PK80 Motor Clutch will not Disengage

[Nghtrider62]

Hello all,
It's been a a while since I visited the site, I usually visit Motorized Bikes on Facebook. Well I've had a problem since the start with the clutch not willing to give.
I was refered to http://motorbicycling.com/showthread.php?t=22729
And it didn't help with my questions/answers. plainly my clutch refuses to let go. I followed everything they said to do and it didn't work.
I have tried spinning the back wheel with the engine engaged as Suggested by Don Bovitz Motorized bikes on Facebook, I've tried pushing down on the 2 studs as described by KCvale, that didn't work.
I've tried the hammer trick on the studs in the clockwise manner to break it free, that didn't work.
I have a brand new engine that I can't use and it's pissed me off to no ends.
I have a over worked PK80 with a Angel Cortez head, And a port and polish cylinder, & a Yz80 Muffler, strapped to a SBP HD Shift kit and a Will Kidd lighting system and about $$ 1,200 more accessories. and my bike won't go.
The clutch just will not let go.
Thoughts ?

 

[crassius]

first thing is to look to see if the outer plate comes out freely when the lever is pulled

if not, then there is something wrong with the way the clutch arm is pushing the rod in the center of the shaft

if it does move out and tapping with the hammer didn't free it, take that outer plate off and pull all 15 pads out to see it it turns freely then

if it does, clean the pads in gas or carb cleaner, dry them and reassemble - it should now work

if it won't turn with the pads out, you have a bad clutch hub bearing

 

[Nghtrider62]

As you can see with the photo's With the bar all the way next to the cable guide the clutch will not disengage, I've had all the pads out completely and restored them into the plate there not greasy at all still new. I double checked to see if the ball was still there it is.
Everything turns hold the back wheel still and pull in the clutch nothing, everything still turns. Clutch will not let go. Outer plate is almost ready to fall off, Finger tight with 1 full turn to back off and apply set screw. I can move the outer plate almost 1/4" away from the pads, But the clutch will not let go. It's still stuck in gear.

if it won't turn with the pads out, you have a bad clutch hub bearing ......

OK So How do I go about fixing that?
(grrrrrrrrr )

 

[crassius]

If you're smart, you don't - best is to get a new one. I rebuilt one once to see what kind if job it was, and it was way too hard to do even with my bearing press and other tools. I've seen them new and pre-assembled for $15 and just a quick search shows several for $20 with new pads included too.

If this is a new motor, you might want to have seller just send you one.

 

[Nghtrider62]

Crassius I'm sure you've never been to facebook before, It's a Cheezy PK80 motor bought back in Feb this year as a soft build for 125.00 shipped.
It's a Bekits soft build PK80, Well I'm going to try to adjust the tension on the bucking bar to see it this will release or not. I've been told to try to get some grease into the bearings behind the 3 pin plate I guess I will take 1 suggestion at a time until everything has been tried before I buy a separate case and start over.
Thanks for the Suggestions. It All helps

 

[crassius]

first thing would be to take clutch off and just look at it - I used to grease them very lightly, but too much will ruin pads as it spins out

looking at the backside, one sees three holes where one can hold a nut packed with grease tight against to metal while slowly screwing a bolt into the nut forcing a bit of grease into the hole - just get a tiny bit in, turn the hub a bit and get a tiny bit more in till you've gone all the way around - BUT this requires the bearing to be free to spin & yours is probably locked up

note, if outer plate moves, bucking bar is working

 

[Nghtrider62]

Outer plate does move, And with the few pics you can see there is no grease on the back plate. 1st pic shows No pads in the clutch, clutch bar all the way to the front right case, Still can not find a neutral, it will not disengage.
I went threw the top hole and backed the spring 2 full turns which allows the front plate to be barely mounted with flower nut. It still would not break free.
I've been discussing this with several other groups and other people & Josh Moon of Facebook has offered to ship me his gear puller and the rest of the clutch parts to take mine out and replace with a working model.
I will pay the postage on the return of his gear puller and my parts so he can play with them and figure it out what happened.
I'll post pics of the parts I pull.

 

[crassius]

don't make this too complicated

if, with no pads in the clutch, the bike will not roll freely without turning the motor, then the clutch hub is locked up AT THE BEARING - nothing in the shaft has any effect on that

the large gear has no solid connection to the shaft except thru the pads pushing against the plate, no pads, no push - only the balls in the bearing could be pushing it with no pads

 

[Nghtrider62]

Thank you, It's only my 2nd build.
My 1st was stolen 2 yrs ago.
This one has been a long time building and planning, But I Didn't for see all the problems that came from this engine.
Project Started on Nov 18 2015, That's when I was able to afford a Motobecane Mountain bike Which is the basis of my project. With it's Hydroformed downtube and All Aluminum frame.
And I'm not that experienced in these engine yet, But I have looked at several you-tube videos trying to diagnose the problem as well.
Plus the 9-11 different Motorised bike groups on Facebook.

 

[Nghtrider62]

Well now Everyone can See what the problem is, Someone in the Factory pounded the woodruff key from the clutch basket out the back and into the bearing behind it. The woodruff key is hard against the shaft and the bearing

 

[crassius]

until you remove clutch from shaft, you won't find where the problem is - I doubt that key is locking anything up

 

[Nghtrider62]

Apparently you decided not to read my post, Or ignored it. I don't know. But the woodruff key is smashed into the bearing preventing the bearing from turning freely when the shaft turns the basket and the bearing turn with the shaft as 1, And Not independently like there supposed to.
That was the Problem, preventing anything on the shaft to work correctly.
I will hold this for Joe if he wants it, from Be-Kits. otherwise I'll send it and the puller back to Josh Moon. Since Josh Supplied me with the back up parts needed, and a tool.

 

[crassius]

not understanding what you're saying - the inner hub of the clutch is supposed to turn with the shaft - only the outer gear should be free spinning

the sealed bearing behind the key allows the shaft to turn and if it is locked up, then either nothing turns or the bearing spins in the case

 

[Nghtrider62]

UPDATE: I sent the Shaft to Josh Moon, A friend that has years with these motors. In his words : deformed woodruff key from being pressed into bearing race.
Yes as you can tell the Bekits motor, The woodruff key was pressed into the backside of the clutch basket and into the bearing race preventing the clutch basket from disengaging. Preventing the shaft from turn freely.
Not a easy Diagnose or Fix for a Amateur with out all the tools.
Thanks Josh Moon for the Support and help.

 

[Nghtrider62]

I have already upgraded the clutch plate and Added Red Racing Pads, Because of the Extra Torq. I will have. Hoping to get this to the Motorcycle shop with in this week to get the YZ 80 muffler & Fred's Fire Breather Header on.
I wanna Ride.
The wires hanging down are from Will Kidd's Lighting System that I am installing.
Waiting on a tank ( 5L Motou-Cruzaar, Coming from Puerto Rico) My 4L tank's petcock was on the wrong side and Interfered with Muffler and mount. Working on Saddle bag Mounts to add the battery & vibration/sound/lights alarm ( alarm has it's own sirn plus it hooks into Will Kidd's Lighting/Horn and it makes a dual tone alarm.
The saddle bags will be wired into Wills lights and be used as running lights.

I'm painting the Bike "Black and Blue" in Support of **Back from H3ll** Clean & Sober MC Shasta County, California I currently Have 14 yrs clean From Meth.