The best thing I have ever done for my HT bicycle engine...
- Thread starter RLorange
- Start date
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
the dirt from the air filter is were the trouble begains & the air filter is not up to par oil most good named luber****s will be fine save your hard narned money & ride
the dirt from the air filter is were the trouble begains & the air filter is not up to par oil most good named luber****s will be fine save your hard narned money & ride
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
Not trying to sound disrespectful but I am very experienced with these little engines as I have owned and killed 3 engines over six years while constantly researching more about how they work and doing experiments.
I always keep my air filter clean and use a fuel filter. I use a very thin brass wire mesh from a wok/fryer strainer from a junk shop. Behind that is a proper brushcutter foam element which I regularly.
As for oils I have tried many of them. Valvoline seems best for break in while running rich as allows wear in and has the highest burn rate of all the oils I have tried while still providing protection. Bel ray seemed to run dry and hot, Castrol seemed fine, cheapies seemed to degrade and leave residue. Eventually I settled on Motul 800t, specifically designed for premix and full synthetic I mix it at 35:1 and more and it leaves too much gunk on the piston head. The only drawback apart from cost is that the Motul does build up residue quickly on the head and in the muffler however this is easily wiped clean and absolutely no deposits are left on the rings.
There is a new high performance and even higher burn rate Valvoline oil I saw I may use this with the Bi-tron as it has made my expensive Motul redundant.
I'll just say again that in all my years of experimenting This stuff has given me by far the best improvement and it just keeps on smoothing out with every tank I use (now six I think) My 6 month old engine now feels as loose as my old one after nearly two years!! By that time the compression has dropped due to wear. Right now I have a loose-y-goose engine with poppy compression and power galore. It never has trouble starting NEVER need the choke and never overheats even on a hot day up slow hills. It never feels angry and dry after long runs on hot days never feels like it going to pop when revved out. Like I said it feels like a second break in and I am thoroughly impressed.
I decided to use more of the fuel conditioner with the last 5L can which has the very thin grade polarized treated oil the idea was that it would better penetrate the nooks and cranny's of the engine, this seemed to accelerate the smoothing process but I can't really tell for sure.
I am still waiting for equilibrium... How loose can it get without melting off the bike into a puddle of lubricated gooooooo!
Not trying to sound disrespectful but I am very experienced with these little engines as I have owned and killed 3 engines over six years while constantly researching more about how they work and doing experiments.
I always keep my air filter clean and use a fuel filter. I use a very thin brass wire mesh from a wok/fryer strainer from a junk shop. Behind that is a proper brushcutter foam element which I regularly.
As for oils I have tried many of them. Valvoline seems best for break in while running rich as allows wear in and has the highest burn rate of all the oils I have tried while still providing protection. Bel ray seemed to run dry and hot, Castrol seemed fine, cheapies seemed to degrade and leave residue. Eventually I settled on Motul 800t, specifically designed for premix and full synthetic I mix it at 35:1 and more and it leaves too much gunk on the piston head. The only drawback apart from cost is that the Motul does build up residue quickly on the head and in the muffler however this is easily wiped clean and absolutely no deposits are left on the rings.
There is a new high performance and even higher burn rate Valvoline oil I saw I may use this with the Bi-tron as it has made my expensive Motul redundant.
I'll just say again that in all my years of experimenting This stuff has given me by far the best improvement and it just keeps on smoothing out with every tank I use (now six I think) My 6 month old engine now feels as loose as my old one after nearly two years!! By that time the compression has dropped due to wear. Right now I have a loose-y-goose engine with poppy compression and power galore. It never has trouble starting NEVER need the choke and never overheats even on a hot day up slow hills. It never feels angry and dry after long runs on hot days never feels like it going to pop when revved out. Like I said it feels like a second break in and I am thoroughly impressed.
I decided to use more of the fuel conditioner with the last 5L can which has the very thin grade polarized treated oil the idea was that it would better penetrate the nooks and cranny's of the engine, this seemed to accelerate the smoothing process but I can't really tell for sure.
I am still waiting for equilibrium... How loose can it get without melting off the bike into a puddle of lubricated gooooooo!
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
I may not have caught it before so I'll ask.
If it keeps getting better, how long do you have to use it before you could stop using it, or what would happen if you stop using it?
Your post about your experience with other oils puts things a little more into perspective.
I may not have caught it before so I'll ask.
If it keeps getting better, how long do you have to use it before you could stop using it, or what would happen if you stop using it?
Your post about your experience with other oils puts things a little more into perspective.
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
That is a good question Bike Guy Joe. I know that when using it in cars a lot of it sticks to the surfaces inside the engine after an oil change so you don't need to add as much after the first go. 2 strokes are obviously different because they constantly consume oil. The stuff is supposed to penetrate the pores of the metal surfaces and sort of bond to it via the attractive charges.
In chemistry you have polar molecules and substances like water which stick together and stick to other polar surfaces or substances, water sticks so well with itself that 'wetters' are needed to soften water so it can wet things better. Oil is non polar and so it disolves in non-polar solvents such as petrol.
Polar really means that the molecule is asymmetrically charged so it has a more negative end and more positive end, oils (and petrol) are large relatively symmetrical and neutral molecules so are non-polar. Anything polar will be attracted to electric charges be it another polar substance or propery charged substance (such as ionic salt) OR a charged surface.
Metal is a conductor so it has an ocean of 'free' electrons which being mobile can be attracted to and build up on any part of its surface. Thus the positive parts of the bi-tron polar oil molecule are attracted and stick to metal. It so happens that friction and heat between metal generates a negative charge build up which will attract the stuff more strongly when and where it is needed. you can imagine how well it would stick inside the pores on a metal surface providing a semi-permanent treatment effect.
So the theory is seems sound to me then agian I am studying chemistry. They state that they treat the oil with Chlorine gas to make it polar. I don't know detail of the theory but I do know that in large hydrocarbon molecules it is possible to strip the hydrogen's off certain carbon atoms to leave a stable positive charge. The Chlorine gas will do this very effectively producing Hydrochloric acid which gasses off leaving positively charged oil.
So there's the theory. Like I mentioned Castrol is doing something similar with their EDGE and MAGNATEC oils. BUT all of the other 'Snake Oil' miracle oil additives used chemical additives of PTFE.
PTFE will not work in an engine for many reasons but mainly because it is almost ANTI-polar is sticks to almost nothing so it will stick around long enough to help much. Also when it breaks down chemically it makes nasty Hydrofluric acid which will eat the HT's soft porus aluminium like a hot knife through butter.
Interestingly with the HT's low quality cast aluminium, there should be more pores in the metal for the oil to fill maybe that's part of the reason it has such a dramatic effect
That is a good question Bike Guy Joe. I know that when using it in cars a lot of it sticks to the surfaces inside the engine after an oil change so you don't need to add as much after the first go. 2 strokes are obviously different because they constantly consume oil. The stuff is supposed to penetrate the pores of the metal surfaces and sort of bond to it via the attractive charges.
In chemistry you have polar molecules and substances like water which stick together and stick to other polar surfaces or substances, water sticks so well with itself that 'wetters' are needed to soften water so it can wet things better. Oil is non polar and so it disolves in non-polar solvents such as petrol.
Polar really means that the molecule is asymmetrically charged so it has a more negative end and more positive end, oils (and petrol) are large relatively symmetrical and neutral molecules so are non-polar. Anything polar will be attracted to electric charges be it another polar substance or propery charged substance (such as ionic salt) OR a charged surface.
Metal is a conductor so it has an ocean of 'free' electrons which being mobile can be attracted to and build up on any part of its surface. Thus the positive parts of the bi-tron polar oil molecule are attracted and stick to metal. It so happens that friction and heat between metal generates a negative charge build up which will attract the stuff more strongly when and where it is needed. you can imagine how well it would stick inside the pores on a metal surface providing a semi-permanent treatment effect.
So the theory is seems sound to me then agian I am studying chemistry. They state that they treat the oil with Chlorine gas to make it polar. I don't know detail of the theory but I do know that in large hydrocarbon molecules it is possible to strip the hydrogen's off certain carbon atoms to leave a stable positive charge. The Chlorine gas will do this very effectively producing Hydrochloric acid which gasses off leaving positively charged oil.
So there's the theory. Like I mentioned Castrol is doing something similar with their EDGE and MAGNATEC oils. BUT all of the other 'Snake Oil' miracle oil additives used chemical additives of PTFE.
PTFE will not work in an engine for many reasons but mainly because it is almost ANTI-polar is sticks to almost nothing so it will stick around long enough to help much. Also when it breaks down chemically it makes nasty Hydrofluric acid which will eat the HT's soft porus aluminium like a hot knife through butter.
Interestingly with the HT's low quality cast aluminium, there should be more pores in the metal for the oil to fill maybe that's part of the reason it has such a dramatic effect
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
Amazingly that all made sense even though I haven't taken chemistry in 8 years
Amazingly that all made sense even though I haven't taken chemistry in 8 years
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
In my Happy time i run an old oil recipe that I found authored by Pablo along with normans sparklpug mod amd bikeguy joes plug replacement and wire mod.
78% synthetic oil
20% castor
2% Marvel mystery oil ( An upper lube to cut the carbon)
I have run gallons of this stuff through the engine of a happytime.
Compression so high that the first start of the day is very hard it will flat out stall the momentum of the bike .
In a car I love Royal purple.
In the gas crisis of the 1970's
A product called MIX I GO was foisted on the unsuspecting public through a pyramid scheme.
Many people had garages full of unsold cased of this stuff.
When Unleaded gasoline became the standard gasoline .
The octane rating was very poor compared to leaded gasoline .
MIX I GO actually worked very well with unleaded gasoline and it was dirt cheap with many MIX I GO Dealers just wanting to recover their losses.
I would love to find a trove of this stuff now.
In my Happy time i run an old oil recipe that I found authored by Pablo along with normans sparklpug mod amd bikeguy joes plug replacement and wire mod.
78% synthetic oil
20% castor
2% Marvel mystery oil ( An upper lube to cut the carbon)
I have run gallons of this stuff through the engine of a happytime.
Compression so high that the first start of the day is very hard it will flat out stall the momentum of the bike .
In a car I love Royal purple.
In the gas crisis of the 1970's
A product called MIX I GO was foisted on the unsuspecting public through a pyramid scheme.
Many people had garages full of unsold cased of this stuff.
When Unleaded gasoline became the standard gasoline .
The octane rating was very poor compared to leaded gasoline .
MIX I GO actually worked very well with unleaded gasoline and it was dirt cheap with many MIX I GO Dealers just wanting to recover their losses.
I would love to find a trove of this stuff now.
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
Back In The 50`s I Remember A Purple Motor Oil. It Was Called Royal Triton. Is This The Same Oil?? That And Burma Shave Was The Cool Thing!!
Back In The 50`s I Remember A Purple Motor Oil. It Was Called Royal Triton. Is This The Same Oil?? That And Burma Shave Was The Cool Thing!!
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
HEY SPAD4ME, IT WAS FUN READING THE LITTLE SIGNS ON THE ROAD SIDE POSTS!! BACK IN THE GOOD OLD DAYS, WHEN WE WAS YOUNG AND DUMB!! LATER SPAD, RON
HEY SPAD4ME, IT WAS FUN READING THE LITTLE SIGNS ON THE ROAD SIDE POSTS!! BACK IN THE GOOD OLD DAYS, WHEN WE WAS YOUNG AND DUMB!! LATER SPAD, RON
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
I know someone at the other forum, who poured some teflon chain lube into the oil mix and he claims it works much better.
I know someone at the other forum, who poured some teflon chain lube into the oil mix and he claims it works much better.
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
He must have smoked some of it too. He's full of %$#@.
He must have smoked some of it too. He's full of %$#@.
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
I SAID TO MYSELF; SELF WOULD THE TEFLON MAKE THE GAS SLIDE THRU THE JETS MUCH TOO EASY AND RUIN THE FUEL ECONOMY?? JOE - IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU MIGHT TRY IT!!
. WE NEED A MYTH BUSTER ON THE FORUM. RON
I SAID TO MYSELF; SELF WOULD THE TEFLON MAKE THE GAS SLIDE THRU THE JETS MUCH TOO EASY AND RUIN THE FUEL ECONOMY?? JOE - IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU MIGHT TRY IT!!
. WE NEED A MYTH BUSTER ON THE FORUM. RON
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
If anything the guy was running too rich, and adding a bunch of crap to the gas made it lean out enough to run right.
I do the same thing by adjusting the carb properly.
If anything the guy was running too rich, and adding a bunch of crap to the gas made it lean out enough to run right.
I do the same thing by adjusting the carb properly.
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
JOE, MERRY CHRISTMAS TO YOU AND YOURS AND EVERYBODY ELSE ON THE FORUM. RON CX
JOE, MERRY CHRISTMAS TO YOU AND YOURS AND EVERYBODY ELSE ON THE FORUM. RON
CX
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
Easy with the brodies there bud, yer' gettin' sand in my computer!
Merry Christmas!
Easy with the brodies there bud, yer' gettin' sand in my computer!
Merry Christmas!
Re: The best thing I have ever done for my HT...
I heard a guy thought if he put aluminum paint in his sparkplug hole it would give him better compression because he thought it would fill in any grooves in the cyl. wall....huh......C`mon now dude....