will a sturmey archer 3 speed hub hold up to motored biking?

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bowljoman

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Aug 7, 2010
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Increase the chain speed/rpm of the tranny which reduces the torque loading, and it will never explode.

I have almost a thousand miles on my shimano tricycle transmission as jack shaft. THere is no sign of trouble or heat.

I recommend the nexus highly over the SA. I crank out 40mph with the shimano in 3rd gear.
 
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OBX Fisherman

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Jun 13, 2008
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bowljoman said:
S.A. 8 speed with disc mount. ( drill sprocket to mount on disc 6-bolt pattern.)

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I'm running that hub on my build. Using Andy's aluminum sprocket, top hat adapter and a 8" Hayes rotor with an Avid BB7 brake. Been testing for a week now and no problems with the rear setup. Its wide thought! Had to widen the rear dropouts by 2" or more.
 
professor

professor

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For the one who questioned about how to mount a sprocket to the SA for jackshaft use- I welded a bike sprocket on the other side, being careful to center it and use little tacks of weld to avoid wrecking the brg, race which is close to the welds.
Only issue is the dropping out of gear monentarilly in 3rd, I put a slightly stronger spring in the hub (pretty easy- just place hub in vise by the axle with the shift side up and unwind the nuts and brg race- spring will pop up) - this does help some.
 
KiM

KiM

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As others have said should be fine with a HT motor...just dont try using them with medium to hih powered electric setups, my extra wide sturmey archer 3 speed started skipping gears first ride not 20 foot out of my drive way they definitely weren't made for 10 000watt motor driving through the hubs sprocket, fixing a sprcoket to the opposing side on the disk brake mount and driving the hub would be fine though i actually run a disk brake and a south paw freewheel on the left side for the manual pedal of the bicycle :)

KiM
 
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KiM

KiM

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Not that nexus linked to thats for sure LoL..E.S member Deecanio blew one on his first ride also with his medium powered rc motored e-bike, none of the 'traditional' internally geared hubs are super strong, however the Nuvinci hubs have proven pretty indestructible couple of fellas using them with high powered rc setups and other than being on the inefficient side they are going strong and haven't failed.



Using the hub with a sprocket hard fixed to it wouldn't IMO be a problem on any of them. Its when your running motor power through the internals of the hub where problems arise ;-) Actually i will be running my old skipping extra wide on my latest bike as i am using the disk brake mounts to fasten a sprocket/disk brake adapter to which my 10hp electric motor will drive ...

KiM
 
Goat Herder

Goat Herder

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Apr 28, 2008
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I am real fond of the N.V. I got one chained to a 5.8 Morini . I have run it hard too. That thing works as good as day one! Over 2000 miles on it now. I calculated a ruff estimate of the weight of the bike with me on it around 375 pounds give or take.

I am kinda hoping for something smaller and lighter for a j shaft. I know N.V. has a smaller hub now but don't know if it is as indestructible though.

I think I need a steel hub too because I will need to weld one of the sprockets on lol.
 
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bowljoman

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KiM said:
Not that nexus linked to thats for sure LoL..E.S member Deecanio blew one on his first ride also with his medium powered rc motored e-bike, none of the 'traditional' internally geared hubs are super strong
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I beg to differ. Just about any mechanical tranny can be busted if you try to shift when you shouldn't.

Anyone could WOT in first gear and slam into second....

Besides, it's likely Nuvinci would just slip instead of detonating. Lets ride up some long steep hills and see who's tranny overheats first. ;) I could max out rpms in first gear up any hill till I ran out of gas and the tranny would be luke-warm.

Also note, used as a jackshaft spinning at a higher RPM than it would installed in the rear wheel, you can reduce the net torque applied to the internals, further improving the MTBF and removing the danger or detonation.(unless you don't know when not to shift)

I Highly recommend the nexus 3 speed tricycle tranny. I expect thousands of miles of service.
 
KiM

KiM

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bowljoman said:
I beg to differ. Just about any mechanical tranny can be busted if you try to shift when you shouldn't.

Anyone could WOT in first gear and slam into second....

Besides, it's likely Nuvinci would just slip instead of detonating. Lets ride up some long steep hills and see who's tranny overheats first. ;) I could max out rpms in first gear up any hill till I ran out of gas and the tranny would be luke-warm.

Also note, used as a jackshaft spinning at a higher RPM than it would installed in the rear wheel, you can reduce the net torque applied to the internals, further improving the MTBF and removing the danger or detonation.(unless you don't know when not to shift)

I Highly recommend the nexus 3 speed tricycle tranny. I expect thousands of miles of service.
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Beg to differ all you like fact is these 3 speeds were blown up not while shifting, mine and my friends extra wide three speed sturmey archers and the above mentioned nexus of Deecs all failed while in gear NOT when shifting, the torque snaps the teeth off the gears while in gear... If your pushing more than 1000watts through these 3 speeds they will fail whether you baby them through shifting or not... Using them on HT motors you will likely have a long life, the motors don't have the torque to pull the skin off a bowl of custard. My warning was a heads up to those using moderate to high powered setups, morini could possibly fall into that category. Any electric over 1000watts definitely falls into this category IMO.

KiM
 
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bowljoman

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Maybe your gearing was a little to ambitious? What rpms do you have at max torque and max hp? And how heavy/fast do you pull on the load? My hub rpm itself is crankin'.

What was the maximum speed you were geared for?
 
KiM

KiM

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6500rpm can't tell you exact torque figures max of 13hp it is under geared far from ambitious to cope with the extremely hilly terrain where i live i also tow a wheelchair behind the bike most times i ride, acceleration is 0-55km/hr in `4-5seconds(while towing wheelchair)



Just s you know i'm not blowing wind up you haha here's
the data log from my Castle Creations HV160 electronic speed controller
showing output from the esc of 10000w/750w=13hp

Typical for a large outrunner rc e-bike. Deecanios i mention above is a tad lower but my friends Matts is a 1000watt Cyclone setup peaks at ~4000watts opposed to my 10000watt setup and his acceleration is alot less (i actually have a video posted of 0-100m run on youtube...)his sturmey archer lasted a few months before teeth broke from the gears, he made a point of not having power on when shifting as he was aware of previous peoples failings with these hubs. 2nd gear in them 1:1 seems to last longer than first and third we have seen...Fact is these are made for human leg power not high torque motored setups...

KiM
 
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bowljoman

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13hp + 0-55km/hr( ~34mph ) in `4-5seconds (while towing wheelchair)

... And you wanna talk down the little nexus?

No wonder you snapped it. Will you find any three speed to pull that ambitious? No....

Can you describe the set up? sprocket sizes?, as jackshaft?, directly in rear wheel?

Properly geared as a jackshaft, I'm pretty sure you'd have better luck.
 
KiM

KiM

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I was reporting from experience, mine and others on endless sphere who have less powerful setups than i do, i just finished giving you and example of 1000watt setup trashing a 3 speed, i posted the findings as not everyone reading this thread will have HT motors, they will likely be fine they have no power to speak of...Either way, Do what you want personally i could care less. if you want any more information on my build i have a detailed 100 page worklog (link in my sig) outlining every aspect of the build, perhaps read that before coming to conclusions how i have my bike setup and how well it could work with a 3 speed internally geared hub, theres hidef pics in the sig you can get most of the information you want with a single click :-S . As to a multi speed internal hub that will work i have also given you an model that will in previous post.

KiM
 
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4950cycle

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Sep 8, 2010
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Actually Kim, Quite impressive ! I am seriously thinking about going electric after looking at your rig. Especially since I havn't gone forward with any expenditures yet. My dad has the 66cc I just built, so obviously he paid for that kit. I'm still free to go any direction I like having not picked one $ yet. I don't know a whole lot about the technology of DC EVs but it will most likely be playing a significant role in the future.It might be time I learn someting new and go EV. I know they have tons of torque compared to ICEs (internal combustion engines) . Im not sure if Im as smart as you are though and dont want to be making expensive dead end mistakes with a build. What kind of range can you engineer out of your rig do you think ? John
 
KiM

KiM

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4950cycle said:
Actually Kim, Quite impressive ! I am seriously thinking about going electric after looking at your rig. Especially since I havn't gone forward with any expenditures yet. My dad has the 66cc I just built, so obviously he paid for that kit. I'm still free to go any direction I like having not picked one $ yet. I don't know a whole lot about the technology of DC EVs but it will most likely be playing a significant role in the future.It might be time I learn someting new and go EV. I know they have tons of torque compared to ICEs (internal combustion engines) . Im not sure if Im as smart as you are though and dont want to be making expensive dead end mistakes with a build. What kind of range can you engineer out of your rig do you think ? John
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G'day John...electric is very cool, alot have a preconceived notion theat they are niether fast of have any range, both are totally incorrect. One thing that is correct though is that it is very very expensive process to build something with decent power and range in comparison with your HT powered bicycle. To answer you question regarding range of my bike, i could easily get 40km from it on a charge, more if i dropped my cruising speed bellow 45km/hr.. I am about half way through uploading a ride video i did today with fellow Endless Sphere member, we traveled 23km today average speed was ~44km/hr to speed was 68km/hr i used 12ah of my 20ah battery pack. I live in the hills of Perth Western Australia, most wouldn't have seen hills like i these I think?... unfortunately both Matt and my cameras shut down mid point of the ride so the big hills we tackled were n't shot, very bummed about this, the video though will be viewable very soon if you check my worklog for the Custom HXT Cruiser in the electric section of this forum in an hour or so you will see a link to it, i have combined video from both cameras, you will see Matts 500watt hub motored MTB also, if you can afford electric and don't need to travel 100kilometers every ride you will get something on the road with modern tech Lifep04 or lithium polymer batteries for under 1500 bucks that would give you the range most would be happy with...Big difference from a 200 dollar HT kit slapped on a Walmart bike i know but thatrs just how it is, IMHO though its worth every damn cent ;-)

All the best...

KiM

p.s most of the off the shelf kits these days are 'plug and play' you need very oittle electrical knowledge mate, it might appear i am clever truth is, this w i struggle to even put batteries in a camera at times, all the info you need is laid out on Endless Sphere forums...
 
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slowenuff

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May 5, 2010
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baltimore,maryland
BarelyAWake said:
Jus' an update...

I've now got well over 3500 miles on my (usta be new lol) Sturmey Archer X-RD3 three speed - with a jackshaft shifter kit through it for every single one of 'em & there's not been even the slightest problem w/the hub :D
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nice looking machine!...any chance you have some photos of the drive train w/ the chaingaurd off?!?...they would be informative to me and set my mind to figureing out how i might execute such a clean set up....did i miss a picture of the overall machine? ... really looks terrific.duh.
 
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