Gas inside the clutch cover

bluenosegoat · Jan 28, 2010

I've been figthting with this 49 cc kit from bgf for a little while now. I was in the process of taking the engine half's apart and when i took off the clutch cover there is no grease in it but gas and oil ! I imagine it muzt be the oil seal. Are there any trick to removing the seal and installing a new one? I've sent bgf an email about this- engine only has maybe 3 tanks run through. I must have gotten a bad engine. I was replaceing the leaking head gasket and decided to remove the cylinder and lap it down smooth. As i was pulling the cylinder off the bottom piston ring feel off in two pieces! As i was removing the piston I lost one of the "G" clips and thats why I'm taking the engine apart to make sure its not down in the crank case. I have to figure out a way to remove the magnet though as its being a real bugger!

On the bright side i got the sbp shift kit installed on my other bike! Way cool!
Any tips on the oil seal would be great!

skipu · Jan 29, 2010

if there is gas in there it is more than likely your seal it will also suck debris in and by sucking air it may be the reason youve been fightin it the whole time motor has to come apart to fix seals you may get away without it but i feel to do it right break it and be carefull installing new seals they are tight oil and straightness is key !!!

bluenosegoat · Jan 29, 2010

Thanks Skipu,
I'm thinking that this seal may be the reason for the lack of top end power also. Like you said if its able to suck air there goes the fuel mix. I'm a bit disappointed in this kit compared to the other. Saving 20 bucks was not worth it, not to mention the cost of the new parts needed! G clips cost me 3 bucks each! Thats insane! (I also got some clips that might work from Ace for .20 but I figure I dont want to risk them not working so I paid the price. Maybe today if I can get the magnet off and find a seal I can get her running again. Any idea where i might find the seal? I dont want to spend 10 bucks on shipping for a 2 dollar part.

Riding Rich · Jan 29, 2010

You can get seals from Pirate Cycles.
I know justin has some.

Sometimes the magnet is jammed on the key so tough its the key thats actually stuck.
Best option is to use a small 2 jaw puller to get the magnet off.

Or the crude way....Be very very careful if you do this.

Get a small pair of vice grips.
Clamp down on the flat cut out parts of the magnet.
Work it back forward and back (NOT side to side)
Eventually the key will let go and the magnet will come off.
Be very careful or you can bend the shaft easily.

Also remember when you go to put the magnet back on.......
Rotate the key way so it is at 12:00 o clock.
The slot for the key is on a slight angle.
It should tip towared the drive sprocket.

If you flip the magnet over the thing wont run.

Pull the old seal out with a seal puller or use needle nose plyers.
Dont scratch the bore in the case.

File a chamfer on the big part of the shaft.
No chamfer there screws the seal up when your putting it in.
Also if you knock the spring out of position on the inside of the seal your done.
The spring will break and get into the bearing and bust up the bearing cage.

I have seen it first hand.

I have a set of plates that fit over the top of the seals and bearings.
I use a bolt and nuts to squeeze the plates together to press the seals in.

The thin seal is easy. Magneto side.

The thick seal is tough.

Small drive gear side.

Be careful everything counts if you split the cases.

bluenosegoat · Jan 29, 2010

I am a bit afraid to open the cases up. I got them to seperate as far as the magnet would allow and shook the engine to see if the lost clip might fall out and nothing. I sure wish i could find it in the driveway to be sure its not down in there!
The seal seems to be cocked. a little raised on one side. I will clean it up and press the seal back in and try it before i order more parts. I also might try some shoe goo on the outside of the seal and see if that helps. It seems to be fuel resistant and sticks pretty good. I use it to seal up the wire hole from the magneto and to seal the spark plug to cdi. I am going to see if I can find a small 2 leg puller for the magnet as i dont want to bend the shaft like you said. One thing keeps leading to another and my son wants his bike back!

Riding Rich · Jan 29, 2010

Ahh pull that magnet off.
As far as you've gone might just as well split the cases and clean the junk out.
If the lip of the seal is pushed up a little that spring could be damaged.
If it gets in your bearing you will wish you replaced it.

2door · Jan 29, 2010

Blue,
Riding Rich is correct when he says you can bend the crankshaft. The end where the magnet rides is only a little over 5/16" in diameter. A puller is the best way to get the magnet off but you still need to do it carefully. The only thing I can add to Rich's good advice would be to lubricate the seals and shaft before trying to install them. Just wipe the inside lips with oil, 2 stroke oil will work fine, and apply some to the shaft. I use a deep well socket as a seal driver. Find one that is just a tiny bit smaller in diameter than the outside diameter of the seal and tap it in easily with a small hammer. Make sure you get it started streight.
Piston Bikes also carries the seals. It's good to see that someone else does because they are a special size and available nowhere else that I can find. Good luck and let us know how you make out.
Tom

Oh, and forget the shoe goo idea, please!

bluenosegoat · Jan 30, 2010

Thanks for all the tips. I could not find a small gear puller so the magnet remains unmoved. I tried the vise grip and I also tried a real small screw driver down the keyway to see if I might budge the key and nothing. I ended up just putting the engine back together for now after blowing (150psi) air down in the crankcase and shot some carb cleaner in there to to flush it out then air again to dry then put the halfs back together and put some 2 cycle oil in and sloshed it around then upside down to drain. Took the bike for a short ride and I'll open up the clutch cover this morning before I go to buy another bike (thinking pk80 in hopes of that new head!). The engine is running a bit better but stll not up to expectations. I'm on a hunt for a gear puller today and if I cant find one I will make one! I am determined to get this engine apart now! My son needed his bike today to get to work so had to get her running.
Oh and i bypassed the shoe goo idea, if it still leaks I will get the seal and do it right!

bluenosegoat · Jan 30, 2010

So no oil in the clutch cover this morning and still none after a good 20 mile ride. Maybe I lucked out! It could happen, never has but it could happen! Engine seems fine now. At least a little better than it was. Still looking for a small gear puller. I cant beleive I'm having so much trouble finding one! Not even Harbor Frieght had one. I guess I'll make my own. Thanks for the help and I will get that magnet off or die trying!

flybytaco · Jan 31, 2010

you can carfully screw fine thread sheetrock screws into the seals and pull them out with pliers so u dont have to split cases use a deep socket to push the new ones in deep socket will clear the crank .weld

bluenosegoat · Jan 31, 2010

Thanks Taco for the input. BGF asked me to take pictures and email them but of course I got the email after I cleaned it all up and assembled it again. I really need more patience! Anyway so far so good, we'll see what's in there after todays ride. Like I said though I am on a mission to get that engine apart. I just have to see all the parts. I've always been that way- if its mechanical I'm going to figure out exactly what makes it work (my mom got real tired of coming in my room as a kid with radios and tv's taken apart all over the place, as I got older most of them worked again!).

Riding Rich · Jan 31, 2010

Good idea TACO.
How come u never told me that one.

bluenosegoat · Feb 6, 2010

Its been about a week and so far no more oil coming from the seal. The engine is really coming to life now also. He is reaching speeds right around 25- same as my bike. He is much happier now. I'm sure all these engines are different and this one obviously needed a little attention but now as it is breaking in the expected performance is coming out. I do appreciate Bgf replying to me but seems the seal is okay now. Strange because in my experience once it leaks it will always leak. I did manage to make my own small gear puller so next time an engine is off its coming apart! I just have to see the guts! Thanks guys for help

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