Conservitive consortium of motorized bicycle riders

[Dan]

With the MB population explosion of last years fuel prices and folks wanting "greener" transportation, there is inevitably going to be confusion and misinformation being passed along to new folks and even amongst more experienced builders. What I am proposing is a "committee" of experienced builders, threw demicratic proccess write a conservitive but expanding practical guide to instalation and whats to be expected from a 2 stroke bicycle engine kit. (4 stroke later?) More and more I am seeing folks say "well I have been reading about this for months/weeks" and then give inacurate information or making rather high claims. Worse, not saying they only read some thing and pass it along.

The reason I say conservitive is so as to avoid jumping on the band wagon of the latest, greatest widget or mod.

The committee would vote on any changes and if done correctly, will only suggest and always be slower to adopt new ways of approaching concepts while being supportive of individual innovation.

The goal being to help the community and present a tried and true methodology that people can trust as it is not one person speaking gospel, but an informed group of people who's goal is to further motor bicyclers and motored bike building.



In rereading (and writing) this for the 3rd time, I find myself coming off arrogant. That is not my intent, or even to be a contributer to such a posting unless invited but helping any way I could. Just really frustrated.

 

[2door]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

Dan,
I agree that lately I've been seeing too much mis-information freely given out by people who obviously have limited experience and are often repeating information that they have read with no regards to its validity. Advice to newcomers to the hobby should be as good and accurate as we can provide. Simply telling a newbie to do as I do is not good enough unless what I do has been proven to be the right thing. I always try to suggest remedies, but not preach that my way is the gospel. And while we're on this subject there is another issue that I've been seeing that rubs me the wrong way. That is the practice of some kit/part suppliers answering questions from beginners with, "buy my product". The advertisers on this forum pay to have their banners displayed here and they are all prominently available for everyone to see. There is no reason for a vendor to suggest to a newcomer that he should junk his kit supplied parts in favor of purchasing his. Many people come here for help and information, not to have products shoved down their throats. The question and answer forums are not the place to sell products. If another member has had good luck with a product then by all means he should feel free to tell people about it but the sellers should refrain from pushing their wares to someone simply wanting information. I'll catch some flack for my diatribe here but I doubt that I'm the only one who feels as I do. If you disagree, tell me, if you are in agreement, chime in.
Tom

 

[Bikeguy Joe]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

Guy, we mods try to read EVERYTHING. (yes, hard to believe). If you find a post that is wrong info, and there is a way to explain it and correct it, feel free to jump in.

There is a difference between "jumping in" and "piling on".

Also, feel free to report post that are over the top advertising, we will deal with it directly.

 

[Dan]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

I agree big time Tom. After a member who sells a product suggests his/hers, It is uncomfortable to inform the poster of alternatives as well. Limmiting the information they are getting even more.

Joe, you all do great work. I mean that. The intent is not to in any way suggest other wise, but to have a popular, conservative, consensus. Very often a more energetic personality will be louder then a correct statement. The point of the effort of the post would be to have an easy to read and understand for a new person that is agreed on as good information. Not to in any way encroach on or do the great job you guys do. Goal being to lesson the confusion of conflicting, similar and the occasional erroneous.

Would just be a post for easy and reliable reference. Contributed to by a group of builders.

 

[lordoflightaz]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

For a second I thought I was going to read a "Fox Network" ad.

A lot of time I read things and say to myself, but so and so said xxx. They say there is more than one way to skin a cat. Forums just are no good at being authoritative, because off topic and wrong info happen all the time. Maybe some post need to be moved and locked with the "good stuff"

 

[Dan]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

Lol Lightaz, took me a bit to catch the reference. Not authoritative, rather just trustworthy. (Fair and unbiased, snork) You are right, many ways to do many things and that could be incorporated in to the post.

But seems to be going over like a lead balloon. Ah well. Seemed like a good idea.

 

[Goat Herder]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

Thanks and hats off to the moderators here. This can be tough work for you guys. This to me has been an outstanding forum! I have never seen a more friendlier place! There is definitely some truth to the potential of bad advice. I like to help when I can. Its fun to give back to such a community. When I think I have the right words for it.

 

[Bikeguy Joe]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

I think most bad info is weeded out by everyone on the forum, and B.S.'ers either learn or disappear.

 

[lordoflightaz]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

I think most bad info is weeded out by everyone on the forum, and B.S.'ers either learn or disappear.

That can't be right I'm still here, LOL.

One thing that would help would be to add in a better search engine function. Like using Yahoo BOSS or Google CSE. I might try messing with BOSS, I already have a CSE for motor bikes.

 

[Dan]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

Yeppers, bad info is most always countered. That's kinda the goal. A non conflicting consensus.

 

[Bikeguy Joe]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

Even if, say, a seller come here with a new item, and it's the same old same old, or a P.O.S., it doesn't last long.

 

[deacon]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

I think most bad info is weeded out by everyone on the forum, and B.S.'ers either learn or disappear.

Then how come I'm still here lol...

I always thought that there should be an easy to find list of GOOD information. The problem I always saw was the impossible task of making good information easy to find. When the heading were made and the posts were few it was easy to find things. As the site grew more and more information got pushed to the bottom of the list. I am guilty of putting frivolous things on the board. Those posts stay near the top for a while and then the good information is just pushed lower and lower. I know the mods try to keep the good stuff available but it's almost impossible to keep it current.

Even if you set up stickies they get so long its cumbersome. Maybe there is some way you could mark the really useful post so people won't waste time reading my kind of posts. Some icon by the tittle. Let the Mods decide if the informtion is worth marking or not. Especially since they read them anyway.

 

[Goat Herder]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

How about a bonified trouble shooting tree for our problems kinda weans it all out for the repetitive stuff! As a mechanic I have read through many. They are a awesome tool and go way past even general here say in a shop!!

 

[Goat Herder]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

Coming generic problems solved with less arguing!! Now thats conservative It kills the bad personalities that spring up with absolute fact!!Man that is simple!

 

[Goat Herder]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

More time and energy would only lead to more creativity!

 

[Dan]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

Sounds great GH. I don't think I have ever seen one. I googled it but am not finding much. Could you post an example?

 

[Goat Herder]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

2000 Lincoln Navigator Air Suspension Pump Troubleshooting Tree (Part 3) your right I just googled it not much examples heres one. Type this in your google browser
Thermo Top - Troubleshooting Tree
Heres a good example!

 

[Dan]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

That is a fantastic idea GH. Really. Would save massive amounts of typing and bandwidth.

 

[Goat Herder]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

Its just some glimpse to reality? really its is a **** of a task I would gladly take it on for a good fight! Not the kind that causes mischief just less distraction! My goodness this has been an awesome forum!!! The thought and the oblivious for more intelligence not really that way just more diligence! I have become a fun typer really because of here!! By far.........Typing and checking is learning! This is what a forum is about.... Lets grow on good stuff! LOL

 

[Creative Engineering]

Re: Conservitive consortium of MBers

Excellent ideas guys!

Dan, Tom:

It's the old saying: Ya gotta take the chaff with the wheat.

Athough it is frustrating to see posts that contain, sometimes, ludicrous advice, and misinformation: it is inevitable on a forum with so many members. "Good grief" is my standard response when it goes off the deep end technically. I get a lot of emails and PM's asking for the low down on certain topics without the BS. The problem with this is that the general forum does not get to benefit from the answer. I refuse to argue over the obvious in a public forum. I simply don't have time! Some posts are written so poorly that it is difficult to even extract the intent, much less help!

Part of the fun is building, modifying, and finding innovative ways to overcome flaws that are just part of the whole experience. These bikes are not an engineered, finished assembly. If they were, the forum would likely be very boring.

Not to be the least bit insulting, but MB's are a cobblers paradise. I think if we all digress and realize that we are all cobblers at different levels, it is easier to accept the crazy antics of the beginner cobbler. Some have a hard time tying thier shoes...others can make fine shoes from scratch.

I feel like it is very important "not" to try and solve this by implementing rules. I realize no one has suggested rules...but that seems to be the standard way of dealing with a lot of this on other forums.

Joe is right:

For the most part bad information is corrected and worthless product offerings will dissappear all on thier own. It really is an ominous job to keep a forum stable...especially with so many members and personalities.

GH: Excellent idea!!! A definitive trouble-shooting guide is really needed.

The question; how do you use the knowledge you have gained by actually building MB's and solving problems without disrupting the general forum. You don't want to seem overpowering, nor do you want to get lost in the shuffle.

I have an idea!

How about a heading under "motorized bicycle", something like "The Pro Shop"

This would be a membership only topic area for those who have built a few bikes and know what they are talking about...In other words the ability to post or create threads under this heading would be by invitation only.

Invitation to the Pro Shop should be limited only to those who really have experience and can refrain from posting thoughts and theories, or product offerings just for the sake of using a large audience.

For example: I would not interfere with another pro who was trying to help with a rag joint installation by hawking my hub adapter as it is already obvious that the product exists. On the other hand, I don't want another pro interjecting with "The rag joint is a beautifull thing", if I'm trying to spare a newbie a lot of grief. Common sense, and respect for each other among those in the pro shop should drive the written material for the benefit of the forum.

If a thread in any of the forums is going off the deep end technically, it can be expanded on by a member of the pro shop by creating a similar named thread for all to read that is no-nonsense because it is posted in "The Pro Shop".

This may seem redundant, but it is a way for those who have been there, done that, to help others without getting lost in the shuffle. Think of it as a live "Classic instruction" section. There will be fewer posts that should contain zero BS for other members to look up.

There is a psychological benefit to this too...an invitation to the pro shop will be the "new" goal to attain instead of a high post count. It could prevent a lot of usless posts on the forum as a whole without having to resort to rules or any sort of other censorship.

Just a thought on a Sunday morning before I get back to making tooling for clutch pads.

Jim