Home Brew Hair Dryer turbo.

Discussion in 'Motorized Bicycle Welding, Fabrication and Paintin' started by industrialphreak, Jun 3, 2009.

  1. industrialphreak

    industrialphreak New Member

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    I am wondering if anyone would be interested in developing a turbo based off of the internals of a hair dryer?
     
  2. chrisme

    chrisme New Member

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    You?
    If I had a 4-stroke I'd definitely be playing with forced induction.
    Doesn't really work with 2-strokes though.
     
  3. Bikeguy Joe

    Bikeguy Joe Godfather of Motorized Bicycles

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    Not enough oomph with a hair dryer anyway.
     
  4. matt167

    matt167 New Member

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    would need a real turbocharger and a whole mess of other stuff to make it work on a 2 stroke
     
  5. BrettMavriK

    BrettMavriK New Member

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    A Hairdryer........Really?

    There isn't a need to go turbo with these motors. In their stock fashion, you would grenade one quicker than you could say "aww crap". You can't put a band-aid on a turd, but this turd can be polished...

    You can take one of these motors and machine them to make gobs more power.
    With the right machined head cap, trued surfaces, proper porting and crank balancing, with a tuned exhaust, I bet you could squeeze out 5-7hp. The biggest improvement you can make to these motors is crank balancing. they are so unbelieveably out of balance from the factories. This is why they vibrate to oblivion. That probably robs at least a horse and a half right there. A better carburetor wouldn't hurt either.

    'BrettMavriK
     
  6. Clotho

    Clotho Member

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    Our 2 strokes don't have an exhaust valve so the only reasonable solution is to use an expansion chamber to provide backpressure. Unfortunately this makes for an extremely peaky motor. One that isn't well suited to riding in the city.

    Works great on the salt flats tho.


    A hair dryer is not going to work. It moves air around well but it won't create any pressure. People have played around with this before using computer fans. If you search some you will find out what they discovered from their experiments.
     
  7. matt167

    matt167 New Member

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    couldn't agree more...
     
  8. industrialphreak

    industrialphreak New Member

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    Thanks guys. I just recently dissasembled the hair dryer and found the blades on the fan were some cheapo plastic. Not to mention hair dryers for safety reasons are not intended to be able to build up any preasure. Probably my next project will be figuring out a way to hack my air box to scoop air in/ Add NOS/ HHO/ water injection? lol i can imagine that baby granading between my legs and the 00dles of razer sharp shrapnel violating where the sun dont shine.

    Better yet maybe the safer option would just do the scoop/ram idea and add a nice boost bottle!
    here is the url Boost Bottle Industries They also offer a cool N2O kit at Nitrous kits

    I found this stuff looking into another rather dangerously stupid sport called motorized street luge.
    Powered Streetluge
     
  9. Bikeguy Joe

    Bikeguy Joe Godfather of Motorized Bicycles

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    A boost bottle is a waste of money and time.
     
  10. sojudave

    sojudave New Member

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    Regarding the HHO aka Brown's gas. I would have serious doubts as to whether it'd work on a two stroke engine, considering that you gotta mix oil and fuel, not to mention the current you'd have to send to it so electrolosis can take place. You could probably hook up a battery to it to get it to do that. I was thinking of doing this too just to see if what supporters of HHO say are correct, factor in that these bikes get rediculous milage anyway and you could seemingly go forever. Once again, if you can find a four stroke motor to do this to, I'd think you'd have better luck.
     
  11. industrialphreak

    industrialphreak New Member

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    Anything is possible, its just how much frustration and money you want to throw into the project. Just because you have to mix your fuel before for the current stock setup doesnt mean you can setup a simular setup for more main stream scooters/mopeds that have a 2 stroke synthetic oil resevor that atomizes the lubricant into the fuel air mixture. This is how some propane powered 2 stroke floor buffers operate as well.


    -Viva La Energy Revolution...
     
  12. Clotho

    Clotho Member

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    If you look on this forum you will find many practical methods for increasing performance. The Chinese 2 stroke motors are about as simple as a motor can be made. You really can't build a gasoline engine with fewer moving parts. As a result there are only so many things you can do to them to increase performance. Many of us have built all kinds of high performance automobile/motorcycle/aircraft/marine motors and have built engines using turbochargers, blowers, Nitrous etc. We have overcome all kinds of complications and difficulties on much more complicated projects. It is with great confidence that I can state that if you want to improve the performance of your Chinese 2 stroke you have to look no further than this board.

    If you have made all the mods found here and it still isn't enough for you then it is time to find another motor. The Morini engines or Jim's new motor are the next logical step up and you will be well prepared to work with them if you have already maxxed out your China girl.
     
    #12 Clotho, Jun 5, 2009
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2009
  13. industrialphreak

    industrialphreak New Member

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    Sure nuff...
    One thing i am contemplating is casting all the parts for one of these instead of just the jug and head, maybe even look at building a dual piston rotary. Yes this forum is a wicked place to get information for mods and such info to keep your bike running... The fact is i would really really like the idea of being able to legally manufacture produce our own fuel/Harness freely availble natural resource such as a solar powered electrolisis cylinder charger and or Bio-Diesel reactor. Its nice getting rediculouse milage but would it not be even wickeder to be able to add more sharp broken broom stick in the Butt to the energy tychoons not only this but also corrupt buroucrats gettting kickbacks from the "Evil Energy Tzars"
     
  14. Clotho

    Clotho Member

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    Sounds like fun! Pretty sure a rotary would be considered to have at least 3 pistons. I like the flex fuel idea too. Turbines or diesel are good for multiple fuels. Alcohol is easy to make. Solar is growing. The biggest problem with electrolysis is the breaking of the bonds in the first place. Some intriguing work has been done with harmonic frequencies in that regard but I don't think its quite there yet.

    Lots of interesting work going on here already. Check out Jim's posts (Creative Engineering) aka Manic Mechanic for some interesting work on custom motors. He has built some fire breathing monsters in his day. Some interesting Electric bike stuff here too. You may be onto something with the supercapacitors.
     
    #14 Clotho, Jun 6, 2009
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2009
  15. industrialphreak

    industrialphreak New Member

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    My under standing if you have one cylinder block its considered one piston, but their are some desighns featuring multiple ignition cycles per head, Alcohol seems a viable option other then the risk of ATF raiding your shop because you dont have a liscence for moonshining/ giving them a cut. Solar electrolisys tank charging systems seem verry feasable depending on what catalyst one uses. The last thing i need to worry about is how to dispose of chlorine/caustic chemicals and heavy water if i use standard sodium chloride. Harmonic frequencies seem to be ideal but i would like to be able to build a fram lighter then CF, hopefully Carbon nanotubes will come down significantly soon. What about this idea... It would have to classify as a Ultralight aircraft but be cross between lighter then air craft and compress a hydrogen gas bag to become a glider once adequite altitude was achieved.
    YouTube - Gravity Plane

    This guy is using eight rotary kerosene powered engines that have been proven to run on hydrogen.
    YouTube - Moller m200x.

    If women dont find you handsom then they should at least find you handy.
    -Red from the Red Green Show
     
  16. camlifter

    camlifter Active Member

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    last year on all the car forums there was a vid going around of some kids dynoing a honda civic with a leaf blower stuck in the air intake pipe. it actually worked.
     
  17. Mike Hunt

    Mike Hunt New Member

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    hmm what if one was to use one of the medium to large sized electric rc airplane motors with an rc plane prop inside a funnel with a tube going to the intake... those things can chop off a finger if you aren't careful. i have two rc planes, both are fairly small, but if you hang on to it and throttle up, you can really feel the pull.

    now that i think of it why stay electric, as long as it has electric starter (so you can start and stop it on the go w/ a switch) you could probably rig up a gas rc plane or car engine to power the fan and make it blow even harder. bike would look badass too with two gas engines running it, one for propelling the bike and one for the forced air intake.
     
    #17 Mike Hunt, Jul 25, 2009
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2009
  18. Clotho

    Clotho Member

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    I love boost.
    Adding boost to a 4 stroke engine = not that difficult.
    Adding boost to a 2 stroke piston ported engine = very very tough to do. (it has been done tho.)

    One of the best threads on this subject is here: http://motorbicycling.com/f15/my-victa-167cc-turbo-bmx-3556.html

    Essentially the problem is that there are no valves to hold the boost in on a piston ported engine. No valves = no boost.

    It doesn't matter how much air you can move or the pressure you can achieve if it just moves right through.

    It is doable with an expansion chamber but this makes for a super peaky motor. Not something that will work very well on the street.

    This subject comes up in one form or another every couple of months. We should probably write a definitive article that we can point people to so that they can see the hurdles they will have to overcome.
     
  19. bodydropped

    bodydropped New Member

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    a turbo would be a cool idea on these motors. but scrap that idea and think supercharger,turbos rock on other motors but on ours they would basically be pumping hot air in our motors if we even got them to spool,and i dont think that would happen unless maybe we had a jack shaft set up and a whole lot of road.
    now for giggles lets take a tiny turbo i mean little one from a DSM like an eclipse or a talon or an old duster lolol
    remove the hot side the exaust and attach a gear a gear the could be driven by an extension from our clutch shaft gear with an extension. boost or psi would be determined by gearing on the blower and clutch shaft/hot side oiling is not so hard make it a sealed unit by boxing in the hot side of the turbo and keep the fins to aid in oil circulation and run a straight 40 or 50 weight oil in the blower.

    what the heck right give it a shot,but dont forget you may want to look at blow thru carbs cause forced induction is not what kills these motors not even nitrous,nope not at all its poor tuning,that means you need the right timing the correct A/F ratios to get it dialed in, know the motors limits we dont have forged rods or pistons yet so take it easy.ive made stock bottom end 4cyl hondas go from 90hp to the wheels to 210hp with 7psi the key was in the tune. before boosting it get the motor tuned play with the carb the exaust ,port the head if you like try different plugs,then if thats not enough try boost but i hope you have a big budget :D ahh im just rambling now but i really think a belt or chain driven turbo/supercharger is possible on our little motors.
     
  20. Clotho

    Clotho Member

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    Tap. Tap. Tap. Is this thing on? :)

    I will try to paint an analogy to make this concept easier to grasp:

    The balloon has a hole in it. It doesn't matter how good you are at blowing air, the balloon will never inflate. (you will not achieve a boost condition with a piston ported 2 stroke.)

    The hole in question isn't exactly a pin prick. It even has a name. It is called "Exhaust Port"

    You must solve this problem first. You must plug the hole. Until you plug it with something you can blow all day long and you will accomplish diddly.

    Calling it a supercharger was a good start however. At least a supercharger is some form of compressor and not just a fan. Fan's move air very well but they don't compress air very well. Fan's don't blow balloons up very well.
     
    #20 Clotho, Jul 26, 2009
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2009

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