to the forum on Friday.
In as far as trading up to the next larger Pedator. No thank you. I don't see why I can't do what I want, with the one I have. It would be the place of tossing the basis I've already decided to work from and with. And Yea the metal flake red is nice, Prolly won't be this color before I am done. I ordered black, they called me with a run out of that color. I had been already thinking the possibilities of structual modification. There in, the bigger possibility of a custom paint job. So when Bicycle Designer's called me to tell me about the run out of the black, and said they had this red, I said no problem, send it to me.
In as far as the frames concerned. I'm waiting to hear back from them now. As I have a structural question of them of the frame. This in making the named tank of the frame, a real tank. But I need to know more about how deep these points of frame enter into the tank. Also if there are any opening points from the tank into the other point of Frame. This beside the blow hole point at the fulcrum of the tank ( point of the "V" ). Only been a couple days since I left a message, so it will prolly be a bit yet till I hear back from them.
Oh yea, Your point of a lock-up, ever seen a chain lock-up? I have. Believe the only drive system that wouldn't totally lock-up due to a mechanical problem, is a friction drive. And even with that, I believe the only that'll protect you with even that, is if you could actually grow wings as you fly over the handle bars. As it prolly will still come to a stop over some type of binding, we all shudder to think about.
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Kiwegapawa
New Member
I just came from jakedmoe's permalink # 22 of OldMiniBikes.Com. Was the same idea I mention earlier of meshed rollers. Only he called them meshed gears. Which would have a smaller point of contact. With that 420cc in that minibke, reminds me of a 48 Anglia a friend and me built. We put a chevy V-8 in it with a 12 bolt posi-rear end. you could set the distributor timing while sitting back in the driver seat.
Slap stick was unique to say the least. Last I heard, they still run that machine down at Lebanon Valley. It's called, "the Toad". Cause it's real hard to keep the front end on the ground. 500 lbs of Car and 1000 lbs of Engine, Transmission and rear end. Was almost no need of a drive shaft, actually less then one foot long counting universals.
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Kiwegapawa,That is all I was refering to with the link,but please tell Me how would rollers "mesh"?....The 420cc was just a comment as to the size of area thats in that frame and in no way an order to abandon Your plans for motorizing Your trike and was ment fully in jest....also the worm gear set up will work if you have a freewheeling sprocket on the drive output,and also I played with slotcars then and still run 1/24 scale cars at the local slot car raceway now at 55 yrs old and the same thing would happen, power spinning the worm turns the spur gear the spur gear does not spin the worm... And Wayne,That is the most brilliant idea i think You've ever had!...and shared with the world!....Kiwegapawa i wish You all the luck in Your build....Tigmaster...
Kiwegapawa
New Member
Not a problem Tigmaster, Hadn't thought you did. Had only thought it a suggestion. To be specific, in the larger size 420cc, It was my thought's that your jest reopened, the possibility is there, with even the 212 and the lower than 1:1 gears I'm shooting for. This motor I've chosen still not be enough for these roads in our mountain range here. But I dare not go any higher then this in Hp. Bicycle Peddles or not, that much more Hp would no doubt push the ticket on those out of line officers. .
The ones that like making up their own rules instead of following the Laws in the Motor Vehicle and Traffic Law Book. (( Even at that, some of the laws in this book date back to the very first motorized bicycles built. Like the law that states, you have to have a person carrying a lantern 20 ft in front of and a person with a lantern 10 ft behind you when traveling past dusk in your carriage. So in reflection, remember, head and tail lights on and operational after dusk is not enough to stop an Officer from ticketing you for improper lighting.)) That's just one of many still on the books, and a real point of law. Ignorant and violence provoking it maybe, still a very real point of law! But to those Officers I spoke of who have gained an open agenda with a judge or judges that bring great disgrace to the robes they wear and the community they serve. Let alone that badge that could use a case of tarnex. You know, I'm only a year older than you, and we've both seen it on both sides. Those that walk in honor and work to the letter of the law, and those who walk in tyranny and have that sick ego to wield and feel the power over other's. Liken to the young guys here who say, "who cares". You and I know, they will, when they reach our age and have seen as much of it as we have. There in, all the real spinning their wheels they'll do in getting there. We both know I ain't talkin bout tires either! LoL.
I digress, and follow my mother's nickname for me, Motormouth. Nickname as stated in Native American language
, Many Miles with No Muffler! LoL, But true none the less!
On that of the meshed rollers compared to meshed gears. Gears are usually below one inch in width. Meshed roller is a gear, but one of greater width, say three or four inches. My thinking is, the torque put on these smaller width gears will have a greater chance of twisting it's mounting and slipping passed it's gear to gear operation. Where as meshed rollers actually adds support to it's mounting and much less chance of a mounting twist ever occuring.
The ones that like making up their own rules instead of following the Laws in the Motor Vehicle and Traffic Law Book. (( Even at that, some of the laws in this book date back to the very first motorized bicycles built. Like the law that states, you have to have a person carrying a lantern 20 ft in front of and a person with a lantern 10 ft behind you when traveling past dusk in your carriage. So in reflection, remember, head and tail lights on and operational after dusk is not enough to stop an Officer from ticketing you for improper lighting.)) That's just one of many still on the books, and a real point of law. Ignorant and violence provoking it maybe, still a very real point of law! But to those Officers I spoke of who have gained an open agenda with a judge or judges that bring great disgrace to the robes they wear and the community they serve. Let alone that badge that could use a case of tarnex. You know, I'm only a year older than you, and we've both seen it on both sides. Those that walk in honor and work to the letter of the law, and those who walk in tyranny and have that sick ego to wield and feel the power over other's. Liken to the young guys here who say, "who cares". You and I know, they will, when they reach our age and have seen as much of it as we have. There in, all the real spinning their wheels they'll do in getting there. We both know I ain't talkin bout tires either! LoL.
I digress, and follow my mother's nickname for me, Motormouth. Nickname as stated in Native American language
On that of the meshed rollers compared to meshed gears. Gears are usually below one inch in width. Meshed roller is a gear, but one of greater width, say three or four inches. My thinking is, the torque put on these smaller width gears will have a greater chance of twisting it's mounting and slipping passed it's gear to gear operation. Where as meshed rollers actually adds support to it's mounting and much less chance of a mounting twist ever occuring.
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Kiwegapawa
New Member
Thank you all for your great assistances in opening my mind to all possibilities and bringing in the details that I very well could gloss over, without keeping the finner points in mind!
If you happen by or more comes to mind? Please let me know, my ears are always open ... Would imagine HIEFY, who I started to discuss this with will appreciate your assistance also if and when he comes back.
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Kiwegapawa
New Member
That's one of the reasons I'm taking so much time at a slow pace. As the slow pace doesn't have budget problems as it is budgeted in. Even at that, there is a junk yard about two miles from me. The guy who now runs it, is a ole high school buddy. His families business. We took autoshop together for two years back then. Sometime in the next couple weeks, I plan on riding my bike over there and browse his wares. There are a few other junk yards here but besides being an ole buddy, he's the closest.
I been thinking my next purchase will be a springer front forks, not the longest, but not the shortest either. Good front suspension, yes. I believe it's the double spring sets I'm thinkin most positively about. Drivetrain being as crucial as it is, I will be back peddling on it awhile yet.
In all honesty the abreviations many are using, is literally driving me nutz. Havin to reread twenty times to catch what the larger percentages are. But this time, I'll just ask, Ibedayank, Whats IMHO?
?
I been thinking my next purchase will be a springer front forks, not the longest, but not the shortest either. Good front suspension, yes. I believe it's the double spring sets I'm thinkin most positively about. Drivetrain being as crucial as it is, I will be back peddling on it awhile yet.
In all honesty the abreviations many are using, is literally driving me nutz. Havin to reread twenty times to catch what the larger percentages are. But this time, I'll just ask, Ibedayank, Whats IMHO?
Ibedayank
New Member
imho= in my honest opinion
springer forks...NO problem got an idea for that to....
http://bikerodnkustom3.homestead.com/brainfork.html
but don't listen to me I am just some idiot who has never completed a custom built motorized bicycle...... YET
springer forks...NO problem got an idea for that to....
http://bikerodnkustom3.homestead.com/brainfork.html
but don't listen to me I am just some idiot who has never completed a custom built motorized bicycle...... YET
Kiwegapawa
New Member
Wow, Thank You Ibedayank.Thats a definite upgrade from my teen years and cutting up teader taughter swing set pipes for the first time extended front forks. Course learned my lesson on those swing set pipes long ago. Though my plate is quite full now, if the day should come where I wished to sell a line of my own custom built motorized bicycles. These would be a great addition to point of a custom build and a great basis to build from. I've added them to my "from scratch library". Who knows, if finding the time, could very well be an additional in a personal build. As they are a very well laid out in a "how to".
BarelyAWake, Thank You for the Acronym Finder. It sits on my Favorites Bar now. Besides, I'm already too bald to pull anymore of my hair out. I thank you and my hair thanks you!
Lease to mention those few brain cells I got left.
In that of the overkill of a 212cc, I think I should mention. First two picks of my purchase were done without a slide rule. But through patiently diggin through reads in this and other forums since May last year. Which brought me into the point of my own experiences in younger years in working with small engines in my father's garage. This besides the other kids that brought their small engine problems over. One point from back then which came to mind. My father bought my younger brother a Yamaha 60cc Mini Enduro. I was the one who kept it tuned up for him, till he got older. This engine when tuned, would bog on the inclines I speak of. Plus that of a mini bike I had myself, of a 6hp Briggs & Straton I had on a home built. For being a single speed, did not do too really bad on these inclines. Even though some what sluggish it was. Which I relate to being a single speed, unlike the Enduro.These points experienced in not carrying any extra weight.
In addition after looking over those retail engines being offered. Inbetween these two above mentioned hp sizes the prices climbs high and fast. With the predator it offered points hard acquired and higher priced for others. This is an engine that can be rebuilt if needed from the most basic. It has those points of aftermarket parts for high proformance, if needed or wanted.
It has an Electric Start Kit that can be purchased for it. And the Kit will be at my door tomarrow, the 25th! eBay ,,,
I attempted to get it with the engine. But HF told me it was only being sold attached to the California model. And they won't sell the California model outside of California. Hence how I ended up buying the kit. Oh well, have to pull out my wheel puller. So, with the rest of the drive train and those lower gears below 1:1, it was a fair guess this engine could handle the inclines. Plus taking on the point of extra wieght of camping gear and such, rather loaded on, or in my bicycle cart from behind. So I believe it more than fair to say, I sliced it quite thin. In what is possible without having to rebuild the bicycle in buying another motor. Lastly, wouldn't be much of a peddle assitance if it could not handle the load.
BarelyAWake, Thank You for the Acronym Finder. It sits on my Favorites Bar now. Besides, I'm already too bald to pull anymore of my hair out. I thank you and my hair thanks you!
In that of the overkill of a 212cc, I think I should mention. First two picks of my purchase were done without a slide rule. But through patiently diggin through reads in this and other forums since May last year. Which brought me into the point of my own experiences in younger years in working with small engines in my father's garage. This besides the other kids that brought their small engine problems over. One point from back then which came to mind. My father bought my younger brother a Yamaha 60cc Mini Enduro. I was the one who kept it tuned up for him, till he got older. This engine when tuned, would bog on the inclines I speak of. Plus that of a mini bike I had myself, of a 6hp Briggs & Straton I had on a home built. For being a single speed, did not do too really bad on these inclines. Even though some what sluggish it was. Which I relate to being a single speed, unlike the Enduro.These points experienced in not carrying any extra weight.
In addition after looking over those retail engines being offered. Inbetween these two above mentioned hp sizes the prices climbs high and fast. With the predator it offered points hard acquired and higher priced for others. This is an engine that can be rebuilt if needed from the most basic. It has those points of aftermarket parts for high proformance, if needed or wanted.
Ibedayank
New Member
Kiwegapawa
happy to share the info I found well researching stuff to make my recumbent trike.
I will not buy what I can make myself. As my building skills get better I do plan on building more complicated trikes and bikes. Buying the plans from atomic zombie gave me the info I needed to get the rake and trail right the first time.
happy to share the info I found well researching stuff to make my recumbent trike.
I will not buy what I can make myself. As my building skills get better I do plan on building more complicated trikes and bikes. Buying the plans from atomic zombie gave me the info I needed to get the rake and trail right the first time.
The_Aleman
Active Member
TL;DR
That's funny, I find your font to be completely ridiculous. In fact, I don't read any of your posts because of it.
Only reason I caught this Size 2 sentence is because Barely quoted it.
That's funny, I find your font to be completely ridiculous. In fact, I don't read any of your posts because of it.
Only reason I caught this Size 2 sentence is because Barely quoted it.
wayne z
Active Member
I also have a lot of trouble reading that font.
Kiwegapawa
New Member
Spent thirty years of my life in developement and research. In Conroe, Texas with Realestate Attorney Martin C. Williams. To turn around the then failing nursery industry in Texas. The pattern I set up for Mr Williams, he patiented and sold to the rest of the Realestate Industry. This called "Turn Key Operations." This in the late 70's. Then in "86" in accomplishing what Steven's fail to do in his point of stacking. There in still not gaining the support of Corporations to move beyond that of the BBS Systems when then used. This through my Thesis "EarthSat". This in working through Enable to the US Pentagon on Fidonet. This leading up to the very first emails overseas under the 1st Bush, part 1 Desert Storm. Which through two Engineers (Jovain's Empire of Schenectady, NY), myself (Eagle Consulting and Software of Schuylerville, NY) and enlisting Aboba of UCLA to write that which my Thesis described in the use of TCP IP. Hence TCP I promoted for a Virtual Commerce in my Thesis. This which was fully operational in "92". Or to the First Hardware Multimedia Center I hired the original Alienware to build of my design in 2002. That which was advertised March 2003 on the Intel Web Site and there in shrunk down to become the Itrinum. This which also doubled the pixel sizes to make High Definition possible. These just a few of the hoops I've jumped through in order to feed myself and my family. This as doing this through the private sector, you always end up giving much more than you recieve. Also the reason why my mind is numb from, abbreviations. As they over lap 6 ways to sunday and restrict average readers not in the know. This even for those who've been working within a particular industry and hadn't had the experience of working with larger memberships. But again, even more so for those point's where they overlap. In which someone like myself has worked for many different Industries. That's like IMHO we were discussing here. That particular abbreviation has 5 other definitions of possibility..
Refinement of all I just mentioned. If you have ever been to college? Then your professor, "no doubt", had at lease one time broke down the word "Assume" on the black board for you. A.S.S. /U/ ME. And Assumptions are the Mother of all F**K Ups! In this day in age, and as more than many different abbreviations are exactly the same. It leaves the reader to assume. Definitely not good! There in even more so why I find it to be a headache. As it defeats the exact purpose we come together here for. Myself, it is my wish to understand what someone is saying to me, just as much as I hope to be understood of what I'm saying. I don't believe that wish to be any different than anyone elses.
If you consider yourself being one of the good guys, and what you've said to be a gest. In your show of looking down your nose at how I carry on my communications with others. I would suggest you find a new way to relate to people. Cause if your a good guy, I just switched sides!
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Out of curiosity I've been watching this to see how it turns out,Scotto came up with the specs on the right angle worm drive and it has a input rpm of 1800 and a h.p. quote in fractions,.89 in fact and is for electric motors.It may look strong but a 6.5 is over rating horsepower limits,It will work but how long?....and in the pics of the most insane trike, after further investigation of an inlarged screen clip You can see a freewheel on the output sprocket....Tigmaster...post edit...Sorry for Hi-jacking Your thread HIEFY....
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Kiwegapawa
New Member
I already caught that myself, tigmaster. Those specs you can get right off the manufactures web site. Course it does show us what he used. But my question was to the point of his "use" of the worm gears.
Even now, at the point of this particular unit more than seemingly originally used for an electric motor. These very same manufactures who build these types units also use some what the same set-ups to build transmissions for things like Motorcycles, Lawnmowers, Planes, helicopters, ect., ect.,... But the difference amount to the added use, some or all of tranny fluid, valve body, pumps and filters. And there in my post above, about the Industry Patient Search engine from Google.
There is another member here, who has first hand knowledge of these worm drives. I can't remember his ID right off. But he has a homemade type Ultralight helicopter or plane. But course his experience wouldn't be to it's use in a motorized bicycle. Eitherway, in the outcome of neighbor Rick's use of a worm drive. I have other resources in the works I was going to go on to anyway. I'll post my findings as they come in. But like you had said in of highjacking Heify's Thread, I think we should move the discussion to Hub, Gears, Transmissions and so forth. This even though it does have bearing on his thread. After I talk to a few of the manufactures I'll open a new one there. Wish Heify had come back to have his input on this. As this all does formulate to what his question is, and some of the answers he's looking for. But your right, he might consider it highjacking his thread.
Coincidental the back lash I've started to recieve since I brought up the topic of worm drives? This coming from some of the members who are on the retail side of this hobby. Simply due to attempting to build to what my personal physical needs are? Or maybe it's the point where I am retired at 56? Tough telling other than it's face value, as the attacks are showing the spin doctor effect to accomplish the attack. Still, even with that, I remember it stating here of this forum's reason for being, the hobbyist / consumer, not the retailer.
Even now, at the point of this particular unit more than seemingly originally used for an electric motor. These very same manufactures who build these types units also use some what the same set-ups to build transmissions for things like Motorcycles, Lawnmowers, Planes, helicopters, ect., ect.,... But the difference amount to the added use, some or all of tranny fluid, valve body, pumps and filters. And there in my post above, about the Industry Patient Search engine from Google.
There is another member here, who has first hand knowledge of these worm drives. I can't remember his ID right off. But he has a homemade type Ultralight helicopter or plane. But course his experience wouldn't be to it's use in a motorized bicycle. Eitherway, in the outcome of neighbor Rick's use of a worm drive. I have other resources in the works I was going to go on to anyway. I'll post my findings as they come in. But like you had said in of highjacking Heify's Thread, I think we should move the discussion to Hub, Gears, Transmissions and so forth. This even though it does have bearing on his thread. After I talk to a few of the manufactures I'll open a new one there. Wish Heify had come back to have his input on this. As this all does formulate to what his question is, and some of the answers he's looking for. But your right, he might consider it highjacking his thread.
Coincidental the back lash I've started to recieve since I brought up the topic of worm drives? This coming from some of the members who are on the retail side of this hobby. Simply due to attempting to build to what my personal physical needs are? Or maybe it's the point where I am retired at 56? Tough telling other than it's face value, as the attacks are showing the spin doctor effect to accomplish the attack. Still, even with that, I remember it stating here of this forum's reason for being, the hobbyist / consumer, not the retailer.
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