Velocars and other interesting vehicles.

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silverbear

silverbear

The Boy Who Never Grew Up
Jul 9, 2009
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This is the front axle that will be used for this Grumman Velocar. Fasteddy can better explain how it will be modified to accept moped wheels.

I'm thinking that the front of the canoe body will need to get narrowed up some. Steve is planning to use an Allis Chalmers Model B tractor radiator cowling for his front end. A good choice, I think. Don't know what I'll use. If an Allis like his, then I would need to section it so that it is less tall. And to think I gave away an Allis B with a frozen engine years ago. Maybe Steve will post a photo of his Allis cowling so you know what we're talking about.
SB
 

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happycheapskate

happycheapskate

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Nov 26, 2009
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http://youtu.be/fXIAu2b_rHw?t=10m
Man riding a velomobile to work at 20-30mph, in Brisbane Australia.

Even a small engine would have a large advantage with such a fairing, but noise and heat would be difficult to manage in the design. Perhaps it would be best to incorporate it to drive the rear wheel and sit low. Starting it would also have some difficulties to consider, so maybe an electric start model would be most appropriate. The video uploader says in the commentary that it weighs about 70lb (30kg). Sounds like about the weight of many mabs. The fairing must be heavy, but it cuts the wind so it is a trade off.
 
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silverbear

silverbear

The Boy Who Never Grew Up
Jul 9, 2009
8,325
670
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northeastern Minnesota
Happycheapskate,
I've been thinking about engine cooling and was figuring that something like a flexible dryer vent hose ducted from the radiator cowling and directed onto the engine would suffice. I want something more like a the three wheel Morgan in design and would never think for a moment of driving it in traffic or high speed. A cruise to the local state park through the forest would be so much fun. Woohoo!

There are some interesting videos I linked from the one you gave a link to. Some pretty high tech stuff out there. Electric would be neat I guess, but I like vroom sounds, exhaust pipes, etc.
SB
 
happycheapskate

happycheapskate

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I am interested in building a fabric-faired trike someday, with a 50cc friction or belt drive engine. Something minimalist and very fast. I would use mine as a substitute for a n economy car.
 
rustycase

rustycase

Gutter Rider
May 26, 2011
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IMO, there should not be too much of a problem with enclosed engines.
It's done frequently with the motor scooters.
As long as the motor is not overloaded, fan ducting should handle it.

I always liked the Morgans with the J.A.P. Vtwin on the front!!!

Three wheels will be the best option, to get the best break from the tax collector.
Again, IMO, fabbing a 'super mod' to an early moped would bring the biggest breaks.
Even a 'new construction' motorcycle is forced to comply with current epa standards and dot regulations. Pre-??? can escape much of that.

Personally, I would not have an issue motoring an enclosed three wheeler in traffic.
...If it were fabbed purposefully LARGE and visible.
That's always been a major problem with motorcycles, and bicycles...
No respect!
Inconsiderate automobile operators are unwilling to share space. Period.
They 'might' be more considerate if another vehicle appeared more substantial.
Not exactly something one could count on, but it's a start. lol
We all know about 'assume'. :)

Best
rc
 

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silverbear

silverbear

The Boy Who Never Grew Up
Jul 9, 2009
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northeastern Minnesota
Yes,
Isn't that Morgan something else? That's roughly the look I'd like. No cool motor up front, but the axle up there and rounded grill shroud, body tapering back... so cool.

Fasteddy,
If I were to use one like that for mine I think I'd need to section it so that the grill part was roughly square and not so tall. The cowling would still come down below the body of the canoe. I like the idea of housing the gas tank right there inside the cowling and having the filler cap come out where there would have been a radiator cap. That's a good looking grill. I'm picturing the axle right in front of the grill.
SB
 
silverbear

silverbear

The Boy Who Never Grew Up
Jul 9, 2009
8,325
670
113
northeastern Minnesota
I just did some measuring. I was curious about what we did with the sidecar portion of the donor canoe and we narrowed it to 20" at the stern. It is 12" deep from gunnel to floor For perspective the sidecar is 5 1/2" long. Photos of the sidecar body are below. The velocar section would be 8 1/2' (or shorter) and then add four to six inches for the radiator cowling. The windshield measures 20" wide. The axle is 48" long.

I'm not clear on how we'd do it, but the wide end of the donor section is now 36" and it would seem to me that it would need to be drawn in to about 24" in the area of the cockpit where the driver is seated. So from the narrow end it would taper to 24" (or thereabouts... no less than 22")and then if it could again taper from the cockpit to the radiator cowling to 18" then the Allis front end would work.

It seems to me the 48" axle and roughly 8' to 8 1/2' wheelbase would be pretty stable for riding.

Just thinking... you're welcome to think with me.
SB
 

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fasteddy

Well-Known Member
Feb 13, 2009
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Silverbear,
The grill was a surprisingly cheap. $21.50 and he parts out tractors in Iowa on a regular basis. The shipping and handling to get it here however was $50. Still a bargain in my books.
It was on ebay under tractor grills. The more popular ones bring some pretty fancy money. Mention John Deere and strap you and your wallet in before the rocket takes off.
The guy I bought it from is called Daveysalvage.

I think that 24" is the best width for the frame. We can cut the keel out of it as far back as the rear cockpit and trim the bottom of the canoe so we can pull it into shape. It will need a wood frame to set the body on so once that is done we will be able to shape the body to fit.
I'm sure it will need to have a strip added to the bottom of the body to the frame but we can do that as we go along. A strip will need to be riveted along the center of the body to hold the two halves together as well.

Steve.
 
happycheapskate

happycheapskate

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That's interesting idea about the modified moped with fairing or 3 wheel moped conversion.

It's possible you could build something on a salvage title. If you build a "new" motorcycle, for personal use, can you do away with the emissions BS and crapalytic converters? I can see where the tax man will get you if you are building them for sale.

The whole purpose of my motorized bicycle was to dodge all the BS taxes on motorcycles. I don't need a full size motorcycle, so getting by with the motor bicycle has been the best (and cheapest) option.
 
happycheapskate

happycheapskate

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The purpose of the bike and fairing will have a lot of influence on how complicated it is, too. If the purpose is for rain cover and insulation, it doesn't have to be as aerodynamic.

The simplest way to get a full fairing for that might be to add a "cage" to a moped, maybe with a sidecar, and make up some jeep type fabric doors.

For some people, it would defeat the whole purpose of a bike. But if you are investing in substitute for a car, it might do the job.

If you are going for the bare minimalist approach, it might be feasible to use a combination of moped and bicycle parts, and a fabricated tube frame.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTovZdu2SU4
fabricated tadpole trike with pedal drive system, 50cc moped engine and wheels, 2.5gallon tank.

I can see how something like this might be extended to have a fairing. Fairings can affect fuel mileage and stability of the bike, and drivers' vision. Those are important things to consider.

http://www.golfcarts2go.com/images/electric-king-lg.png

http://www.golfcarts2go.com/images/caprice-golf-cart.png
 
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happycheapskate

happycheapskate

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None of these are really new, but I like them. I think it puts you on the bottom of the automotive status symbol dogpile though, to have less than 80mph top speed, less than 200hp, or less than 4 wheels. Unless you have a vw based chopper trike. ;-) Still, drive what you like, and stinks for the cagers.

The coolest 3 wheel bike ever
http://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk/photos-smallwood/2.jpg

Single front wheel trike with closed in canopy, sliding doors, spoked wheels, aero windows.


http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4044/4337907537_d6a651e687.jpg
http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4044/4337907537_d6a651e687.jpg
3 wheel mini utility truck
This looks like what I'd shoot for if going for the most pared down design, starting with an existing bike.

These are for sale in my town
http://www.extrememotorsales.com/WF650-C.jpg
$8500, maybe less if shop-worn or cosmetic damages

Chongquing Chinese 3 wheel van with tarp sides, MC style driving seat
http://i01.i.aliimg.com/photo/v0/278921285/Van_Double_row_three_wheel_motorcycle_motor.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/07/27/article-1202547-0001C74700000258-888_468x329.jpg photo standard Robin
Kawasaki Ninja powered Robin Reliant
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gl5ZFYT7AcQ
 
happycheapskate

happycheapskate

New Member
Nov 26, 2009
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Fully enclosed electric assist bicycle
http://www.gizmag.com/go/1811/
http://images.gizmag.com/hero/1811_01.jpg
http://images.gizmag.com/gallery_lrg/1811_05.jpg

This is hot! Now it just needs a well-muffled gasoline engine of suitable size and power, and it will be a speed demon! It is supposed to have 1/10 the drag of an upright conventional bicycle. With even 2 HP, it will fly!
 
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