Should I buy a Princess Auto/Harbor Freight motor, or CG?

[fasteddy]

A gasoline motor on a bicycle in Canada is illegal. The fines can be staggering. Up to $5,000 depending on the province your in when your stopped. The bike will be classified as an unregistered, unlicensed, uninsured motor vehicle and the federal law won't allow you to register it. Loss of license and jail time can be the result and points off your license seem to be a certain thing no matter what else happens.

If your in B.C. it's already been through court and the rider didn't fare well. Look up I.C.B.C.'s web site for what is legal in the province. Electric bikes only with 500w and 32km an hour top speed.

Steve.

 

[motoringbike]

I ride my 6kw ebike in city parks, along the river pathway, along city pathways, park pathways all the time. Not once has a person clued in that my regular looking bicycle has a motor in its rear hub. I hide it very well, its hidden behind some pannier bags, and the controller blends in camoflauge style to the rear rack. The batteries are located inside the pannier bags. I've even had police officers behind me while I ride 60kph on the roadway. Now when I move fast up a hill with my feet noticably off the pedals, I get stares and that is on purpose

I've asked countless gassers on bicycles if they have any hassle, and everyone said nope!

If I were to start blowing past people on the pathways, pissing people off, doing wheelies, scaring people, scaring kids, scaring family pets then someone would phone it in. The most thats happened so far, are people who jump when they are scared or frightened. Its happened a lot, I guess they aren't used to the noise of a trapezoidal wave controller and the sound it makes, obviously different then the sound of a geared motor, whether it be geared hub or geared mid drive.

I figure if I hide the motor, and allow it to have good airflow on a trailer, making it a pusher trailer and gearing it properly. I think along the highways and byways of Alberta and BC, there should not be an issue at all. Of course I will do some fake pedaling when I see the 5-0 aka The Fuzz aka The Pigs aka The Donut Eaters, but I will play it by ear.

I will be respectful and ride at a reasonable rate of speed in a safe manner.

Here was a quick search and a quote
"In a decision this month, the court detailed how Alejandro Calderone was pulled over in 2013 by an officer who heard sounds coming from his powered-bicycle’s small gas engine and saw exhaust puffing out from the back."
Kelowna
http://vancouver.24hrs.ca/2015/05/14/gas-powered-cycle-needs-licence-court

"It’s an issue that has come up before. In 2013, North Vancouver RCMP issued a warning after receiving complaints of youth riding bikes with gas engines."

So a licence and insurance is whats needed, I will ask around Alberta Insurers if they insure gas powered bicycles. I doubt they do.

Sounds to me like the pig in Kelowna had a hard on, and his ticket quota was quite low. Either way, on the highway, trying to make it real silent will be a goal of mine.

 

[fasteddy]

Hi Motorbiking,

Gas power bikes are illegal in Canada and the police are catching on really fast. My nephew is an R.C.M.P. officer and he said that they are looking for people riding gas powered bikes a lot more than they used to. Hope your good luck continues.

Steve.

 

[motoringbike]

That is why I went with an electric bicycle, so I could ride in parks and blend in nice and no one knows anything. Thats the whole reason I went with electric, its silent.

Sounds like a trap they set in place on purpose, but the roadways are governed by the provinces not the feds, even though the rc's are fed police. I think I may have found a way around this, I am going to buy a small, quiet generator that will charge up my unused battery as I ride. I will have two 75Ah battery packs, that can give me a range of 260km at 27kph, which is 10 hours of riding. That is far too slow, so going faster means less over all distance. So going 10kph faster nets me 170km so thats @ 37kph. That is not a bad cruising speed. Gives me 4.5 hours of riding time, and with the generator idea, I can charge one pack up at 16A for the entire pack, or split the pack in two, with 16A each. 75Ah battery pack being charged at 16A is 4.7hrs, so most definately need a 120V 8A or 1kw gen for two charging stations. Pound it out in half the time or 2.3hours.

I think for my needs, it will be perfect.

Keep in mind now that a 1kw generator will be weighing in at 45lbs, and will have a size of roughly 17Lx10Wx15H, which is a bit bulky and heavy, but atleast I can use the generator when camping, whereas buying a motor will be a one time for use riding across Canada. I will literally never ride in my metropolitan city as its just too noisy. I've looked into a used 1kw gen and its only $100 to $150cdn.

My plan then has changed, building a custom trailer to store the generator, tent, tarp, sleeping bag, foam, clothing, stove, propane bottle, utensils, 1 bowl, 1 pot, shades, reading glasses, a book or two, paper, pen, cell, ipod, usb 10Ah charger stick.

I dunno what style of trailer, should I go single wheel, narrow two wheel, regular child carrier style.

Riding on the highways, wider is better. Wide sucks on pedestrian and bicycle pathways as well as single track trails.

My guess is to do a narrow set two wheel for added weight distribution, and have wings that fold out to make it look like a wider trailer then it really is on the highway. I will have to design something and pack accordingly, gotta think air flow for generator first and fore most.

Its too bad they cracked down on gas bicycles, used to be classified as a moped, not our government wants to cash in. What a shame.

To be honest, I'd assume most people doing a gas or electric bicycle setup have lost their license from a dui, dwi or child maintenance. But aint it odd electrics are good, and gas is not. Either way, I found my loop-hole in the system.

 

[fasteddy]

When I first building bikes years ago the first thing I did was spend two weeks finding out just what was legal and what wasn't and if there was anyway around it from both both the Federal and Provincial governments on the computer and with phone calls. I looked at the Federal web sites to see what they said. The feds make the laws and the provinces can adapt them to their particular needs but they can't change the basic rules the Federal Government made. The Federal Government are the ones that make the National Highway Safety Act. The provinces as I said implement it to fit their needs.

When I was looking around I found out that at one time electric bikes were illegal and gas bikes weren't. The electric bike importers of course lobbied to have them made legal and the government had their safety lab in Quebec compare gas vs electric bikes. Then there were the groups consulted. The spandex racer crowd of course had all their clubs start a letter campaign against both the bikes because it ruined the purity of bicycling. There were no motorized bike clubs so there was no input. The electric bike importers had lobbyists running up and down the halls of the Parliament Building touting the clean air and fat envelops.

Now the s**t hits the fan big time. Ford motors is at the time building the Think electric cars (Fancy golf carts) and electric bikes so they are in on making sure the resulting legislation is favorable to them. They both failed miserably but by then it was to late.Then our own Insurance Corporation of British Columbia better known as I.C.B.C. as well as many other unprintable names is in to protect their interests. The Provincial Government of B.C. is self insuring. We buy insurance from the province as well as vehicle plates and stickers through private sellers or government outlets. Of course they also enforce the highway laws so your getting it coming and going. They want to influence the new laws so they have control of what comes about. It doesn't matter that this affects the entire country not just B.C.

The report from the lab is that homemade motorized bicycles would be to hard to regulate and they would pollute the air where as the electric bike wouldn't. Now the spandex crowd is in full howl and want the European limit of 200w imposed and people would have to pedal to use the motor. The feds decided to make it 500w to encourage people to use it as alternative local transportation. Thus we have the crappy electric scooters with the useless pedals since the electric bikes have to be usable as a regular bicycle at all times how ever marginal that use is. The people who took the pedals off were being busted for not having them.

Now the bad news for your generator plans. The law says that you can have a generator on a trailer behind your bike. However it cannot be running if the bike is being ridden. Now I spent a large part of my gloriously misspent youth poking angry bears in the backside with a short sharp stick. I turned it into a science according to a lot of people.

I'll explain how I would do it. I would have a fairly wide trailer (3') with 20" wheels with 20mm front hubs These will fit a 3/4" axle with a single wrap of pop can to make up the slight difference. Square steel frame welded up with square steel uprights. Their height doesn't matter but I'd have a second square steel frame welded just high enough to clear the generator. Then a plywood floor with an access door cut in it to get to the spark plug. This is where you pile your camping gear. Oil drain and exhaust would exit through the floor. If the cop want's to get down on their hands and knees to look they're more keen that most of the ones I met over the years. Oil filler would have to be easy to get to. Drop tail gate on the bottom rear of the trailer to get to the generator and battery and any supplies stored there.
A large sized gas tank and filler could be hidden somewhere as well and camouflaged. Maybe a propane fueled generator? No muss and no fuss and above all no gas fumes to explain.
I would have two arms each coming from a corner of the trailer and meeting in the middle in a V shape to add stability and spread the weight.

I would cover the outside of the trailer with a fine expanded metal so there is lot's of air flow over the generator but it would be hard to distinguish the outline of the generator. Generator painted a dark colour would help. Of course there would be a number of bungee cords holding the tarp over the camping gear to help with this even if I had to add grommets to the tarp.

Generator would be a small portable unit quiet running unit with electric start and 1,000 to 2,00w. Look on YouTube to see what other people used when they were in a campground. Just under the seat I would have a kill switch so it can't be seen. Starter button could be under there as well but you'd need to hide the wires really well. Blinking bicycle strobe light would protect you and take away a reason for you to be stopped. Two might be better with one on the trailer and one on a pole. If your surprised by one of the local constabulary you can kill the motor and do the innocent, hang dog thing if he hears it cooling off or hears it period. I just stopped to charge the battery and just started off after shutting it down. Helps if you were pedaling at the time. I'd pedal off and start it when they were out of sight. That's my take on it anyway

Remember nothing truly becomes illegal until they catch you doing it.

Steve.

 

[JerryAssburger]

When I first building bikes years ago the first thing I did was spend two weeks finding out just what was legal and what wasn't and if there was anyway around it from both both the Federal and Provincial governments on the computer and with phone calls. I looked at the Federal web sites to see what they said. The feds make the laws and the provinces can adapt them to their particular needs but they can't change the basic rules the Federal Government made. The Federal Government are the ones that make the National Highway Safety Act. The provinces as I said implement it to fit their needs.

When I was looking around I found out that at one time electric bikes were illegal and gas bikes weren't. The electric bike importers of course lobbied to have them made legal and the government had their safety lab in Quebec compare gas vs electric bikes. Then there were the groups consulted. The spandex racer crowd of course had all their clubs start a letter campaign against both the bikes because it ruined the purity of bicycling. There were no motorized bike clubs so there was no input. The electric bike importers had lobbyists running up and down the halls of the Parliament Building touting the clean air and fat envelops.

Now the s**t hits the fan big time. Ford motors is at the time building the Think electric cars (Fancy golf carts) and electric bikes so they are in on making sure the resulting legislation is favorable to them. They both failed miserably but by then it was to late.Then our own Insurance Corporation of British Columbia better known as I.C.B.C. as well as many other unprintable names is in to protect their interests. The Provincial Government of B.C. is self insuring. We buy insurance from the province as well as vehicle plates and stickers through private sellers or government outlets. Of course they also enforce the highway laws so your getting it coming and going. They want to influence the new laws so they have control of what comes about. It doesn't matter that this affects the entire country not just B.C.

The report from the lab is that homemade motorized bicycles would be to hard to regulate and they would pollute the air where as the electric bike wouldn't. Now the spandex crowd is in full howl and want the European limit of 200w imposed and people would have to pedal to use the motor. The feds decided to make it 500w to encourage people to use it as alternative local transportation. Thus we have the crappy electric scooters with the useless pedals since the electric bikes have to be usable as a regular bicycle at all times how ever marginal that use is. The people who took the pedals off were being busted for not having them.

Now the bad news for your generator plans. The law says that you can have a generator on a trailer behind your bike. However it cannot be running if the bike is being ridden. Now I spent a large part of my gloriously misspent youth poking angry bears in the backside with a short sharp stick. I turned it into a science according to a lot of people.

I'll explain how I would do it. I would have a fairly wide trailer (3') with 20" wheels with 20mm front hubs These will fit a 3/4" axle with a single wrap of pop can to make up the slight difference. Square steel frame welded up with square steel uprights. Their height doesn't matter but I'd have a second square steel frame welded just high enough to clear the generator. Then a plywood floor with an access door cut in it to get to the spark plug. This is where you pile your camping gear. Oil drain and exhaust would exit through the floor. If the cop want's to get down on their hands and knees to look they're more keen that most of the ones I met over the years. Oil filler would have to be easy to get to. Drop tail gate on the bottom rear of the trailer to get to the generator and battery and any supplies stored there.
A large sized gas tank and filler could be hidden somewhere as well and camouflaged. Maybe a propane fueled generator? No muss and no fuss and above all no gas fumes to explain.
I would have two arms each coming from a corner of the trailer and meeting in the middle in a V shape to add stability and spread the weight.

I would cover the outside of the trailer with a fine expanded metal so there is lot's of air flow over the generator but it would be hard to distinguish the outline of the generator. Generator painted a dark colour would help. Of course there would be a number of bungee cords holding the tarp over the camping gear to help with this even if I had to add grommets to the tarp.

Generator would be a small portable unit quiet running unit with electric start and 1,000 to 2,00w. Look on YouTube to see what other people used when they were in a campground. Just under the seat I would have a kill switch so it can't be seen. Starter button could be under there as well but you'd need to hide the wires really well. Blinking bicycle strobe light would protect you and take away a reason for you to be stopped. Two might be better with one on the trailer and one on a pole. If your surprised by one of the local constabulary you can kill the motor and do the innocent, hang dog thing if he hears it cooling off or hears it period. I just stopped to charge the battery and just started off after shutting it down. Helps if you were pedaling at the time. I'd pedal off and start it when they were out of sight. That's my take on it anyway

Remember nothing truly becomes illegal until they catch you doing it.

Steve.

Great thinking!
It's funny (in a sad way) that a person has to perform these sorts of gymnastics to have powered bike that isn't much faster than a physically-fit person can pedal one of these things. The key point behind powered bicycles are, that most any of us can wail away on the pedals and get up to 25mph, but not for long without risk of a heart-attack and/or crapping ourselves. The majority of powered bikes don't offer additional performance, but additional range. What's the legal/safety down-side to that? I understand if some squid is speeding and disobeying traffic laws (nail 'em to the wall), but many regular bicyclists do that, without the aid of a motor.
Sorry about the rant. My BS Detector has been really sensitive lately.

 

[Larry Trotter]

I think the effort will likely end badly with multiple violations of vehicle rules. You will definitely need to be 100% legal because you can bet in the distance you are talking about you will be stopping multiple times.
In the US there’s likely a legal route from the Canadian border to Mexico with a 50cc bike and likely you could sneak by with a 70cc as long as it’s a China girl type.
Probably Montana Utah Arizona I know Montana and Arizona are legal. Trying to trick a bunch of Mounties likely won’t get you far. That would be quite an adventure.