Need help converting to all belt drive.

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Velodrome

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May 27, 2011
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Watching carefully. I have a good 4G im seriously thinking bout changing to belt. Best of luck. Have you spun the wheel with the sheive on it to see if the sheive is centered? I messed with mine on the Twin build for three or four DAYS and finally took it to a wheel builder who had a trueing stand... Took him bout 20 min and done. Perfectly centered... :-||
 

Keeponkeepnon

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There's a little wobble in the sheave, definitely not 100% perfect. I figure its little enough that a spring loaded tensioner will not have a problem dealing with it.
 

MEASURE TWICE

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I got a can of the CRC brand belt conditioner spray at O'riely Auto Parts. I'll just keep it on hand and only use it after first just sanding and using acetone to clean off the metal dust. I’m not sure if the idea is to rough up the pulley inside surface or make it smoother, but in any case having anything that is a lubricant on the pulley or belt seems bad. I can buy another belt for about 10 to 15 dollars a belt if the belt dressing makes it any worse.

I don't know of the other stuff that can be safely applied to v-belts. This CRC belt conditioner stuff says it stops squeaks and make the belts grab better.

For the cheap Chinese Sheave you bought, did you have to buy from out of the country or is there a distributor that is a go between?

I may like to build another motor bike one day and my washing machine pulley along with wood sandwich clamp on the spokes was a lot of work. Buying an already made one may be the way I could go later on.

The covers on right and left side of my engine are removable, but one side the welding though strong has a look not really desired. One part has a perforated metal over solid sheet metal. The resin I would hope gets a good adherence to that and other areas I’ll rough up with a wire wheel.

Belts are very much less likely to have a problem than a chain if pulley is a bit untrue. They actually use them with a half twist on the underside of the vertical shaft self propelled mower I grabbed from the trash. This is where a 6.5 hp 4 stroke engine with a gear box to slow the speed a little before it goes to that belt with the half twist is used. That gives you an idea how belts can in ways be more versatile than a chain. The flat belts of olden days an maybe even today may have a better life span with the twist in them than the v-belts and some motor bike builder spoke of them here.

I'm finishing my Fish Art Cover for my parade motor bike mutant vehicle, but some day for the other motor from the lawn mower I want to make a hovercraft. Some use two motors, but ducting and some venting forward thrust can be done by using a single engine.

MT
 
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Keeponkeepnon

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You want to rough up the inside of the pulley, you could do the belt as well for that matter. Good call on the belt dressing, probably won't need to do anything but that.

The sheave came from "Whizzer Paul", who is an Ebay dealer in the USA. It was $52 including shipping. If it saves more than a couple hours work then I'd say it is well worth it.
 

MEASURE TWICE

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http://motorbicycling.com/showthread.php?t=29678&page=13 Post 123 describes my used of fine grit sandpapering some of the pulleys without paint on them.

Also the use of the Belt Conditioner Spray.

I had quite a difference in acceleration. A lurch with the twist of the throttle and a little of the front tire un-weight or slightly off the ground with the 40:1 ratio. I'll be sure to put a limit on the throttle when the art fish cover is on it or you could say the fish would be jumping.

MT
 

Velodrome

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Keepon. Have you measured the shaft the output pulley is going on and do you have a source for that diameter shaft pulley?
 

MEASURE TWICE

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Just a thought, if one of these would be useful. I got I think this one for my 5/8 jackshaft and the pulley is adjustable. Increments of one side of the pulley wall can rotate half turns.

It changes how high or low in the groove the belt sits and sets the diameter.

After I think about 4 or 5 turns (ie 10 half truns) don't remember exactly with the one I got, you adjust the diameter of the pulley from 3.2" to 4" and the outer diameter clearance is always 4" though.

There are smaller ones that adjust as well at Grainger.

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/CONGRESS-VBelt-Pulley-3LC28?Pid=search

MT
 
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Keeponkeepnon

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I have measured the output shaft on the 4g and of course it is not a nice easy 5/8". For all you guys who all ready have a 4G and your chain sprocket is where you want your pulley to be, our builds will be a little different. My pulley needs to be as close as possible to the trasmission housing and even then I might have to offset the whole motor a little to get the pulley lined up with the rear sheave. I don't know if my motor case is different or what. The part of the output shaft that I will be putting the pulley on is just under 5/8", the part where the one way sprocket is mounted is much smaller. I will have to do a little build up with Jb weld and then sand back down to 5/8". One good side effect of where I am placing the pulley on the shaft is there will be a lot less stress on the shaft than way out there where the stock sprocket is.

McMaster-Carr has a ton of pulleys and belts available and mine was shipped immediately. I got the 3.5" OD with a 5/8" bore, which is keyed + set screw. The thing is built like a tank, made for serious factory work. It is very heavy cast iron, I would prefer aluminum but at least I don't need to worry about it ever giving up on me.

The adjustable pulleys are a neat idea but a lot more expensive. At this point I am trying to fit the largest possible pulley in there so being able to adjust it smaller didn't seem like an advantage worth paying for.

The bike is being put on hold for a few weeks. My mom is getting older and crashed her car into a tree for no apparent reason. She's fine but the car needs a ton of work. The insurance company totalled it but since it only has 22k miles I bought it back from them to repair. I will be replacing the whole front bumper, hood, fender, headlight, maybe radiator and getting all the mounting points bent back into place... frame looks good and i was able to drive it back to my place with no weirdness in the drivetrain. On the other hand I could get the bike fixed up and let mom ride that, at least she won't kill anybody if she crashes into them.
 
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Velodrome

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Well. I took my 4G and new Granger cast iron pulley to a machienist today. Nice guy. But his plan for making the trans and pulley live togather consisted of about 10 machining steps and $100 :eek: SOOOOooo. Off to Ace Hwd for plan B. I bought a 5/8 heavy steel spacer. Drilled it out to the diameter of the small stepped bit of the shaft. 27/64 ths bit worked well. For the machiensts in the audience. Turn away now and DONT look at the pictures... To cut a keyway for the pulley I used my Dremel and a cutoff wheel to carefully carve away the offending metal. I previously marked the bit to be removed with a sharpy. Great care must be taken and bracing yourself helps alot to keep the cut nice and streight. Those who have ever worked clay on a Throwing wheel know of what I speak. Next came the inner keyway for the tiny key in the skinny part of the shaft. For this I chose a carbide carving bit
 

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Velodrome

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I rotated the part 180 deg from the outer keyway and aligned as best I could and shaved away an apropriate amount of steel. the grouve was rounded however at the edges, so I swithced to a pointed carbide bit for making the keyway more squarelike ( new word ) :) The walls of the spacer were too thin at this point to allow an unmodified keystock so I took it to the bench grinder and shaved it down on one side by about 35-40%
 

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Velodrome

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The inner keyway for the key on the skinny part of the shaft does not go all the way to the other side. So its kind of a captured key. The thing seemed to to togather quite well and and despite some thin parts I think its more than up to the task of managing the massive HP and torque fo the Mighty HS 49cc And it cost me $3 instead of $100 If it fails I'll hang my head and pay the man to do it properly, but Im thinkng this will work!
 

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Keeponkeepnon

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Nice, I feel like I'm working on my bike even though I am not. Getting that sleeve just right looks like a real PITA. How do you plan to keep the sleeve from spinning on the shaft? A tack weld or JBweld would probably be plenty strong. Are you using a 3.5" OD pulley? That's what I have and it looks like the maximum that will fit. Good thinking, Nice work.
 
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MEASURE TWICE

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FYI, I found that when using the Dremel cut off wheels, I stop using them at various levels of wear when I am cutting.

This allows me to have a couple of different diameter sizes so they fit where they otherwise would not. I intend to use them not so much as cutters when they are worn smaller diameter but as shapers. The solid grinders have too much surface area to shape quickly in a small area I have found usually.

It has helped me out many times over. I have to switch wheels, but they seem to allow carving more smooth than the metal cutter.

I know the metal cutters have there use, but I am partial to those grinder wheels even though they wear way faster.

MT
 
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Velodrome

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May 27, 2011
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Nice, I feel like I'm working on my bike even though I am not. Getting that sleeve just right looks like a real PITA. How do you plan to keep the sleeve from spinning on the shaft? A tack weld or JBweld would probably be plenty strong. Are you using a 3.5" OD pulley? That's what I have and it looks like the maximum that will fit. Good thinking, Nice work.
Its a 2.7" hopefully the inner key will be strong enough to keep the sleeve from spinning on the shaft. If not I'll Have it braised on or welded.