High compression head

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Larry Trotter

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Nov 26, 2017
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Interesting experiment for sure. I really doubt that anything you do with the head will solve the 4 stroking problem however. Likely you just have to lean out the mixture a little more than you have now. If the needle is set to the lowest point you likely need a smaller jet in the bottom of the tube.
 
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Chris7420

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Jul 23, 2021
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Interesting experiment for sure. I really doubt that anything you do with the head will solve the 4 stroking problem however. Likely you just have to lean out the mixture a little more than you have now. If the needle is set to the lowest point you likely need a smaller jet in the bottom of the tube.
Should I deck the cylinder and adjust the squish? Isn’t it too big sense it didn’t even touch the solder? Also I currently have the needle clip at the second from top position I’ve tried the top position and it makes the spark plug kinda white so I think it’s too lean. I’ve never tried changing the jet though.
 

Larry Trotter

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Nov 26, 2017
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Not really sure you will gain anything by doing that. My general advice would be to modify the cheapest part that gets the results you want. In this case it’s the head. A thinner base gasket will also get you a higher compression ratio.
 

Chris7420

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Not really sure you will gain anything by doing that. My general advice would be to modify the cheapest part that gets the results you want. In this case it’s the head. A thinner base gasket will also get you a higher compression ratio.
Wouldn’t it increase the compression? The head is more expensive then a new cylinder and I actually have a spare cylinder already that’s why I was thinking of decking the cylinder and not the head, if I deck the cylinder where it mates with the head I’ll get the same results won’t I?
 

Tyler6357

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Mar 15, 2012
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Chris:
If you are going to try to deck your cylinder, and assuming you don't have access to a mill, you can try the sandpaper method. These are the grits that I used for mine:
120 grit
300/400 grit
600 grit
1200 grit

Get large pieces. Next I taped the 120 piece to a piece of glass and set it on a flat table. Holding the head upside down, I placed it flat on the first piece of sandpaper and slowly and evenly started to sand in a figure 8 configuration. After making about 10 figure 8's, I rotated the head in my hand 45 degrees and did 10 more figure 8's, I did the same for each side. Then I switched to the lighter grit and did the same, then switched to the lighter grid, did the same until I finished all the grits ending with the 1200 grit. Then cleaned the top of the cylinder off of any shavings and put it back on with the head and gasket and did another test. I then removed it and sanded more off using the same method as described above until I got my squish to 0.03". After I did this I noticed about a 3-6 mph increase in top speed and better low end.
 

Larry Trotter

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Nov 26, 2017
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A really good article on squish or more properly quench is here:
https://www.enginelabs.com/engine-t...ormance-squished-between-the-piston-and-head/

Seems in 2 strokes that the hemisphere combustion chambers and well mixed fuel and air reduces its effects somewhat. There’s a lot of different head designs used on these engines so quench or squish likely has quite different effects on performance. Here’s an example of two different head design used on 66cc China girl engines. Pretty different aren’t they?
 

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Tyler6357

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A really good article on squish or more properly quench is here:
https://www.enginelabs.com/engine-t...ormance-squished-between-the-piston-and-head/

Seems in 2 strokes that the hemisphere combustion chambers and well mixed fuel and air reduces its effects somewhat. There’s a lot of different head designs used on these engines so quench or squish likely has quite different effects on performance. Here’s an example of two different head design used on 66cc China girl engines. Pretty different aren’t they?
That's a good point. I was using an original FredHead which has a volume of 6cc
 

Chris7420

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Jul 23, 2021
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Chris:
If you are going to try to deck your cylinder, and assuming you don't have access to a mill, you can try the sandpaper method. These are the grits that I used for mine:
120 grit
300/400 grit
600 grit
1200 grit

Get large pieces. Next I taped the 120 piece to a piece of glass and set it on a flat table. Holding the head upside down, I placed it flat on the first piece of sandpaper and slowly and evenly started to sand in a figure 8 configuration. After making about 10 figure 8's, I rotated the head in my hand 45 degrees and did 10 more figure 8's, I did the same for each side. Then I switched to the lighter grit and did the same, then switched to the lighter grid, did the same until I finished all the grits ending with the 1200 grit. Then cleaned the top of the cylinder off of any shavings and put it back on with the head and gasket and did another test. I then removed it and sanded more off using the same method as described above until I got my squish to 0.03". After I did this I noticed about a 3-6 mph increase in top speed and better low end.
Okay I did it just like you said I did it once then reassembled and tried to check squish but the solder still didn’t contact the head so I sanded a bit more and checked again and still barely contacted, the piston didn’t stop like when I did it without the head gasket. Should the piston stop when im closer to the proper squish? Does this just mean I still have a bit more to go? I’m scared to overdue it so I didn’t do that much.
 
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Tyler6357

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Mar 15, 2012
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Okay I did it just like you said I did it once then reassembled and tried to check squish but the solder still didn’t contact the head so I sanded a bit more and checked again and still barely contacted, the piston didn’t stop like when I did it without the head gasket. Should the piston stop when im closer to the proper squish? Does this just mean I still have a bit more to go? I’m scared to overdue it so I was going slow.
Damn, are you sure you don't have 2 base gaskets on there? This sounds kinda strange, are you certain you have a fat enough piece of solder? Basically what I did was cut two small strips of solder about 1" long. Gave them a slight bend so they match the contour of the top of your piston. Next, remove the head and use some heavy grease to stick the two bent 1" pieces of solder on the top of the piston so that they bisect the piston down the middle. Placement is important! They must be directly in-line with the piston wrist pin, and they must sit on opposite sides of the piston, so that one end of the solder piece goes right to the edge of the cylinder. Also, take your spark plug out, you don't want compression. Turn the back wheel to crush it down. I wouldn't sand anymore on your cylinder until you know what the current gap is.
 

Chris7420

Member
Jul 23, 2021
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Yea
Damn, are you sure you don't have 2 base gaskets on there? This sounds kinda strange, are you certain you have a fat enough piece of solder? Basically what I did was cut two small strips of solder about 1" long. Gave them a slight bend so they match the contour of the top of your piston. Next, remove the head and use some heavy grease to stick the two bent 1" pieces of solder on the top of the piston so that they bisect the piston down the middle. Placement is important! They must be directly in-line with the piston wrist pin, and they must sit on opposite sides of the piston, so that one end of the solder piece goes right to the edge of the cylinder. Also, take your spark plug out, you don't want compression. Turn the back wheel to crush it down. I wouldn't sand anymore on your cylinder until you know what the current gap is.
Yes I do actually have 2 base gaskets. My engine came with 2. If by base gasket you mean the ones between the cylinder/crankcase.
 
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Lone Wolf

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Jul 28, 2021
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Yea

Yes I do actually have 2 base gaskets. My engine came with 2
I think two base gaskets is probably part of your problem. I would remove one and do the squish again. I also noticed something in your original post that I didn't notice before. I would put the baffle back in your exhaust. Unless you have a highly modified engine, removing the baffles will do more harm than help. Your engine needs the back pressure to run properly.
 
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Chris7420

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I think two base gaskets is probably part of your problem. I would remove one and do the squish again. I also noticed something in your original post that I didn't notice before. I would put the baffle back in your exhaust. Unless you have a highly modified engine, removing the baffles will do more harm than help. Your engine needs the back pressure to run properly.
[/QUOTE
I didn’t know the solder had to be directly Inline with the wrist pin. Maybe that’s the issue too. I’ll try again.
 
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Chris7420

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It's not that necessary, but if you get a high compression head, you are not taking advantage of that if you're squish is too big.
I removed one of the base gaskets and tested squish again making sure this time the solder was in line with the wrist pin it actually stopped the piston this time. I tested it twice my solder originally measures 1.45mm but the squished parts are measuring about 1.30 so does that mean my squish is 0.15mm?
 

Chris7420

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I removed one of the base gaskets and tested squish again making sure this time the solder was in line with the wrist pin it actually stopped the piston this time. I tested it twice my solder originally measures 1.45mm but the squished parts are measuring about 1.30 so does that mean my squish is 0.15mm?
And the goal is 0.03” which is 0.762mm right so I still have a good bit to go?