Sartori, DYI eBike kit.

biknut

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I wonder how this kit would hold up? It looks pretty easy to install. The company seems to still be in business so I guess it must work ok, it's not cheap either. I'm not into mid drive myself, but I like that it looks easy enough for even a nube to install on almost any bike.

 
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biknut

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When I look at it without knowing anything about it, it looks like it could be a high quality kit, or it could be one of the biggest piles of crap ever craped. :(
 
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indian22

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I wonder how this kit would hold up? It looks pretty easy to install. The company seems to still be in business so I guess it must work ok, it's not cheap either. I'm not into mid drive myself, but I like that it looks easy enough for even a nube to install on almost any bike.

Bikenut I'll preface my comment with a statement of fact. I'm a newcomer to e-bikes though I own four and built three. That said mid-drives are fine but the hype is pure marketing. I think they look fine, but don't see them any more or less attractive than wheel hubs as a design selling point, if they produced more power I'd be impressed but they don't, if less expensive relative to power I'd be impressed but they cost a lot more. If they are higher quality and deserving of the price differential I've seen only superlatives not as a result of objective testing by qualified & uninvolved third party labs.
Pretty marketing in words and photos are nice yet drive up the price. Mid-drives made in China are somehow better in quality than hubs made in the same country. Low center of gravity sounds really impressive as does "central weight distribution" to a dedicated racer, but the average e-rider shouldn't give a crap about let alone pay for something so silly.

Hubs ride low and you if want better balance add batteries up front. Have a front hub run the batteries on back. If you want to really lower the center of gravity and offset the added weight of all e-bike components; it's cheap but not so easy to do, just lose 30 or 40 lbs. off your mid-section and lay off those gummy bears. Don't want to drop your body weight the old fashion way then buy a dropper post to lower center of gravity in corners and raise the post for correct leg extension pedaling on the straights. If the mid-drive was easier to install than e-hubs I'd think that swell but they aren't and they still cost far too much. My last thought; if you break a chain on the mid-drive you paid a lot extra for the right of pushing her home. You can admire the so called elegant look as you lose weight pushing her home. Bottom line they aren't all that!

I still enjoy the beautiful builds using mid-drives.

Rick C.
 

biknut

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Sep 28, 2010
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Bikenut I'll preface my comment with a statement of fact. I'm a newcomer to e-bikes though I own four and built three. That said mid-drives are fine but the hype is pure marketing. I think they look fine, but don't see them any more or less attractive than wheel hubs as a design selling point, if they produced more power I'd be impressed but they don't, if less expensive relative to power I'd be impressed but they cost a lot more. If they are higher quality and deserving of the price differential I've seen only superlatives not as a result of objective testing by qualified & uninvolved third party labs.
Pretty marketing in words and photos are nice yet drive up the price. Mid-drives made in China are somehow better in quality than hubs made in the same country. Low center of gravity sounds really impressive as does "central weight distribution" to a dedicated racer, but the average e-rider shouldn't give a crap about let alone pay for something so silly.

Hubs ride low and you if want better balance add batteries up front. Have a front hub run the batteries on back. If you want to really lower the center of gravity and offset the added weight of all e-bike components; it's cheap but not so easy to do, just lose 30 or 40 lbs. off your mid-section and lay off those gummy bears. Don't want to drop your body weight the old fashion way then buy a dropper post to lower center of gravity in corners and raise the post for correct leg extension pedaling on the straights. If the mid-drive was easier to install than e-hubs I'd think that swell but they aren't and they still cost far too much. My last thought; if you break a chain on the mid-drive you paid a lot extra for the right of pushing her home. You can admire the so called elegant look as you lose weight pushing her home. Bottom line they aren't all that!

I still enjoy the beautiful builds using mid-drives.

Rick C.
Yep, that's how I feel about them too, except I like them even less. You have a good grasp of their weaknesses though. That being said, bikes with narrow drop outs are a little better suited for a mid drive, and that's about the only time I would consider one.

I decommissioned Stunner a few years ago after losing interest in gas bikes. I've been thinking about electrifying it someday, and mid drive is probably going to work best on it because of that.
 
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indian22

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Yes that's reason, fair enough, but if I was faced with that situation I'd probably opt for a wider frame or fork and use the money I saved on more motor, battery or both, heh,heh! Nothing wrong with having a skinny extra pedal bike about just for the exercise

Rick C.
 

indian22

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Not going to happen lol
What are your thoughts Bike nut on running a 2000 watt 48v. motor using 60 volts through a 72 volt 80 amp controller? My intentions are to use it for quick bursts of power not for prolonged use on hills or cruising...mainly to get out of harms way power. It's a 4,500 rpm brushless that I'd be bumping to 5,625 that's a 25% increase. Too much?

I'm not against going 72 volt with a 3,000 watt and 100 amp controller, just looking at options to bump motor speed.

Rick C.
 
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biknut

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What are your thoughts Bike nut on running a 2000 watt 48v. motor using 60 volts through a 72 volt 80 amp controller? My intentions are to use it for quick bursts of power not for prolonged use on hills or cruising...mainly to get out of harms way power. It's a 4,500 rpm brushless that I'd be bumping to 5,625 that's a 25% increase. Too much?

I'm not against going 72 volt with a 3,000 watt and 100 amp controller, just looking at options to bump motor speed.

Rick C.
60v with a 80 amp controller should be fine. Keep on mind you don't need to go much bigger on the controller than the battery bms can handle, but that doesn't hurt anything.

My Stealth is 72v and has a 80 amp bms with 200 amp burst, but my controller is only 65 amp. The battery is not stressed.

My fatty is 48v and has a 30 amp bms with 80 amp burst, but my controller is 35 amp. It gets away with that because the motor will only pull about 29 or 30 amps at top speed, but the battery is pretty much maxed out. I have the computer set to knock down the max power a little bit.
 
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indian22

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60v with a 80 amp controller should be fine. Keep on mind you don't need to go much bigger on the controller than the battery bms can handle, but that doesn't hurt anything.

My Stealth is 72v and has a 80 amp bms with 200 amp burst, but my controller is only 65 amp. The battery is not stressed.

My fatty is 48v and has a 30 amp bms with 80 amp burst, but my controller is 35 amp. It gets away with that because the motor will only pull about 29 or 30 amps at top speed, but the battery is pretty much maxed out. I have the computer set to knock down the max power a little bit.
Thanks I've got a 60v. 70amp controller I now think I'll go with. If I'm understanding correctly;I think 60 amps for the bms on the 60v. battery pack? Let me know if 60 amp bms isn't enough.

Rick C.
 

biknut

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Thanks I've got a 60v. 70amp controller I now think I'll go with. If I'm understanding correctly;I think 60 amps for the bms on the 60v. battery pack? Let me know if 60 amp bms isn't enough.

Rick C.
I think 60 amps would be plenty for a 2000w motor.
 
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indian22

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I think 60 amps would be plenty for a 2000w motor.
Thanks for your input, think now all I'll need is the 60v. 20 amp pack with the appropriate 60 amp bms. Is one of my cold weather projects that I'm collecting bits for.

Rick C.
 

indian22

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Learning as I build and ride the electrics Bikenut. There's much information available, but often I'm leery of the source providing it. Many experts it seems, some selling product or providing paid endorsements etc. It's good to get feedback from a builder/rider with experience on higher powered components and one who rides frequently. I appreciate your input & know it's solid.

I'm really not adverse to toasting motors or controllers along the way to improve my understanding of the way things work, but it's more convenient to let others do that first and learn from their mistakes as I have on the many & varied ICE motors I've modified/re-built & I still destroyed some while racing long ago. Four stroke, two stroke, expensive or not, Chinese, Japanese, German or U.S. all same-same to me. If I put them together correctly they work great. When they don't my work sucks & I'm at fault the large majority of the time!

So when I ask for advice it's to learn things & not find reasons why that advice is somehow flawed before I even try it. So if you see I'm in error with the e-motors let me know and I'll appreciate you for it.

Rick C.
 
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