Attention Canadians !!!

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Emerica

Emerica

New Member
Feb 1, 2008
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NOT Illegal.

Get a Vin for your bike, $50 (under a trailer registration, make sure if you do online its obvious its not a trailer.) Guy will come down an arrange to put a vin sticker on your bike. Proof of ownership I'd guess as well.

but be prepared to make sure it can pass an out of provice moped inspection.

Then you must get it insured, dont goto any big bank insurance, find a good broker and explain all of the law changes. When you have the Vin and inspection papers you can get insurance from abroker who wont screw you around. Moped insurace is generally cheap unless you get full coverage, vandalism may be a big charge as bikes can tip easy (supposedly).

Then once insured, get it registered, you have everything else you need. Then ride, safe :)

I've found some places in Edmonton that have been very cooperative so far in doing the morini/giant while I got the moped on the road.

In some ways I think it's good and it does standardize the law across Canada and the same changes did make good strides for higher classed electric scooters. We are the side affected.
 
Blakenstein

Blakenstein

Member
Sep 15, 2009
561
2
16
Alta. Canada.
Hey Emo. .....are u in Edmonton????? Any way, the police in Edmonton have no problem with my bike...one might have but he never caught me.

Like I said before in this section; I'd put quotation marks, but I never quote myself.

Any way, The only OFFICIAL Alberta Motor vehicles doccument I saw was last year and it said that my bike is okay as long as I wear a Helmutt and stay out of everyones way.


Thanks for the tip though, because if I ever get an 80cc in framer, that looks like a motorcycle, then I'm gonna need one, and I will be lookin u up.

Right now my rear mount chain drive from Island Hopper Florida is doing me just great!!!
 
F

fasteddy

Well-Known Member
Feb 13, 2009
7,454
4,920
113
British Columbia Canada
Emerica, very interesting. When you get out of jail for having an unlicenced, unregisered, uninsured vehicle that you obtained a false registration and insurance for please let us know how it went.

If you are going to claim your motor bike is a moped they want to see the sticker from the maker.

Good luck

Steve.
 
Emerica

Emerica

New Member
Feb 1, 2008
65
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How do you think people register custom motorcycles?
The process listed above, the vin I would assume would be created for you and that would inturn on the gov side be attached to the serials of your frame and engine.

I contacted the dot with a letter and got back just that, I've got an ok to bring it in for inspection once I have lights on the bike, he told me the rest should pass, its not too much.
The insurance guy was pretty good as well, if that works out or not we'll see.

Hello Shane:

Thank you for your email of November 14, 2009 regarding Alberta's recent
change to the definition of power bicycle.

Effective July 1, 2009, Alberta amended the Use of Highway and Rules of
the Road Regulation adopting Transport Canada's definition of
power-assisted bicycle. At the same time we also amended the definition
of moped, adopting Transport Canada's definition of limited-speed
motorcycle. Adopting Transport Canada's power-assisted bicycle
definition only allows an Alberta power bicycle to have an electric
motor; the intention being power-assisted bicycles are to be operated as
bicycles with an electric assist.

Alberta relies upon Transport Canada to establish motor vehicle design
and engineering standards; including standards for noise and exhaust
emissions. Prior to July 1 of this year many Albertans were purchasing
Transport Canada power-assisted bicycles but, because they weighed more
than 35 kg, they were required to licence and insure them as mopeds
before they could be operated on a roadway in Alberta. Adopting
Transport Canada's definition eliminated this requirement, making these
green alternative vehicles street legal.

Since July 1 of this year an internal combustion engine driven bicycle
is defined as a moped. Mopeds must be licensed and insured, their
riders must wear a motorcycle helmet, and hold at least a class 7
driver's licence.

Considering engine driven bicycles to be a mopeds hasn't made them
illegal. There are no plans at this time to change Alberta's
definitions to allow for engine driven power bicycles.

You are correct, to register an internal combustion engine driven
bicycle as a moped requires an Alberta assigned Vehicle Identification
Number (VIN). Obtaining an assigned VIN should not be difficult; an
Alberta's assigned VIN for an engine driven bicycle will cost $52.50
(including GST). For more information contact the Insurance Bureau of
Canada at 1-866 263-6240, or visit their Alberta assigned VIN webpage:
https://apps.ibc.ca/AlbertaReVin/RevinAppInstructions.aspx

After obtaining an assigned VIN the Alberta Registries agent will
require you to get an out-of-province safety inspection. This
inspection must be done by a certified and licensed motorcycle
technician an Alberta licensed facility. You will be responsible for
the cost of this inspection; please contact Gordon Byer, Manager Vehicle
Inspection Programs, by telephone at 780-427-8901, or by email at
[email protected], to assist you in finding a suitable inspection
facility.

An engine driven bicycle must meet the vehicle equipment requirements
for a moped. A moped must have headlamps, tail lamps, signal lamps,
brake lamps, mirrors, and a side mirror. You may view the Vehicle
Equipment Regulation on the Queen's Printer's website at:
Alberta Queen's Printer: Legislation PDF
=9780779743193

You can view Alberta's definitions for power bicycle and moped in the
Use of Highway and Rules of the Road Regulation on Alberta's Queen's
Printer's website:
Alberta Queen's Printer: Legislation PDF
=9780779743186

You can view Transport Canada's definitions of power-assisted bicycle
and limited-speed motorcycle on Transport Canada's website:
Short Title, Interpretation - Motor Vehicle Safety Regulations (C.R.C., c. 1038) - List of Regulations - Acts and Regulations - Transport Canada
anchorbo-ga:s_2

Please contact me if you have any questions.

Harry Parenteau, P. Eng.
Vehicle Safety Engineer
Alberta Transportation
789-427-8901
 
bgoates

bgoates

New Member
Mar 3, 2008
85
0
0
Emerica said:
NOT Illegal.

Get a Vin for your bike, $50 (under a trailer registration, make sure if you do online its obvious its not a trailer.) Guy will come down an arrange to put a vin sticker on your bike. Proof of ownership I'd guess as well.

but be prepared to make sure it can pass an out of provice moped inspection.

Then you must get it insured, dont goto any big bank insurance, find a good broker and explain all of the law changes. When you have the Vin and inspection papers you can get insurance from abroker who wont screw you around. Moped insurace is generally cheap unless you get full coverage, vandalism may be a big charge as bikes can tip easy (supposedly).

Then once insured, get it registered, you have everything else you need. Then ride, safe :)

I've found some places in Edmonton that have been very cooperative so far in doing the morini/giant while I got the moped on the road.

In some ways I think it's good and it does standardize the law across Canada and the same changes did make good strides for higher classed electric scooters. We are the side affected.
Click to expand...
Have you actually done this in Alberta ? To pass inspection didn't you need headlight, tail light, signal lights, rear view mirror, chain guard, ect ? If you have found a way to pass inspection and make legal in Alberta I am very interested.....
 
Emerica

Emerica

New Member
Feb 1, 2008
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0
bgoates

bgoates

New Member
Mar 3, 2008
85
0
0
Emerica:

I am totally baffled....didn't you have to have the moped equipment, ie lights ect to pass inspection as mentioned in the Alberta Transportation letter included in your post above ?

Thanks
 
Emerica

Emerica

New Member
Feb 1, 2008
65
0
0
When I bought the moped at ames motosports, they told me they could have it all done. They had a look at the bike, and just pointed out the lights and gave me a info about a guy who sells accelerometer based brake lights.
Last cheque went to bills, so another month or two once its a bit nicer i may go through the hoops to have it done. We'll see, all talk and emails until someone has gone through it.

bgoates: I have a moped and the morini bicycle. Moped is regged insured and all that, morini is not , but inquired along the way of getting the moped done about having the morini done. If that makes sense.
 
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Emerica

Emerica

New Member
Feb 1, 2008
65
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0
Here is the Ibc information.
source: http://www.ibc.ca/en/Insurance_Crime/Prevention_Investigation/Alberta_ReVINing.asp
The $52 fee listed above is because it gets listed under the trailer fee!
I called to verify this, because the vin application form does not have the option, choose trailer.

Also as listed below, keep all of your receipts, or build a new machine.
You may need to prove ownership of various components.



IBC administers the Alberta Assigned Vehicle Identification Number (VIN) Program on behalf of Alberta Transportation.
Application and Fees

Return your completed application and payment (non-refundable) to:

Insurance Bureau of Canada,
Unit 505, 10333 Southport Road SW
Calgary, Alberta
T2W 3X6

Payment can be made by credit card (Visa or MasterCard), or by certified cheque or money order made payable to Insurance Bureau of Canada. Cash will not be accepted.

If faxing your application (403-255-9054), please note that payment can be made only by credit card.

Upon receipt of your application and payment, IBC will contact you to schedule a time and place for the examination of the vehicle/trailer.
Proof of Your Identity

At the vehicle/trailer examination you must show your operator's licence (or other picture ID if you do not have an operator's licence) and proof of ownership. Where applicable, IBC will make a photocopy or take a digital picture of the following documents:

* proof of vehicle ownership (registration, bill of sale, NVIS, etc.)
* salvage invoice
* proof of ownership of components used (bill of sale)

The Examination

IBC will examine the vehicle/trailer and its parts to determine if they have been reported stolen. A new VIN cannot be assigned until a “stolen” status has been removed by the police. IBC will also examine the vehicle and its parts to determine if they have a non-repairable (or similar) status. In some cases, a VIN will not be assigned to a vehicle using certain non-repairable parts.

Please note: The vehicle examination conducted by IBC is not an inspection of the safety and/or mechanical integrity of the vehicle. A Salvage Vehicle Inspection or an Out-of-Province Vehicle Inspection, at the applicant's expense, may be required before the vehicle can be registered in Alberta. Please contact an Alberta motor vehicle registry agent for information about registering your vehicle/trailer.

On completion of the examination, IBC may assign a new VIN or confirm the original VIN of the vehicle. IBC will install the VIN plate on the vehicle. A copy of the examination form will be given to you; you must then present this form to an Alberta motor vehicle registry agent to register your vehicle/trailer.

The VIN plate is issued by the Government of Alberta and must not be removed from the vehicle. If it is removed, you must have the vehicle/trailer examined again and pay the service fee before IBC will issue an official replacement VIN plate.

Alberta Transportation has agreements with the police in Alberta and Insurance Bureau of Canada to share information collected from the applicants of this service. This is for the purposes of investigating auto-theft and auto-related offences, including conspiracy, fraud, possession of stolen property and other related crimes. This information-sharing, without the direct consent of the applicant, is authorized under Sections 40(1)(e) and (q) of the Freedom of Information and Protection of Privacy Act.
For more information:

For more information, please contact IBC. In Calgary call (403) 258-3677; outside of Calgary call 1-866-263-6240.
 
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F

fasteddy

Well-Known Member
Feb 13, 2009
7,454
4,920
113
British Columbia Canada
Emerica, this is and old tired arguement. You CAN NOT put a motor on a bicycle and call it a moped.

The FEDERAL government says you can't. The FEDERAL motor vehicle law says you can't.
You want to mess with them as I said PLEASE tell us how it went.

Alberta changed thier laws for a very short time and then they changed them back to be in line with the rest of Canada. Fast, because you can bet that Ottawa didn't like it.
Save the letter you have though. It may help you with the judge, though he may tell you too bad since you are required to know the law. I didn't know is not a defense.

Now how does a person get papers for a motorcycle? Simple it is a motorcycle not a motor bike. The Federal laws state that a bike frame is not strong enough for a gas motor to be attached. Look up the laws it's there in all the BS that you have to sift through.
Trust me I spent a week on the computer looking for an opening. It does not exist.

The Insurance company of British Columbia and Ford Motors were the only 2 to show up when the Feds were drawing up the new rules, ICBC's lawyers protected the insurance companies and Ford was building e-bikes at the time and thier lawyers covered them with the laws about gas motors on bikes.

Mopeds have to be built by a company that the Feds have approved. They have a decal that says so on them. Fake one and get caught and the laws get pretty savage about it.

The law states that a regular bicycle does not have a stong enough frame and cannot be driven with a gas motor on it on public roads.

I really don't care what you do but I mention this every time it comes up so some one who reads one thread and the takes that as gospel and then gets busted and thier MB is taken and they lose thier licence.

Like I said, best of luck.

Steve.
 
bgoates

bgoates

New Member
Mar 3, 2008
85
0
0
Emerica said:
How do you think people register custom motorcycles?
The process listed above, the vin I would assume would be created for you and that would inturn on the gov side be attached to the serials of your frame and engine.

I contacted the dot with a letter and got back just that, I've got an ok to bring it in for inspection once I have lights on the bike, he told me the rest should pass, its not too much.
The insurance guy was pretty good as well, if that works out or not we'll see.

Hello Shane:

Thank you for your email of November 14, 2009 regarding Alberta's recent
change to the definition of power bicycle.

Effective July 1, 2009, Alberta amended the Use of Highway and Rules of
the Road Regulation adopting Transport Canada's definition of
power-assisted bicycle. At the same time we also amended the definition
of moped, adopting Transport Canada's definition of limited-speed
motorcycle. Adopting Transport Canada's power-assisted bicycle
definition only allows an Alberta power bicycle to have an electric
motor; the intention being power-assisted bicycles are to be operated as
bicycles with an electric assist.

Alberta relies upon Transport Canada to establish motor vehicle design
and engineering standards; including standards for noise and exhaust
emissions. Prior to July 1 of this year many Albertans were purchasing
Transport Canada power-assisted bicycles but, because they weighed more
than 35 kg, they were required to licence and insure them as mopeds
before they could be operated on a roadway in Alberta. Adopting
Transport Canada's definition eliminated this requirement, making these
green alternative vehicles street legal.

Since July 1 of this year an internal combustion engine driven bicycle
is defined as a moped. Mopeds must be licensed and insured, their
riders must wear a motorcycle helmet, and hold at least a class 7
driver's licence.

Considering engine driven bicycles to be a mopeds hasn't made them
illegal. There are no plans at this time to change Alberta's
definitions to allow for engine driven power bicycles.

You are correct, to register an internal combustion engine driven
bicycle as a moped requires an Alberta assigned Vehicle Identification
Number (VIN). Obtaining an assigned VIN should not be difficult; an
Alberta's assigned VIN for an engine driven bicycle will cost $52.50
(including GST). For more information contact the Insurance Bureau of
Canada at 1-866 263-6240, or visit their Alberta assigned VIN webpage:
https://apps.ibc.ca/AlbertaReVin/RevinAppInstructions.aspx

After obtaining an assigned VIN the Alberta Registries agent will
require you to get an out-of-province safety inspection. This
inspection must be done by a certified and licensed motorcycle
technician an Alberta licensed facility. You will be responsible for
the cost of this inspection; please contact Gordon Byer, Manager Vehicle
Inspection Programs, by telephone at 780-427-8901, or by email at
[email protected], to assist you in finding a suitable inspection
facility.

An engine driven bicycle must meet the vehicle equipment requirements
for a moped. A moped must have headlamps, tail lamps, signal lamps,
brake lamps, mirrors, and a side mirror. You may view the Vehicle
Equipment Regulation on the Queen's Printer's website at:
Alberta Queen's Printer: Legislation PDF
=9780779743193

You can view Alberta's definitions for power bicycle and moped in the
Use of Highway and Rules of the Road Regulation on Alberta's Queen's
Printer's website:
Alberta Queen's Printer: Legislation PDF
=9780779743186

You can view Transport Canada's definitions of power-assisted bicycle
and limited-speed motorcycle on Transport Canada's website:
Short Title, Interpretation - Motor Vehicle Safety Regulations (C.R.C., c. 1038) - List of Regulations - Acts and Regulations - Transport Canada
anchorbo-ga:s_2

Please contact me if you have any questions.

Harry Parenteau, P. Eng.
Vehicle Safety Engineer
Alberta Transportation
789-427-8901
Click to expand...

I got the same letter from Alberta Transportation when I inquired about the change in legislation.

The statements "Since July 1 of this year an internal combustion engine driven bicycle
is defined as a moped. Mopeds must be licensed and insured, their
riders must wear a motorcycle helmet, and hold at least a class 7
driver's license.

Considering engine driven bicycles to be a mopeds hasn't made them
illegal."...implies that they can be made legal if a VIN number is obtained, safety equipment installed, safety inspection passed, registered and insured.

TO DATE I HAVE NOT HEARD OF ANYBODY WHO HAS SUCCESSFULLY GONE THROUGH THIS PROCESS WITH A MOTORIZED BIKE KIT !

I hope somebody can prove me wrong.
 
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F

fasteddy

Well-Known Member
Feb 13, 2009
7,454
4,920
113
British Columbia Canada
There was an story in our paper here in Vancouver that Alberta had to change their MB law back to what the Federal guide lines are.
Mopeds are limited speed motorcycles. Mopeds are built with a stronger frame and have to be a step through design. They must have a a factory applied sticker saying that they meet all federal safety standards.
E-bikes must have this also. The kit I bought with a hub motor has these stickers supplied with the kit.

There are no substitutes for this law.

Look up the BC web sight using ICBC web site. They have pictures of what is what. While this is not Alberta the same laws apply.

As I said I spent a week on the computer trying to get through the crap and that is the law country wide. Ontario has made it even tougher with licence classes for mopeds and scooters.

ICBC confirmed that all the federal laws are in every province and they have the right to add to them but they cannot change the basic federal rules.
That is why Alberta had to change them back.

Once again this has been done to death. Look at the start of this discussion.

Steve.
 
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bgoates

bgoates

New Member
Mar 3, 2008
85
0
0
So....let's change the law by writing our Member of Parliament ! My opinion is that it is a dumb law and we Canadians are way over regulated and too passive to do anything when we disagree. If every Canadian who reads these forums would write their Member of Parliament we might have some success.
 
Terry Blow

Terry Blow

Dealer & Custom Builder
Oct 29, 2009
1,117
3
0
Surrey B.C Canada
I Hate this hole Darn thing the Canadian Transport Minister has rammed one right up the you who of every gas powered bicycle rider across Canada including Ontario. I have invested a carp load of money and time building a company and a compliant motorized bicycle. It is impossible and that is no JOKE if your Vehicle dose not have a CMVSS com-pliancy decal from the manufacturer your dead in the water. I only just found this out because I went to all the expense and time to bring my bicycle up to Limited speed motorcycle specs with full motorcycle lighting horn all DOT and SAE approved. Only to find out in the twelfth hour I dose not matted what I did to my bicycle it will never be aloud on the roads ever. Here is the link to the Bulletin http://www.th.gov.bc.ca/cvse/vehicle...otorcycles.pdf What this is tell you is if you try to become compliant and go as far as taking your MB to an inspection facility they will look up this bulletin and then send you home. And with out this inspection no Vin number will be issued and no VIN number no insurance. witch all spells NO GAS POWERED BICYCLES IN CANADA. If you go to the transport Canada site and look it up you will find the same info this goes for Canada wide end of story.
Of course there are ways around this of which I have done. If you are very serious about following my path I am willing to guide you in the right direction. But be warned you could buy a scooter cheaper than you can build you own moped PM me if you are super serious and have lots of money that you are willing to spend.

Terry
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