"kindalikeawhizzer"

[cannonball2]

Be following this SB! I wont hold it against these great little engines that the fine Union officer Sherman also shared the name.
I was saddened a few years back when Tecumseh ceased to exist. I always admired that they plodded on against the overwhelming competition from B&S. I guess its down to B&S and Kohler now.
Run your Indian Head engine proudly!

 

[silverbear]

cb2,
I'm glad you'll be following it since I plan on picking your brain for information and guidance.

I just bought a compression/decompression valve on ebay for ten bucks shipped. Hope it's the right thing.

This is what it says for one made for a Harley Davidson...

COMPRESSION RELEASE VALVES FOR HIGH COMPRESSION ENGINES


Designed to lower the compression for the purpose of reducing extreme pressure imposed on the starter motor and battery
Simply push the caps down to open the release valves, start the engine, and the valves will close by themselves
These valves require head removal and installation next to the spark plug by a qualified machinist
Note: As with any machining process, verify for sufficient material thickness before any machine work is done.

Valve (Each)
10mm x 1.0 thread pitch, 1 13/32" overall length with 10mm thread length"

I don't believe I would qualify as a machinist although I have friends who will testify that I am certifiable. They have said so in mixed company. I believe that says something about me, though not sure what. At any rate I am able to write myself permission slips having much experience as a schoolboy truant. What's involved besides drilling a hole and running a tap? The right sized hole and tap, I mean. Is this rocket science?

Yes, I'm sorry too for all of the long gone manufacturers from the USA. Schwinn and all of those bike outfits. The motorcycles. Automobiles galore. All kinds of great stuff gone and the machines that made them gone, too. And the people who knew how to run those machines and who took pride in what they did. Gone. And there are a lot of young people who never heard of Hudson and Kaiser, Nash and Cord and so many others. Even a lot of the backyard mechanics are gone, too. That's one reason I think that this forum is important and why so many become addicted to building motorbikes. We are designed by our creator to be co-creators, making the world one garden and one motorbike and one home at a time. There's a lot of satisfaction in making things. You know that and so do I, but so many young people are denied that opportunity to use their hands as makers. Sad, I think. There's nothing quite like riding off into the sunset on a machine you built. Woohoo! Hi ho ,Silver, away!!!
SB

 

[cannonball2]

You can certainly install the comp. release. Just determine the best placement in the head. I had to remove a small portion of a cooling fin, I then drilled a 1/16 pilot hole. I then drilled a 1/8 from the underside. I took a Forstner bit let it center in the 1/8 hole and milled a flat(or close to it). I then drilled and tapped for the release and screwed it home with a bit of sealer. That's all there was to it.
This is the type I used, probably similar to what you bought. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Forester-Co...900?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item415ad1897c

 

[silverbear]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/161486222664

Mine is similar made for a Husqvarna chainsaw. New, so should be of the same type. I hope. I used to have (maybe still do) Forstner bits for wood working. Is that what you used? It would work, I think, but might not like it much. Or is there a version for metal?
SB

 

[cannonball2]

You can pretty much use any machine tool for wood on aluminum if you turn it pretty slow so the aluminum does not pack the tool. May sound crude, but it works fairly well. You may be able to install the release with just drilling and tapping between the fins. The releases work well just push it down and it pops up when it starts. Im installing one in my next build.

 

[silverbear]

You can pretty much use any machine tool for wood on aluminum if you turn it pretty slow so the aluminum does not pack the tool. May sound crude, but it works fairly well. You may be able to install the release with just drilling and tapping between the fins. The releases work well just push it down and it pops up when it starts. Im installing one in my next build.

Excellent!
SB

 

[curtisfox]

Wow! You guys now I had to order a couple of them.LOL. I am with you on the four stroke much more grunt on bottom end and so much less adjusting on carbs. When you put them away for the session just put a drop of Seafoam in the gas and they start right up when ready to ride. Just got to remember to warm up them Tecumseh's before use............Curt

 

[silverbear]

I just now finally got the carburetor off the engine. Sneaky how they had it attached. Still struggling with the muffler and have broken off one stud. Time for an easy out which I find are never easy. Still undecided about the carburetor. I might get a new one to replace the old or take back a new Mikuni carb I bought from sportscarpat and then in a fit of madness gave to fasteddy last summer even though he didn't know what he was going to do with it. I was trying to remove temptations for starting yet another build. NO MORE. Finish what I've already got going. Then start over on the same ones if I have an insatiable itch to tinker. No new builds. So, I'll see if fasteddy has plans and if not will retrieve me Mikuni. Gives meaning to the old "Indiangiver!" thing which I could never figure out. Now I'm getting it. The Mikuni is supposed to be a nice upgrade from the stock mufflers on the bigger four strokes. I'll have to make an intake manifold, but would need to anyway if the engine is tipped some. Lots to do between there and now. Like remove the muffler and flywheel. The engine is shrinking, though, so that's good.
SB

 

[mason_man]

Glad to see this thread come alive.
I'm in.

Ray

 

[MEASURE TWICE]

I heard you mention Briggs Easy Starting maybe Easy-Spin Starting is what you saw. I'm not sure if my Briggs 80202-0430 is using this innovation as listed in the wiki from Briggs below.

I just know that my Briggs was from a Flea Market for cheap ($10) no carb and I over the years changed things thinking I was making it better.

It all came to a crux recently. That the last thing I did was to adjust the intake valve that was allowing pressure out during the compression stroke. While it let pressure out the intake port also wetted the air filter, since I was using a carb that was not like when I started out with an oil bath type air filter.

Now as of recent if I followed instructions to set the valve/tappet gap considering or not if this engine has Easy Spin, it was still going to allow pressure out on compression stroke.

I have another new intake valve if I need and decide to go by the instructions and redo it again, but it has much better compression and runs well. It unfortunately or fortunately had idled with the cheap Briggs clone carb that has no adjustments before I set the intake valve timing to get better compression.

Now I have a cheap Tecumseh Clone Carb with all adjustment low and high speed needle valve adjustments and a matching filter housing and it all is ready to test quite soon. I'll let you know so if you decide on using the Tecumseh or Briggs engines you have with a carb like what I got.

I know I have heard of compression release, that is done manually and or like with centrifugal forces with mechanical weights, but if you see what Easy Spin is, I am concerned it is not as good an the engine power (compression) after starting is less for the same displacement from the other compression release methods that cease after starting.

I have all things ready to test my engine/carb out just did not have time last to put the gas tank back on as I was working on the bike.

I looked at the past pictures of the sheave and the beefy looking hardware mounting it to the spokes. Let's see this marvel of yours come together, cheers!!


========================================

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Briggs_&_Stratton

Here is a link for Briggs & Stratton.


Easy-Spin Starting – This compression release, implemented as an extra hump on the intake lobe of the camshaft, was introduced in 1961 to reduce the effort required to start an engine.[10] In 1982, a new U.S. federal safety regulation required lawnmower blades to stop spinning within three seconds of the operator letting go of the handle. The least costly, most common way of complying with the new regulation was to put a flywheel brake on the mower engine, to stop the engine (and therefore the blade) immediately when the handle was released. Briggs & Stratton engineers found engines with the Easy-Spin camshaft were unacceptably difficult to restart after being braked to a quick stop. The Easy-Spin lobe hump was moved to the exhaust valve, but this reduced engine performance. The intake-side Easy-Spin remained in use on Briggs & Stratton's engines larger than those used on mowers subject to the brake requirement, but was discontinued in 1997 due to tightening emission regulations.[11]

===============================================

http://motorbicycling.com/showthread.php?t=29678&page=17

Bottom of page on post #170 has 5 pictures of the new Tecumseh Clone Carb and Air Filter Housing attached to my intake manifold elbow part and bowl leveling adapter between the parts.

MT

 

[silverbear]

Glad to see this thread come alive.
I'm in.

Ray

Thanks, Ray. I know this has been sitting on the back burner for too long. It feels good giving it some attention and lots of long stares while sipping a morning coffee. Something never did feel quite right about using the Jacobsen on this bike. If I can make this work close to as well as Dales Briggs builds I'll be a happy camper. I've long wondered what a Whizzer type belt drive was like and with this build I'll finally find out. Feel free to offer your opinions as I do value your skill and knowledge. A big kid like me who never grew up can use all the adult help I can get.

By the way, I'm going to give the feather guard a coat of the intended finish paint at first opportunity to see if I like the color. When dry it will go on the bike and then get stared at over morning coffee for few months. Not sure about brown with cream white trim, but some of the old Schwinns came that way and I thought I'd give it a try for that 1951 look. Kind of like coffee with cream, come to think on it. Thanks again for that cool feather chain guard...
SB

 

[silverbear]

Measure Twice,
Yes, I think the Briggs on my shelf says easy spin on it. I've heard a few negative comments about loss of compression issues and partly for that reason decided to go with the Tecumseh. Good to know about the replacement Tecumseh carburetors. I've still not decided on replacing with an original type carb or going with a Mikuni motorcycle type. I'll probably choose the Mikuni.

Relieving the compression for easier starting sounds like a good idea in theory so long as it does not really compromise an engine's performance. I don't know enough about small engines to have lasted as long as you have in figuring out your fuel issues. It sounds like you're getting things worked out. I think the chainsaw type of manual release should work out well for me. Using a hand crank for starting will take some getting used to and the compression release valve should help.

Amazing how long some of these builds take, isn't it? Your art fish enterprise is kind of like my tri-car venture in that there is so much involved it seems like it just goes on and on. But we will get there! And this "kindalikeawhizzer" will breathe fire and one day ride me off into the sunset. These bikes are my fountain of youth, helping me disregard becoming an old fellow. Who cares what time it is? Let's ride!
SB

 

[cannonball2]

The Tecumseh fully adjustable(two needle) carb is an excellent carb. I have run them on every thing from Briggs to Whizzers to a Fuji Robin. The down side is they are more subject to fuel contamination/stale fuel issues, especially the idle circuit. There is an idle passage so small in the main jet that most folks miss it when its not clogged and never see it when it is. To clean it you have to remove one strand from something like an 18ga wire to probe it out. Also the brass floats sometime leak and fill with fuel, but the later ones were plastic.
So the take away is why reinvent the wheel, with good fuel maintenance these carbs run well.
SB, if the carb you have has an adjustment needle on the bottom of the float bowl, I would have a throw at cleaning/rebuild.
Be glad to help you via posted pics.

 

[silverbear]

cb2,
Thanks for your very kind offer of assistance. Yes, the carb has an adjustment needle on the bottom of the float bowl. At this point I don't know which way I'll go, but from what I've read the Tecumseh is a good carburetor. I have one that ran, but needed cleaning as it would only run fully choked. No doubt it could be refurbished to good as new (with your guidance). On the other hand fasteddy tells me he has no plans for the Mikuni carb and will send it as soon as I ask for it. No hurry at this point and either one will require making up a custom manifold due to tilting the engine. I think I'll see about mocking up how the engine will fit into the frame, then stare at it for some time before deciding.
Question: Does this engine have a governor?
More immediately I'm having a heck of a time removing the muffler. Having Phillips head bolts seems a poor choice to me. One has broken off and will require drilling it and using an easy out in hopes of removing the broken off stud. And the other one is not budging. I've used penetrating oil, propane torch and have an impact driver dealy for giving it a good smack with a hammer. So far, no luck. I'll take some pictures tomorrow. Flywheel came off with no problem. I can see that shaving off the fins will be an enterprise.
SB

 

[MEASURE TWICE]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejG5zWo0cYY

I checked out this video and from 9:30 to 11:30 minute time marks show the last try to weld a nut to what really looked like flush broken off bolt at intake 8-32 thread.

It finally worked.

I was thinking besides the tools and talent to do this, I think added to the things in the video, maybe a way of putting some metal on the intake and exhaust ports as a shield from spatter. I guess a Dremel with wire brush and inspecting after doing the welding would be in order for loose weld spatter. Imagine fixing the broken off bold and subsequently score the cylinder and piston after starting the engine up.

MT

 

[curtisfox]

I noticed that all his welds were in one spot or to one side and not all the way around.
Also he was prolly using zink coated nuts and weld don't like that coating,it has to burn through the zink to hold.

All you really have to do is make sure the valve is closed and when done air hose and blow it out,use a little brake cleaner. ............Curt

 

[cannonball2]

Don't stress SB I believe when you get the dastardly bolts/muffler off you will find a threaded exhaust port to use if you cant remove the broken bolt.

 

[curtisfox]

Don't stress SB I believe when you get the dastardly bolts/muffler off you will find a threaded exhaust port to use if you cant remove the broken bolt.

Very true,just comenting on the video. yes threaded port would work ...........Curt

 

[silverbear]

You have just made my day... yes, it is a threaded port! I'll cut the head off of the other stud and be done with it. No easy out! Looks like cast iron pipe will thread right in there and I have some stainless flex pipe for a quick and easy exhaust. I like things that are simple. Thanks you guys!
SB

 

[mason_man]

Nice, pics when you can Sir.

Ray